board of governors study session feb. 29, 2016: transcript · pdf filepima community college...
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Pima Community College Board of Governors
Feb. 29, 2016 Study Session
Community Board Room, District Office,
4905 E. Broadway, Tucson, AZ
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Is everyone here that needs to be here?
Okay. Are we recording? Did we ever decide about recording
these sessions? Oh, there we are. Hi. I guess we are.
Oh, okay. So let's call this study session to order, and so we
are very interested in the information being brought to us today in
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the study session from the Arizona Tech Council. It is very
important as part of our mission as a community college that we are
aligned with the business world, and especially when it comes to
tech. We have that responsibility to our community, to our students,
and I am very glad to have you folks here today.
I will turn it over to you to do your introductions and tell us a
little bit about what the Arizona Tech Council is and how we can help
you.
Yes?
>> CHANCELLOR LEE LAMBERT: I asked Lorraine and Ian to help facilitate
and moderate today's conversation. So if you don't mind, I will just
hand it to Lorraine and she will do the introductions and so forth.
>> DR. LORRAINE MORALES: Thank you all very much for joining us today for
this very important meeting. I want to begin first by thanking
Dr. Ian Roark and also Alex Rodriguez for working together so
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closely to coordinate and bring business and industry to the table.
As you all know, we have all been reading locally, regionally,
nationally about the skills gap in all areas for our employment
opportunities for our students.
A couple of years ago we had an opportunity to sit with
individuals from the nursing community, and they shared lots of
really good information to the board about what they are facing in
hospitals and in doctors' offices locally and nationally. We found
that the board learned quite a bit of information from that, so the
chancellor suggested that we pull this type of study session together
for this industry in particular.
So with that, I want to, before we move over for introductions,
I'm going to read a lot of this because I want to make sure that I
get it right. So the Arizona Tech Council is Arizona's trade
association for science and technology for those companies.
The council is recognized for having diverse professional
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business, community, and numerous events, educational forums,
business conferences that bring together leaders, managers,
employees, and visionaries to make an impact on the technology
industry.
The council members work very closely to further the advancement
of technology in Arizona. So this session is an opportunity for you,
as board members, to dialogue with the Arizona Tech Council leaders
and technology companies concerning the economic and workforce
development issues that are very important to this sector.
So for the next hour, we have CEOs, vice presidents here to talk
about their business and industry in the skills gap. We have pulled
together some questions to kind of help with the conversation. We
will probably not get through all of those questions, because all we
have is an hour, but I feel that it's a very good opportunity to at
least get the conversation started and to provide all of you with
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firsthand knowledge of what is necessary to meet the needs of
business and industry and for our industry leaders to have an
opportunity to tell you what is working and what is not working and
have an open conversation about that.
Anything else to add?
>> SPEAKER: Just briefly. I have already had the opportunity to
visit with most of the guests that we have here today. Found it very
instructive and informative, and I look forward to hearing from them
further today as they dialogue with the whole team.
With that, I'd like to turn it over to Alex to begin the
introductions of the guests, and we will go forward with the
questions after that.
>> SPEAKER: And I do have an agenda here that I can share with
everyone so you'll know what we are going to be talking about.
>> MR. ALEX RODRIGUEZ: Excellent. Thank you, Lorraine. Thank you very
much, Ian, Mr. Chancellor, it's fantastic to see you, sir. Board of
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Governors, thank you all very, very much for this wonderful
opportunity to dialogue with each of you. Mr. Clinco,
congratulations on your board role. I believe you're recently
appointed, as well? Fantastic. Congratulations.
So my name is Alex Rodriguez, and I have the privilege of leading
the Arizona Technology Council here in Southern Arizona.
Lorraine, thank you for queuing it up, because I think that
helped summarize a lot of what we will be discussing here.
So in keeping with the agenda, I'd like to introduce our CEOs.
Essentially this is an opportunity for the CEOs and you, members of
the governing board, to dialogue today.
So after their brief introduction here I will dive deeper into
some of the impact and influence and outcomes of the Arizona
Technology Council and then beyond that we go into questions and
dialogue.
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So, Mr. Stewart, introduction?
>> MR. HOWARD STEWART: My name is Howard Stewart. I run a small
manufacturing company called AGM Container Controls. We have about a
hundred full-time equivalent employees, many of whom have either
attended or are graduates of Pima College. We have a very strong
educational reimbursement program at our college, our company, and
for the last two years we have averaged about 24% of our employees
are attending Pima College or other NCAA accredited institutions.
>> SPEAKER: You have Brad Smith on your agenda. He's not with
us today but a few others are here preparing for this dialogue. Phil
Guest?
>> MR. PHIL GUEST: My name is Phil Guest. I work for Securaplane in
Oro Valley. I'm the general manager, been with the company
three-and-a-half years. Prior to June, I was vice president of
engineering and then took over when (indiscernible) was promoted. We
have roughly 170 employees, and we are primarily a manufacturer of
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electronics for commercial and business aircraft.
>> MR. ALEX RODRIGUEZ: By the way, both of these companies have been
multi-multi-award-winning companies in their sectors and their fields
and been recognized certainly by the Arizona Technology Council for
their performance, first of all, and second for their civic and
corporate citizenship, as well.
Doug Rasmussen.
>> MR. DOUG RASMUSSEN: Doug Rasmussen. Formerly with B/E Aerospace, so
currently unemployed. I had the pleasure of leading a business that
was started here in Tucson, grew from about five employees to about
2200 worldwide. We currently, the business has around 850 employees
in Tucson.
So I have seen the workforce development from a lot of different
perspectives, from small business and then from a slightly bigger
business. So I look forward to the discussion today.
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>> MR. MARK HANNA: Why did you decide to base your businesses
here in Tucson?
>> MR. ALEX RODRIGUEZ: That's a great question. I'm sure we will get to
it. Real quickly, I want to recognize a few other folks.
First of all, John Dennis, president and CEO for Strategy1
Consulting Services, a company here in Southern Arizona that advises
businesses governments and nonprofits. Been active with the tech
council, key to having prepped for today.
The other individual that I want to recognize is our own new
staff member who some of you may have seen in the Sunday paper.
Tracy Saldahoop. She's now our new director for Southern Arizona
operations and events, and it's fantastic to have her on our staff.
The other individuals that were involved, as well, include Garrett
Kowolowski from Staff Matters, intimate knowledge of workforce
development in Southern Arizona. As well, Paul D, he's president of
Universal Avionics, and then a broader discussion occurred with the
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aerospace and defense CEO network that these gentlemen participate
in, as well. And in January we had Ian spend time with us at that
meeting and had a chance to dive deep into some of the current issues
at Pima Community College.
To highlight briefly, the role of the Arizona Technology Council,
as Lorraine mentioned, we are the premier trade association serving
the science, technology, and innovation sectors of Arizona's economy.
We are not for profit and member-driven organization. The vision of
the Arizona Technology Council that's set by our governing board, a
body of over 40 leaders across the state, including the for-profit,
nonprofit, and educational sectors of the economy, is to help convert
Arizona's economy as the fastest growing tech hub in the country.
Aspirational, but we are doing good in certain areas and we focus our
efforts to try to move closer and closer to that end.
We have a standing statewide public policy committee, composed by
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our members as well. That's where the formulation of our public
policy aims happens at. We have a paid lobbyist out of Phoenix, and
we enter into the state House and Senate legislation every single
year. Most recently we help and we are behind the scenes on the
JTED, restoration of funds for JTED, very important for our members.
We host over 160 different types of events across the state to
help connect industry. So, for example, Howard Stewart in January,
and his company hosted an after 5:00 mixer where some of you were at
and the idea is to help connect engineers with engineers, business
marketing experts with other business marketing experts and the like.
It's a fantastic way to help galvanize and connect Arizona's tech
sector. With over 800 members statewide, from Douglas to Flagstaff
and sort of everywhere in between.
Some of the key events include Southern Arizona tech and business
expo. We have one coming up in March that focuses on information
technology and cyber security called tech junction, so we are
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constantly evolving our events to meet real world events by our
members.
So I will end there, but I just want you to know that this
opportunity is really about how to help galvanize our regional
economy, particularly here in Eastern Pima County with transformation
opportunities, opportunities for businesses like the ones represented
here today to be able to grow faster or close gaps where there are
significant challenges.
So, Mr. Chancellor, members of the board, we really appreciate
this opportunity and let's go for it.
>> SPEAKER: We actually have a question on the table from our
board president, and so I think that would be the rightful place to
start is for the companies that started here in Tucson, what were the
determining factors for locating in Tucson, and then remaining here.
>> SPEAKER: I don't know that I can completely answer
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Securaplane's reasoning or rationale for coming to Tucson originally,
because that was well before my time. It was I think in the very
early '80s, late '70s, decision was made, the company was started in
Australia and I believe the reason it started here in Tucson was
because of all the aerospace activities going on down by the airport.
And the originator, owner of the company originally started with
security systems because of a need he had to protect his airplane.
He came up with a means of basically creating an alarm system for the
airplane. Started to generate interest, and then relocated here to
Tucson, and then we have stayed ever since. We have actually just
built a new building, we moved in at the end of '14, I believe.
Anyway, so we are here to stay, and so what we needed to grow and
expand. We got rid of our old land and built new.
But as far as the "why," that's about as much as I can answer
specifically about that.
>> SPEAKER: So the business that I came down with a couple of
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other guys to start, we located here because Bombardier was here.
Bombardier. It was completing, at that time, really their Learjets
here. That work has now moved to Wichita. The reason for staying
was momentum. I would say if -- I'm not sure if we were making the
decision today that we would be located here. I think that's part of
what we are going to talk about today.
>> SPEAKER: Our company grew out of a company called Arizona
Gear Manufacturing. I'm pretty sure it's like these other situations
where in this case it was the Hughes aircraft, the fact that it was
here probably had a lot to do with the founding of our company.
As for staying here, for the most part, we are pretty happy here
with the exception, I won't go into it, city council has been
discussing some things recently which give us pause for whether or
not we will be able to stay in Tucson.
>> SPEAKER: One of the roles that I play is that I am a member,
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board member of the Arizona Industry Optics Association. We have
approximately 60 members, cluster members here in the Arizona area.
The reason that they are here is because of the strength of the
optics, of the optics at University of Arizona.
>> SPEAKER: Thank you, John. And so even though we have the
questions in front of us, I'm still going to read from those and I
have heard the answer to this first one, so it's almost rhetorical to
an extent, but I think it's good for all of us. That is where does
workforce development and training rank as a priority among the needs
of your companies, and specifically what are you requiring of today's
talent market? What are you looking for?
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: (off microphone.)
>> SPEAKER: Thank you, sir. So, you know, one of the challenges
that I think we all share in growing our businesses is the human
resource element of it. You can have all the money in the world, but
you really need top talent, and, you know, what we have, what I have
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experienced in my three-and-a-half years at Securaplane, there was a
bit of warm body syndrome going on, you know, where we were hiring
who was available as opposed to who we needed, and there are two
by-products that come from that. One is a loss of productivity and
then the costs associated with rework, okay.
And so, you know, regardless of which industry you're in, there
is a timeline that you need to meet to bring a product to market.
What I found is that we have had to redesign products several times
to get them right.
That's a talent. There is a process component to that. But
there is a talent piece, as well.
So, you know, over the past few years, we have worked fairly
diligently at performance management. You know, the result of that
was that maybe some of the folks that were in the wrong, in the wrong
job, are no longer there, but we left those vacancies. Right now my
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main source of people, which I can't get, is Raytheon, believe it or
not. You know, they have most of the talent that we need. We trade,
okay, but going off, and it's either that or try and recruit out of
state, which is a challenge. As some of you know that have tried to
do that.
I guess -- it's extremely important that we grow. It's a make
versus buy. I'd be more than happy to get college grads and train
them. The challenge is even there. We have had some luck but not
enough. So that's extremely important.
So I guess, you know, what do the employers require? So for us,
we are an electronics manufacturer primarily, so we really need
electrical engineers and technicians with electrical hands-on
training, whether that's some kind of Associate's in applied science.
We tend again to have high turnover in that area because we don't
have the right people for the right job.
>> SPEAKER: I would take maybe a little step back. I'd say the
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biggest challenge for any aerospace and defense company in this
region is hiring technical workers, and people with technical skills.
I would define that across four groups. First general assemblers,
meaning the people doing assembly work at the basic level in your
manufacturing plant.
We struggled to hire people who could read a basic drawing, who
could do math, that is just convert from metric to U.S., who had
basic software skills, even just basic computer skills, said more
properly, who understood the --
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: Like Word and Excel?
>> SPEAKER: Yeah, the ability to get on a system, to be able to
interface with our ERP system, to be able to look up files and
understand the logic of how you go about finding the answer to
something, who understood the significance of a management system and
what their role was in that quality management system and who
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understood basic aerospace and engineering jargon.
That would be my first level, and that's something that I think
Pima Community College could play a huge role in addressing.
The next is machinists, sheet metal workers, and electrical
assemblers, that's maybe the next level up from what I would consider
a basic assembler or technical worker within a business. Along with
that, we'd want to see people who had basic industry certifications.
I think that makes a huge difference if they are willing to pursue
and have those type of industry certifications, and if we had more
time we could talk about why that's important.
And then the next level up from that would be what I would
describe as electrical and software test technicians or
troubleshooters, people who understand things at a systematic level
who can actually be involved, you can send out into the field to
solve problems, and who, within your business, can solve the issues
that come up in the manufacturing business on a day-to-day basis.
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Then finally, engineering. As a business, we ultimately, or I
made the decision to start an engineering operation in India, and we
ended up with nearly 300 engineers in India. It allowed us to
engineer around the clock, that was one reason. Another was it was
much more scalable, much easier to attract and retain engineering
talent in India. There is a lot of cost that is come along with
that, and so in a perfect world wouldn't have had to have done that,
but that was certainly the position we found ourselves in.
I think that was probably -- I think I hit my -- Alex has heard
me give this spiel before, but this is something that I'm passionate
about.
One of the things I thought about is I was thinking about today
is out of those four levels, three of those four, I think, are
primarily directed to technical degrees, what I would consider to be
two-year degrees. I just don't think, as a region, we can have
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enough people who have those type of technical skills. Those are the
bedrock of people who can solve problems that have a technical bent
to them.
I always believed, when I use today do a lot of sales work, you
needed some catchy phrase. My pitch for today is I wish we were here
talking about changing the name of Pima Community College to Pima
Technical College. I say that a little bit tongue-in-cheek, but in
part serious. That idea that I believe that from a community
two-year degree perspective, the thing that will have the most
profound impact economically on this region is going to be technical
education because it is so much more accessible than going on from a
four-year perspective.
>> SPEAKER: (off microphone.)
We basically sought out people with increased levels of
education. It's benefited our company a lot. I have seen our
productivity increase about 75% in the last dozen years.
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I like a lot of what I see from Pima College, but I would like to
see it continue to progress.
>> SPEAKER: Ian, let me add briefly, so essentially as a college
you have many stakeholders, certainly you have the transfer students,
the college bound, four-year bound degrees. You have workforce needs
for those that will go into the workforce right after a two-year
program or technical program, and you have enrichment courses for,
like the one I took, I guess it's been a while, but the point is all
of these are key stakeholder needs from a community perspective.
What I would offer, submit to you today is we need a rebalance to
assure that the workforce needs of our members are met.
Clearly the highest, the two most important priorities that our
members face are access to capital and capital formation issues, cash
flow, money, and the second is the talent that comes with that. You
have got to have the skill, the workforce available in the pool, and
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I will tell you a little secret that happens in this region. They
might not tell you, but they end up borrowing from each other's
workforces very often, and that is not healthy for the overall
economy, right? That's why it's very important to reprioritize to
the extent possible the workforce development component as a priority
for Pima Community College.
We can do two more rapid-fire questions if you commit to
rapid-fire.
>> SPEAKER: I think that Scott's addendum to No. 1 really sort
of covers No. 3, so I will skip No. 3 for now and go to No. 2. Let's
get a little more granular about the skills gap. For the
nonmanufacturers in the crowd, employers often describe the skills
gap between the skill sets of applicants for the jobs in their
companies and the skills required for those jobs. What does the
skills gap look like for your particular company?
>> SPEAKER: So I don't want to be redundant. I think Doug
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really covered most of the similar types of skills that our folks
need, and he brought up a really good point that I didn't touch on.
We do a lot of low-level assembly, okay, and generally, you know, we
train them to do it, meaning reading drawings and, you know, putting
things together, being able to work, do the work instructions
properly.
We don't necessarily have a requirement that, where we are
looking for some type of certificate or level of education at that
level. Now, if we had that available to us, that would be great. It
would save training dollars and rework and be able to kind of have a
little bit of assurance, because we have a lot of turnover. I can't
really emphasize enough how painful that is for our local businesses
to hire and then either terminate for cause or terminate because the
individual leaves for whatever reason. There is a tremendous amount
of turn, and it's very expensive and very frustrating and very
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inefficient.
So from a gap standpoint, I guess I will touch on, you know, a
couple of areas around, you know, we have, in our repair and overall
service, FAA type test technicians, those types of things, where we
could really use skills, that's an area where we have a lot of
turnover, end up going through Aerotek and bringing in people from
wherever we can find them. Also in the quality assurance area is
another place, high turnover. I believe there is some type of
curriculum already within Pima that does have some focus on that, but
that's another area where we have a lot of problems, as well, in
addition to the ones Doug highlighted earlier.
>> SPEAKER: From the perspective of math, it would be really
helpful if people had the ability to do what I would do basic algebra
and an understanding of basic geometry. Those are really important
in terms of the ability to understand drawings and what you're
looking at on a drawing and just the logic that goes along with that.
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And then I suppose the only other thing would be, you know, you'd
like to be hiring people that have the chance to stay with the
organization and grow with your organization.
That would also mean that people, even somebody at a technician
level would have an understanding of what I would call practical
physics. I'd make the pitch that that needs to be taught using
inquiry-based learning, that type of hands-on learning to be
effective at that level.
>> SPEAKER: I don't really have anything to add to that.
>> SPEAKER: I know that Doug was hoping for some time to drill
down on what's embedded in No. 5, so if we could dwell there for a
little bit. That questions reads regarding industry recognized
credentials, licensures and certifications, what is the AZ Technology
Council's members positions on embedding those in college curricula,
what is the ideal CTE and/or STEM education paradigm look like in
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that context for a community college? Industry-recognized
credentials.
>> SPEAKER: So I guess I mentioned it earlier, and I don't
believe that Pima has any kind of Associate's in applied science. Is
that correct?
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: (off microphone.)
>> SPEAKER: More specifically around electronics areas or
Associate's in applied science. I didn't see it.
>> SPEAKER: So currently in instrumentation and electrical
technology and/or megatronics advanced manufacturing, those programs
are being developed under our TAACCCT IV grant program and those are
being developed for Downtown Campus building off an electrical
utilities certificate and degree that was built under a prior grant.
So building off of some work we have done for TEP and Southwest Gas
but now we will be expanding that advisory committee to Scott's
earlier question and bringing in some of these types of companies to
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better inform our E and I program development. Electrical and
instrumentation. It's not on the current, current list
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: Let me address how the tech programs here
at Pima have evolved, particularly under an environment of declining
resources. Political institutions are choice averse, so the tendency
is when money starts getting tight, you start peanut buttering the
resources around. I think that has weakened our technology programs
significantly and some other programs, as well.
We are now taking a look at how we restructure them, how we
refocus them, how we make them more effective, but along with that,
we will have to make some choices about what to do and what not to
do. That's where it always gets a little bit more difficult.
So one of the things we have had over the years is tech advisory
committees that are kind of small and narrowly focused on certain
programs. One of questions that I'd like you guys to think about,
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and the board to think about, is whether or not to have a broader
industry tech advisory committee that isn't married to one particular
industry or one particular technology but, you know, in general,
there are certain things you want out of a laboratory technician or
assembler.
It wouldn't just be the thing Raytheon wants or the thing that
the optics industry wants, or the employer who happens to hire a
bunch of people right away. We want to have a more regular supply of
basic qualified technicians coming up.
>> SPEAKER: I'm going to give you a short opportunity to give
you my story and why that question was important. When I graduated
high school, I didn't know what I wanted to be when I grew up, I went
to work for an electronic manufacturer, sitting in a work cell
soldering wires to circuit cards I had no clue what they did. My
employer at the time had offered, you know, to pay for some classes
at the community college, which I accepted. I did that for
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approximately two semesters, and fell in love with electronics.
So the community college I chose had an Associate's in applied
science and electronics. Okay, great. I will go get a two-year
certificate.
So while I was doing my two-year certificate, I was a year into
it and I learned Purdue University had a transfer program where they
accepted my credits from my community college. At that point I knew
I wanted to finish the Associate's and was fairly certain I wanted to
go on for my Bachelor's. Those are the bread crumbs that I'm talking
about.
So I went to Purdue, I started working towards finishing
Associate's and said, screw it, I'm going go for the Bachelor's. So
I earned 300 of the 330 credits ultimately either through transfer or
with Purdue, West Lafayette.
After that, I was able to gain a job in electronics, did the MBA,
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worked at a bunch of companies, and, you know, 20 years later I'm
running a business.
So the point is is that I believe there is a lot of people in
Tucson who fall into that category of, you know, I'm pretty smart but
I'm not really sure what I want to do when I grow up. The path of
least resistance is a community college where can you go in there,
take courses while you're working, and if you're lucky and you have
some type of transfer program or at least the initiative to finish
that out with the path of moving up, who knows? There is a lot of
smart kids in Tucson. There is a lot of good schools now, right?
They could really use that advantage. That's why it's passionate
to me to be here today. I will get off my soap box, but I thought it
was important to at least give you that perspective.
>> SPEAKER: Could you tell us, tech council's role with our
advisory boards and councils and what's working and maybe what's not
working, because if there are -- what I'm hearing -- some of the
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things I'm hearing today I hope would get resolved at that level if
there are specific needs inside of a program there would be an
opportunity. If there is something not working, could you sort of
explain to us -- I guess it's two questions.
>> SPEAKER: Sure. Well, the first is I welcome very much the
idea. You know, it's up to us to roll up our sleeves and continue to
delve deeper on these issues so that we can have more success stories
like Phil's and several others at similar stature as his have had
very similar experiences.
So, first, we do have 12 standing statewide committees that deal
from anywhere from information technology issues that we are
currently working with Ian, in fact, on tech hire grant opportunity,
exploring that, to women in the workforce, to capital formation, to
entrepreneurship. Across the board we have existing statewide
committees that dive into these issues and they bubble up to the
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respective organizations.
Frankly, when it comes to Southern Arizona, we could do a little
bit better. Essentially what we are talking about here is
fine-tuning the alignment between what's happening in the classroom
and what these guys need on the shop floor every single day in
closing that gap in both directions so that, you know, real-world
curriculum is the norm, is the standard.
So the issue of having outside experts that are in industry every
single day they are seeing what the gaps are and what the issues are
and where the students are when they graduate, I think we could do a
better job at closing that.
>> DR. SYLVIA LEE: One of the questions that I have for our
leaders here today is would it benefit the industry here if we
brought all of you together to help design the curriculum that you
specifically need? And I think we are doing that with customized,
but it sounds like, if I'm hearing you correctly, you all have some
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kind of a baseline need, but perhaps there is specializations in
each. What I don't know is are we in the process of developing
curriculum and attaching it to an Associate's of applied science that
could help you? .
>> SPEAKER: The one thing that I would avoid doing is trying to
make it too specific to a particular industry. I think a lot of the
really critical skills really transfer across most of the businesses,
whether it's optics, could be solar, it could be aerospace, could be
defense. I think there is a Common Core -- sorry. (Laughter.)
I think there are some fundamentals that cut across all of those
things that can be effectively taught and in particular done in the
context of what I would think of as a two-year program.
>> DR. SYLVIA LEE: So would that be helpful if we were to
-- maybe we are already doing that, but bringing them in to help
design that? Maybe our college leaders can answer that.
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>> SPEAKER: So I believe that we have faculty that I think would
benefit from conversations with business and industry about, you
know, the items that you mention here I believe can be embedded in,
as part of the objectives of what we have in our curriculum. But if
our faculty have an opportunity to hear from all of you what it is
that you are looking for, they can share that information with
students about exactly why do I need math? When am I ever going to
use algebra? We have two math faculty that are sitting here that can
use, that can use this as part of the discussion when they are
talking with students.
So I think any time that we have an opportunity to have these
exchanges, it benefits the student, because the more student -- the
more faculty understand what it is that you're needing and where the
gap is, it can be embedded into the curriculum.
We are doing it, to some extent, in bringing in industry to help
us build curriculum. We did that with TEP to build some of those
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credentials. That has been successful. So we can continue with
that.
To your point about not knowing what to do when you grow up,
where are all of you as far as apprenticeships or internships?
Because those would be excellent opportunities for our students to
learn more about what you do and how they would fit in there. That
way the relevance comes back into play when they are back in the
classroom.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: I have something to add on to that, as well.
As a public institution, we have masters, taxpayers we are
responsible to them, the universities ask us to provide curriculum
for transfer, certainly industry tells us, here's what we need, but
let's face it, we are primarily driven by what students want from us.
How do you get the message across to the general public and judge
people in particular about the jobs you have? I mean, I speak as a
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former high school counselor who, some of these jobs I have never
even heard of, maybe I wasn't as well informed as I should have, but
how do you do that? And these apprenticeships would tie into that.
Maybe you could speak to that.
>> SPEAKER: Our company -- I'd like to say that we have
committed to lots of different internships or something like that.
The fact of the matter is maybe about three or four years ago when
the SAMP program got going, the SAMP, Southern Arizona Manufacturing
Program got going. I think we have committed to a total of three
interns over the years. We know there are roughly 35 kids or so in
the program. We know there are roughly 25 or 30 companies involved.
So I have been trying to commit to one each year regardless, for
example, this last summer I didn't really need one, and I took in one
of my machinists and I put him elsewhere in the company where he
could be helpful just to make sure that we, you know, helped out Pima
College in that regard.
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That said, I guess my commitment, although it hasn't been to so
much taking in interns, and I'm unaware of how I could do that
through other programs, by the way, it's been more in terms of
encouraging my workforce to go back to school, you know, on my dollar
effectively to get reimbursed, and I have found that to be extremely
helpful, and I kind of feel like if the program that AGM is using
were used, you know, city wide, county wide, you could probably fill
up all the seats that you have at Pima College, because for us to
have 24% of our workforce returning, taking at least one or more
classes each year, is a testament to the fact that there is a lot of
people who are interested in using education to get ahead.
That's another thing we do is when I see, when people have taken
the time to take courses, I look at that in terms of at the time of
raise reviews and things like that. I would potentially be open to
doing other internship opportunities with Pima College if I was aware
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of such.
>> SPEAKER: To my knowledge, I don't know that we have had any
interns from Pima. We certainly had a number from U of A. In fact,
we have hired several of them since I have been there, and that's
worked out well.
If we had the opportunity to hire some, for some the roles that
we have been discussing earlier, whether it's assembler or
technician, we would absolutely entertain it.
I will tell you something, it's unfortunate but true with some of
the bigger companies and that constraint is that when a company is
looking at head count, the interns count, if you can believe that.
So if they are working less than 50% of a typical period, then they
might count as a partial to none. If they were working full time,
they actually count as a full-time head. Whether they are making
150,000 or 16 bucks an hour. That's just a fact we have to live with
and manage. If it were up to me solely, I'd fill the building with
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them.
But that's just one of the constraints you have in large public
companies, the way they count force. I just want to share that.
>> SPEAKER: I would say we absolutely need many more
apprenticeships and much more by way of internships in this region,
without a doubt. Whether it's life sciences or cyber security or, I
mean, these companies, the technology, transformation that's
happening within our region is phenomenal, phenomenal, but getting
the word out is always a challenge. Inspiring the students in the
pipeline today is not easy, because there is no systematic way of
sort of getting them to see what innovations are happening in their
own backyard, if you will.
And yet we do have programs that we are using to try to get the
word out more, and certainly students are always welcome at all our
events, whether they are these specific after 5:00 mixers, as I
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mentioned earlier, where the companies themselves open their
facilities to provide tours and share the innovations they are
working on, to a whole host of events that we support like the
Arizona science tech festival, thousands of events under that. There
are so many of them.
The key, I think, is helping support the smaller and midsized
companies in our region to take on more apprenticeships and
internships. What I hear from them is bringing on an intern takes on
additional requirements. You have to manage them. You have to
provide the oversight. If you can pay them, then that's budget set
aside, as well. So it's not as simple as one might think to bring on
an intern.
Yet the interesting thing is that once they do actually bring on
an intern, intern performs, they get hooked. They get hooked and
they bring them back semester after semester after semester.
Ours is simply that we have to encourage it much more. The
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University of Arizona through their enrollment, there is one division
that is trying to centralize matchmaking between interns, students,
and companies, as well. And we have played a small role with that.
Perhaps Pima Community College could plug into it, as well, as an
opportunity for Pima College students.
>> SPEAKER: The only thing I would add, I think, is we had
interns both from high schools, San Miguel and did some work with
JTED. All of those were successful. I really think one of the
things that needs to be done is more just to use the term marketing
to high school students about the career opportunities available to
them that are associated with technical or broadly hard science style
focus and going on and just getting -- I don't want to use that
phrase. Going on and getting a two-year degree that is directed to
either technology or to the sciences.
I would always choose to hire a person who has shown the
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commitment to go get that versus somebody who hasn't even if their
skills don't perfectly match up. There's just that critical thinking
that comes from what I think of as the discipline thinking associated
with science, technology, math.
>> DR. SYLVIA LEE: Arizona State has a Baccalaureate in applied
science, but to my knowledge, University of Arizona hasn't gone that
route. One of the things that would help us, because I see some real
opportunities to partner with University of Arizona, especially if
they were to go that route, we could tack on a lot of specific, seems
to me, our two-year associate applied science going directly into the
four-year.
So you all are heavy hitters in this community. If you apply
that kind of pressure on the University of Arizona to not only think
that a Bachelor's is the only way to go, Bachelor's of applied
science would be a tremendous asset in this community.
>> SPEAKER: Boy, I agree with that and the only thing I would
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say is I back that up to junior high or high school. I think we have
to start younger. Not everybody is going to go get a four-year
degree, and you still want to get people hooked into STEM and that
mindset.
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: Demion asked what the Arizona Technology
Council's role in our advisory committees are , and I believe you
don't have a role yet.
I mean, I'm sure you have some members who are, but --
>> SPEAKER: We'd love to and be willing to play but we are
currently not playing.
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: Okay. And I forgot my other question.
>> SPEAKER: Just to your point, I guess I would ask, you know,
maybe it would be appropriate coming down the pike, as we have these
study sessions, for staff to bring forward analysis of how our
community advising committees are operating, and if they are not
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operating as effectively as possible, that we can reexplore how to
ensure that they really -- we have the right complexion of industry
partners to make sure we are really addressing and responsive to
needs.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: I'd like to keep us on time here. We have
some other stuff to cover.
Perhaps Ian, could you maybe summarize some of the things we
talked about, and -- I'm sorry.
>> SPEAKER: I just wanted to kind of piggyback on what Alex had
said about, you know, high school is a great place to start the
marketing, because interestingly enough, I took, they had like it
wasn't shop class but it was electronics, and that's kind of where my
interests started, and then you can see how this progresses. Getting
in there for those kids, there are those kids going to four year,
freshman year, kids could never dream of going to college, and kids
in the middle not sure what they want to do or can't afford what they
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want to do. And getting them in high school interested in Pima and
saying, here is a road map for you if you choose to follow it, it's a
great, great place to start.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Say, we need your help in being specific.
Here's the jobs. You know what makes sense to high school kids? How
much money am I going to make? I'm telling you.
And you guys can do that. I mean, obviously -- yeah. So I would
say that I'm so glad you folks are here. Really opens our eyes to a
lot of things we could be and should be doing, and helpful all
around, helpful for us, helpful for you, most importantly helpful to
our students.
So if we can kind of pull some of this stuff together that we
talked about today instead of walking around, saying that was a nice
conversation, but it never happens, and then put some action, put
something in action, then I would really like to see that happen.
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Anybody else want...
>> SPEAKER: I just want to thank Chancellor Lambert for his
support of pulling this together as well as Dr. Lorraine Morales and
her advice and guidance in this process, and my colleague, Alex
Rodriguez, for the time he's put into this and for each of the CEOs
who are here today, for your time. We know you are very important.
You are the job creators, job sustainers of this region, and we thank
you for taking the time to share what's on your heart and minds with
us with regard to workforce development.
Thank you, board, for your time and for listening and asking
great questions.
>> SPEAKER: President Hanna, members of the board, first of all,
thank you for your service, thank you for being our voice within the
community college.
Chancellor Lambert, the whole team, Ian, Lorraine, we appreciate
this opportunity very much. We are here to stay. We are not going
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anywhere. We are in this, just like you guys, and so we welcome an
opportunity to continue with alignment issues around workforce, and
how to improve our economy overall. Very important piece of the
overall puzzle.
Thank you to the CEOs of the Arizona Technology Council member
companies today, appreciate your time, and thank you again.
(Applause.)
>> SPEAKER: Thank you so much.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: We will take a very short break, and then we
will move on from there.
(recess.)
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Okay, folks. Let's get back together here so
we can try to stay on track. We have a very important subject to
cover here next.
All right. So if we can get everyone back here at the table and
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get started on our next topic, which is extremely important. It is
really the future of our college in almost every aspect our
educational and facilities master plan, so we will wait until Scott
returns here.
Okay. So let's get started here. Our educational and facilities
master plan. Bill, take it away.
>> MR. BILL WARD: Just wanted to let everybody know there is a
time delay so when our team talks or you ask them a question, just
give them a little bit.
We have, for everybody in the audience, we have posted the total
packets that relate to the educational and facilities master plan as
to where we are today, and we have also done an assessment on
automotive. Those are located on the facilities Web page. If you
want to look at it, it's there. Then to let the board know, when
they gave the last presentation, to us, to the executive team, it's
about two-and-a-half hours long. So what we are doing is a condensed
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version so they will be talking for about 30 minutes or so, and then
hopefully you guys have had an opportunity to look at the packets and
stuff that we sent out the other day, and then you can ask your
questions that way.
So, Frank, why don't we get things started. Introduce the team
that's there today. Here is our board of directors. Ready to go?
>> SPEAKER: I can hear you. Appreciate it.
Quick introduction in terms of our planning functions.
>> SPEAKER: (Indiscernible) we are broadcasting on this leap
year from Michigan. I'd like to introduce my colleagues, Michael and
Warren. (Indiscernible).
My colleague from Phoenix, Eddy Garcia. I will keep my comments
brief. We have important content to go through with you this
evening. We last spoke with you in November when we updated you on
not only educational but facility master plan. We expect to cover
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four components of what you received in your board packet earlier.
The first component will be Frank talking about building our
educational master plan. His comments will be poignant and be able
to (indiscernible). Important one for the future of Pima.
Then Michael will be delivering the next one. Geographic
information systems, GIS analysis. Student mapping. What those are
telling us.
Third component will be delivered by Eddy Garcia in Phoenix.
Focused on the Downtown Campus. And then we will go through the next
steps and the schedule (indiscernible).
The sister facilities master plan.
I'm going to go to mute, and we will allow Frank to migrate
through the findings of the educational master plan.
>> SPEAKER: Thank you very much. Well, again, I appreciate the
opportunity to go through some of the analyses that we have done with
the board. From this perspective, I'm going to go ahead and -- I'm
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not seeing any of the presentation at all in terms of the... there
you go. Now I'm seeing it. That's great. Thank you very much.
I'm going to talk through a couple of different components of the
educational master plan process. We were on campus a little less
than a month ago, and during this time, we presented quite a bit of
analyses. From that perspective, the two major components of the
educational master plan were what we call the student educational
services test and the market analysis test. You can see each of the
steps along the way. Again, make it very clear that we are only at
the analysis phase. The next phase in our process will really start
to look at working with the educational master plan committee and
developing recommendations.
When we go ahead to the next slide, last time we met with the
board you had asked us to look at more of a holistic perspective in
terms of industry and population growth. We worked with the Arizona
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office of employment and statistics and also economic modeling
specialists international and basically started to better understand
the differences between Arizona as a state, the Phoenix MSA, Tucson
MSA, metropolitan area. I think it's important all sectors for the
most part had some gains in net job growth in the last year, and you
can see the Tucson growth rate is lower than the overall state in
Phoenix metropolitan statistical area growth rate. I think the other
thing that's important is for the most part, the Tucson growth rate
was revised in 2014 and it's expecting a little bit slower growth
rate in the Tucson area than in the Phoenix area.
Next slide. We also looked at a couple different ways in terms
of the population. So from this perspective, we know, going out 10,
15, sometimes, you know, to 2035, 2040, that the population growth
right now is really going to be about 1.8% to 2.1% per year what is
predicted. When you look at 2015 to 2030, it's roughly about a 21,
almost 22% is what's predicted, that that's a slower population
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growth than what we have seen in the past, and from what we
understand from various demographic entities is simply because of the
immigration from Mexico and lower growth in those particular areas is
suppressing the population in the future.
I should also say that the population projections by age when you
start to look out, that different age cohorts are expected to grow at
different rates. So you can see in terms of the 65 to 74 age cohort
is growing more considerably than the 15 to 19 or 20 to 24 age
cohort. I think the other thing that's important to understand is
that the overall Tucson and the related areas will continue to
increase in diversity. We can look at it in terms of Hispanic and
non-Hispanic populations and predict by 2045 they will almost be
equal.
So we now get into what we call the EMSI gap analysis, and this
is a report that was developed specifically for Pima Community
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College. It tends to be a rather lengthy report so I will only go
through a couple of the tables, but what's important here to
understand from this gap analysis is what we are trying to do
basically look at how this information can help us align programs
with workforce needs.
So from that perspective, EMSI starts out with employment
concentration from industry, that's called the location quotient.
What you see there in 2015 with the green arrows is the established
focus areas for the Tucson, Pima County, with respects to those that
are higher than the national average.
So from this perspective, utilities, real estate, also looking at
administrative and support, waste management, healthcare, social
assistance, government, currently in Pima County are higher than what
we would typically see in the national industries.
Now, I think what's important to understand is that these
particular sectors will be changing in the next 10 years. You can
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see in utilities and also in real estate, administrative and support,
those are predicted, the LQ is predicted to decline over the next ten
years. As some decline, others get larger in terms of construction,
retail, transportation and warehousing, finance and insurance are all
predicted to have a greater sector concentration than what they do
now.
Next slide, please. So these are some of the things that came
out of the EMSI gap analysis. Again, the full report was included in
your materials. What you can see here is what we call the average
annual openings in the next ten years. These are workers with some
college and above. This again is for Pima County.
From this perspective, you can see in terms of the various --
>> MR. BILL WARD: Hey, Frank. One moment. We had a question.
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: Can you go back to the last slide.
>> SPEAKER: Oh, sure.
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>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: One before that. With the green and red
arrows.
Explain to me the green arrows again. Does that mean we have
like, say, bottom line there on government is 1.31, does that mean we
have, you know, 30% more government employees than elsewhere in the
state or elsewhere in the state or elsewhere in the country or do we
have 30% government -- 30% more government openings available? I
just want to make sure I understand what the indicators really mean.
>> SPEAKER: Absolutely. That's a good question. What you see
here, let's take government. What's included in the government right
now is also the aerospace and defense, which is why it's high right
now.
So you can see that in terms of the overall number.
But the LQ, location quotient, is basically when it's 1, it's
basically you have equality with, in this case, not so much with the
state but with industries nationwide. So this information basically
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represents not only the State of Arizona but also all of the other
states, as well.
So from this perspective, I think you're right. These are
relative index numbers, but when you look at it, you could say that
1.31 is roughly 30% higher than a 1. So you can look at that as a
31% greater concentration of industries or sectors or employees in
this particular area in Pima than, say, a national average.
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: Okay.
>> MR. BILL WARD: We had a quick question on that last slide
that you mentioned. If you can go back to it real quick.
A question from the audience. The next one. Go back. To where
it had -- is that supposed to be EQ or LQ.
>> SPEAKER: It's LQ. It's location quotient.
>> MR. BILL WARD: Thank you.
>> SPEAKER: What you're seeing here is basically part of what we
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call the gap analysis. Now, a gap is in essence an undersupply of
completers, and a surplus is an oversupply. In this case you're
seeing the blue bar is actually the gap, the black bar is the demand,
and the sort of the gray area which is difficult to see is the
supply.
So again, you have to refer to the report to get more of a
holistic understanding of this, but from this perspective, you can
see here the top gaps in terms of undersupply of completers.
Now, when you look at this, what it's saying there is that let's
take retail and retail operations that there were just a few of those
types of degrees or certificates, and this information comes from
three years of what we call IPEDS completion data that the EMSI
analyzed. What they are saying is there is a gap of 1347. You can
see the gray bar does start to show up a little bit, especially into
the last three, and that gray bargain is the number of graduates.
The demand is the number of positions or employees needed in that
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particular program or job category, and then the difference between
the two.
So when you look at what EMSI did, there were 96 certificate
programs that they analyzed, 62 of them had a gap between the number
of awards and workforce needs, but then also you can see the programs
with the largest oversupply of completers. I think, first of all,
you have to interpret that information with some caution. You know,
as we go through this, especially when I start to work more with the
educational master plan committee, there are things that obviously
are needed to take into consideration, you know, when you look at
your fire science, we know that Public Safety Institute is just not
training Pima County workers. It's more of a regional approach.
Here with EMSI was to look more at the demand for Pima County. Some
of these particular programs have a broader reach, and reach beyond
the county. So that information, in terms of that gap, is not as
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viable as it would if it was just a program that catered to, say, a
local Tucson area.
So those are some of the things we need to keep in mind as we
move forward.
The next one talks about Associate's degree level programs. You
can see here the EMSI analyzed 54 Associate programs. They said 22
are undersupplying the markets. You can see in terms on the
right-hand side the programs with the largest oversupply of
completers annually. Again, caution needs to be exercised here, as
well.
So when you look at the top gaps, can you see at the top in terms
of the bar graph, administrative assistants, restaurant, criminal
justice, so forth, here you can see how the three work together in
terms of the demand, supply, and the gap.
I think as we move forward, again, the goal will be to put some
what we call reality to this particular analyses, and see how each of
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these programs is serving their local and more regional needs and
take that into consideration as we move forward.
So those programs that did not match with the number of degrees
granted or completions, basically came into areas of opportunity. So
from this perspective, you can see in terms of the number of 2015 and
2025 jobs and projected annual openings, now, some of those are
supplied by Pima's Center For Training and Development. So from that
perspective, when you start to look at these surgical tech and
nursing assistants, there is annual openings there, but they are
currently being filled by programs on the training and workforce
side. Same thing with medical transcriptionists, the reason they are
not showing up is simply because they are clock hour programs as
opposed to credit programs and they are not supplying to the federal
government as part of IPEDS.
You can see right here areas where potential future programs
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could be developed by the college, but again, the next step is to
really start to think through this and understand how the college can
put these in what we call a framework, and then from that framework
start to understand, you know, if there truly is a need in the
community for these particular areas.
When you look at the gap analysis, again, it's one tool of I
think many we are going to have to look at. We also have to look at
comprehensive economic development strategy by the City of Tucson.
We also have to look at the Sun Corridor economic goals, and a
variety of other components that are in play as you move forward.
But from this perspective, and this particular piece of analysis,
there were 86 programs, undersupply market demand. Greatest area
moving forward, you can see biggest gap areas, business, culinary
arts, healthcare programs, and then you can see in the EMSI gap
analysis, they dug a little deeper in some areas and started to
identify jobs, annual openings for some of the more applied
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technologies, and you can see here in terms of mobile heavy
equipment, mechanics, automotive service technicians, bus and truck
mechanics, diesel specialists, when you start to dig down into the
data in the report, it starts to really start to illuminate some of
these positions where I think Pima Community College starts to take
advantage in some of these programs.
I think that's the next step as we start to use this data and
other information that we have gleaned to come back to the campus,
work with the educational master plan committee and really start to
tackle some of these different areas in terms of workforce needs and
supply.
The next piece of this will talk about strategies and best
practices.
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: I have another question.
>> SPEAKER: Go ahead.
Page 64 of 110
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: On the last chart, gap analysis, you have
a number of rows that are highlighted in red. Explain what that is.
>> SPEAKER: Those are simply pointing out some of the areas that
have a rather robust number of annual openings that are programs, for
the most part, that I think are potential opportunities for Pima
Community College.
So understanding that there is automotive service technician and
mechanic program right now but there is still again demands in that
area I think when we get into this a little further, start to look at
the diesel engine specialist as well as mobile heavy equipment there
are some possibilities there, as well.
Aircraft mechanics and service technicians, aviation program does
an excellent job with that. There is continued demand for this.
This just helps us to understand where some of the applied
technologies and so forth can be.
I think you're also seeing on this particular analysis that
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carpenters, plumbers, structural iron steel workers, that this
construction component is viable and that Pima Community College I
think has an opportunity there in working with various partnerships
to begin to understand how they can deliver more of those students to
the marketplace.
Any other questions? Great.
Let's go ahead and move on through some of the other material.
The next piece of this is what we call a program strategy or
framework, and there was a reference in the request for proposal to
basically look at developing a strategy framework for how new
programs are placed or distributed among the various campuses.
So one of the things that we did was that the institution, Pima
Community College, has a variety of peers in what we call comparison
institutions, so we went out and looked at how programs are
structured on each of those different campuses.
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I should also say that there is quite a bit of research
literature out there with regards to how programs are distributed in
a multicampus environment, and you can probably realize that a lot of
the community colleges around the country have multicampus components
in understanding how programs are basically placed on those
particular campuses is something that needs to be also reviewed.
So in essence there were three different strategy frameworks that
in essence we used or currently use. The focused that you see on the
left-hand side, you can see in terms of what that is basically that
programs are exclusive to each site with little overlap. When you
look at the various other colleges, they are very similar in those
particular areas.
The middle, centers of excellence, this is a framework strategy
that is employed by numerous community colleges across the country.
Two that were studied in depth were in Cleveland and St. Louis
Community College. You can see some of the key areas here. If you
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really start to look at this, the centers of excellence I think is
not only a research model, it's a national model. It has widespread
recognition in terms of programmattic offerings and so forth.
The last one on the right-hand side is what we call distributed.
This is in essence the case from Central Piedmont Community College,
El Paso Community College, and what you can see there are similar
programs concentrations are distributed on different campuses. This
is good for what we call program progression, program access, so from
that perspective, you may have a slightly different business emphasis
on two or three different programs, and then develop a full
contingency of business programs on each of those different campuses.
So that again is a proposed strategy framework. It's something
that we are going to have to look at and address in more detail when
I come back to campus to really understand if this applies to Pima
Community College but more importantly if this makes sense,
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especially as we look at how to look at programs in the future.
The next piece of this is what we call a program strategy
framework. This comes directly out of the literature on community
colleges, especially multicampus systems.
So the question that this answers is, you know, how are new
programs, how can they be integrated into existing program structure.
So there is really two ways that research says that institutions can
do that. One is we call the vertical program extension and the other
is horizontal extension. This comes out of operations and marketing.
So I think this is pretty much an application of some operational
concepts that are very powerful in business. So vertical program
extension is very similar to what you have for aviation technology.
You have a core program and underneath that core program you have
basically various facilities, faculty expertise, and you see each of
these mechanics, airframe, powerplant, all taught in the same
facilities, in some cases by the same faculty, but more important
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there is a cost savings there because there is ability to share space
and faculty expertise and so forth.
Now, when you get to a program, a horizontal program extension,
it's a little bit different. The example I have here is for
healthcare programs, allied health programs. You can see for each
one of these, this represents an occupational cluster. Each of those
programs requires specialized equipment, training, faculty expertise,
more difficult to share equipment and physical resources. So if
you're going to add on to that group, it's going to be more expensive
because more than likely you need more specialized equipment, a
laboratory, you have to hire faculty with expertise in a given area.
So again, these are just, at this point, ideas about how we could
take some of the programs at Pima Community College and especially
existing programs but more importantly any new programs and integrate
them into the existing framework.
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The next page, this is an example of vertical extension. Can you
see here in terms of digital and creative arts. This was very
popular and still is very popular. A lot of community colleges have
vertically extended creative arts. A lot of those in essence end up
being what we call stackable credentials or certifications. You can
see that in this particular perspective, this is also good for
continuing education. Faculty tend to cluster in some of these
areas. They tend to be knowledgeable and can teach in more than one
of these areas, so your existing faculty can incorporate quite a few
of these into their current curriculum.
And then the good thing here is that there is some shared
resources, greater use of the facilities.
So some of the things can you do in a gaming animation lab you
can also do with digital video, mobile publishing. They pretty much
use the same types of resources and equipment.
As we move forward, one of the things we will do is we are going
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to start to look at each of these different program and campus
strategies, vertical and horizontal extension and start to apply
these to the six locations plus the 29th Street public safety and
emergency service center and see if we can make sense of this
framework, see if we can help to make decisions with regards to
current programs at Pima as well as any new programs that come out of
the analysis.
At this point, again, we are still at the analysis phase and we
are simply just presenting some key concepts and ideas. Next time we
come to campus, we will really start to dig into some of those ideas.
The last piece of this is what we call a best practices, and what
we were asked to do was to go out and look at other community
colleges with respects to programs and in this case it happened to be
best practices and student services. Can you see right there that
the institution in our group basically looked at ten institutions.
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You can see in terms of some of the different characteristics. There
was a requirement for the most part that the FTE and head count in
terms of multicampus system, also in terms of Hispanic Latino
population, and we also looked at the percent below poverty and
whether or not they were Hispanic-serving institution. We developed
the survey with the student services group as well as Dolores and her
group of academic folks. From this perspective you can see in terms
of some of the results of that. I'm not going to go into detail, but
this was a 45-question survey, so I think we have pretty much the
full analysis in the overall presentation, but here you can see
results in terms of student orientation and testing.
And then the next slide gets into some of the advising systems,
especially as it relates to early warning systems, early alert, and
then also types of employees working in services. Here you see in
terms of educational level and professional development
opportunities. Again, it's a fairly lengthy survey, and we are
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basically continuing to work with that, as well.
The last piece of this is integration with the campus master
plan, and here we are starting to understand in terms of the various
facilities. You know, overall how much space would be needed in the
future, given what we are doing.
So what this says is basically in fall 2010, if you look at the
black arrow, you will see a graph that basically says fall semester
FTE, and then you see assignable square feet per FTE. This curve you
see in these little squares is in essence the relationship between a
campus's FTE and their what we call assignable square feet per FTE.
In fall of 2010, Pima Community College had over a million square
feet, almost 20,000 FTE, and basically in essence about 51 assignable
square feet per FTE. In that case, if you see the dark arrow where
it says PCC fall 2010, you were in essence a little bit below the
average.
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Now, what's happened between fall of 2010 and fall 2015, is that
the institution in essence has lost about almost 47, 48% of its
full-time equivalent enrollment. So if we now look at fall 2015 with
existing facilities, we are at about 71 square feet. Red arrow, the
average is roughly about 65. So if we multiply that 65 by that FTE,
it comes up, as you can see there in the bottom, 876,000 assignable
square feet. So I think what we are saying is that there is
potential surplus at this point in time of about 136,000 assignable
square feet. That's in essence between the campuses, between the
District Office, and the other facilities that Pima Community College
uses.
Now, again, this is a very preliminary analysis, and the goal is
to again work through the master plan and look at new programs and a
variety of other things and start to see, you know, what will happen
from that perspective.
But this has to be considered in sort of our strategy as we move
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forward in terms of we've got space on the campuses. We know that.
Some campuses have more space than others. But what we are saying
here in essence is that there is opportunity in most campuses to do
new programs and other things that are going to need to be done
through the educational master plan. In essence, this really test
that is theory and basically it says yes, there is space. It may
have to be retooled or repurposed, but there is space on the campuses
within the district to do some new things that they are not currently
doing.
So the next piece of this is what we call a GIS analysis, and I
know Michael will take the lead on this. This is another piece of
the puzzle, so to speak, in the overall analyses for the educational
master plan.
>> SPEAKER: Thank you, Frank. So what we are looking at is data
that is typically kept in spreadsheets and what we have done is taken
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that data out of the spreadsheets and we have geocoded it and
projected it on to a map of Pima County. Here is the majority of
Pima County here. What you see labeled are the six campuses of Pima
Community College. You also see a lot of blue dots. These blue dots
represent each of Pima Community College's students. So we took the
fall 2015 enrollment data and we were able to map 97% of those
students.
When we had this data, we were able to break it down by certain
attributes. The first attribute we will look at is what campus these
students are attending. We are looking at West Campus here, and each
red dot that you see is a student that attends West Campus for one
credit or more.
I want you it notice there is not much of a geographic trend
here, right? These students are coming from all across the region.
They are not just coming from around West Campus. Similarly, when we
look at the Downtown Campus, we see these yellow dots, these are
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representative of Downtown Campus students. They come from across
the region. West Campus and Downtown Campus are centrally located
campuses. They are sort of regionally easier to access. But they
also offer a multitude of courses that are not offered elsewhere that
draw students to them.
We see a different story when we start to look at these
peripheral campuses. East Campus students, you can notice there is a
strong cluster of students around the East Campus. East Campus is
isolated. There is not another campus within 10 miles of it. So
this is likely the cause for what we are seeing.
When we look at the Community Campus, we see much of what we saw
for West and Downtown Campuses. In that students don't necessarily
seem to be coming directly from an area adjacent but from across the
region. Also, it's important to note that many of Community Campus's
students are taking their courses online, so they don't necessarily
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have to be adjacent to the campus.
Looking at Northwest Campus, similar story to East. This is
isolated, not another campus within eight miles. We see students
coming from the north to the Northwest Campus. And we see with
Desert Vista, it's in South Tucson, we see many of the students
coming from South Tucson. Just to summarize, Pima Community College,
from what we have seen, has three peripheral campuses that seem to
serve its specific subregion of Pima County well and three that serve
the community at large well.
So we also broke the data down by what academic program or major
the student is in line to achieve. So we looked at programs that
were of importance to the educational master plan, one of those being
the automotive program. If you look at the yellow dots, we are
seeing automotive students are coming from across the region. This
tells us that if a student is taking automotive course, they are
willing to somehow travel to the Downtown Campus. Also, the Downtown
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Campus is a centrally located campus, but from a geographic
standpoint it seems to make good sense to host the automotive campus.
Similarly, hotel restaurant students, green, and culinary arts
students, pink, we are seeing these students are willing to travel to
the campus that they need to to take the course that they desire to.
And likewise with the health related and public safety students, with
the exception of a slight clustering of health related and public
safety students, we are seeing these students again are willing to
travel to the campus that they need to.
We just looked at student data. We also pulled census data, so
what we are looking at here are not necessarily Pima Community
College students but everyone within the region, and the first piece
of census data that we looked at was the ethnicity breakdown within
the region and it became clear quickly that there was a strong divide
in this region of where Hispanic and Latino residents live compared
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to other ethnicities. It's almost Interstate 10, you can see in the
top middle of the screen, it goes down to the right and to the
southeast, it's almost a line in the sand that divides this region.
Of course this is going to have a bearing on the student body makeup
of each campus. When we look at Desert Vista Campus, it's in a
strong Latino region, we see one out of two of those students are
Latino compared to Northwest Campus where just one out of four are.
We also looked at the educational attainment of residents in the
area. What you are seeing is a gradient of dots. Green dots are
those who have highest educational attainment in the region. These
are folks with Bachelor degree or higher, and then moving on down to
yellow, orange, red, red being less than high school graduate, and if
you squint at this chart you can see a geographic gradation across
the county. It's also important to note that 40% of the residents in
this area have no more than a high school graduate or equivalency,
and this is really a prime target audience or customer base for Pima
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Community College.
We also looked at the poverty levels throughout the region, so
14% of residents within this region are in poverty, and those are
mapped in pink. If you, again, if you squint at this you can start
to see areas of poverty. Just east of Desert Vista Campus, just
north of the Downtown Campus, and I want you to focus on where these
areas are, because as we switch to the next map, which is actually
the grade point average of your current students, we don't see a
correlation. We saw in the last map there are areas of poverty in
this region, but according to this map of your students, we are
seeing that for the most part students in areas of poverty are doing
fairly well, at least as well as students, other students throughout
Pima Community College.
>> SPEAKER: So wrapping up this quickly, you can see the bullet
points there. We know that the county population is basically
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growing a little slower and becoming older and more diverse. That's
an impact on enrollment growth. We know that the industry sector
concentrations are changing and that will change program demand the
next ten years. We also know there are gaps between the program
completions and the workforce needs, and when we talk to EMSI, these
are the bullet points, three things that they typically see across
community colleges. You can see there in terms of the mismatch,
longer duration of programs, reputation programs, relevancy in
courses. Again, we look at that through the lens of Pima Community
College, but those tend to be the reasons why programs supply and
demand are not more in sync. Michael just talked about the GIS
analysis in terms of campus location, some of the different
demographics, the poverty, income, educational attainment, et cetera,
and basically that information will help us understand that each of
the campuses is different, and may require different levels of
academic support and may require different programs than what are
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currently there. 5 looks at program framework in terms of how to
align programs between campuses and No. 6 looks at student services'
best practices. Again trying to understand what that information
means as we move forward.
>> SPEAKER: I'm going to go ahead and take a look at the
automotive study...
>> MR. BILL WARD: I want to let the board know Dolores would
have been here but she is very much under the weather. She may be
listening. Good. I just wanted to let you know that.
>> SPEAKER: Thank you.
So the next piece is the automotive study, and maybe it was the
luck of the draw, but when you look at all of the things you have
heard thus far between the gap analysis and where students, how they
approach and seek destination programs throughout the district, this
is a pretty good example of how this could all be a culmination of
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what the future can drive, and what one particular program, how it
can impact one particular campus.
So moving to the next slide, what we did was we took a really
high level approach to the automotive program in whole, and we did
meet with the dean, Greg Wilson, a few times to talk through his
program and talk a bit about his vision.
So we came up with three big things, and this is sort of the big
takeaways, and everything after this helps begin to shape the
physicality of what that could be in the future. The big vision
right now is to be a far more competitive program than ever before.
Comprehensive in the sense that it's got to be linked with today's
world and what the needs are from the original equipment
manufacturing and partners. That's the big automotive groups.
Secondly, it was also an opportunity to boost enrollment. I
think it's currently 540 students now but we are talking about up to
700, maybe 800 students. Beyond just taking a class or two but
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looking at or exploring the entire automotive technology courses that
can be held, maybe looking at broadening those courses to include
collision, diesel could be a potential, and looking at alternative
fuels.
On the sort of nontraditional path is looking at how other
technologies can be aligned with it since it's also part of the
building and science technology program on the campus.
So maybe looking at opportunities of design fabrication,
prototyping, instrumentation and so forth.
And really looking at the teaching environments to help evolve
that, so not only that you need to look at newer technologies overall
but increasing the teaching environments to include a broader range.
And a strong desire to stay in the Downtown Campus.
Some of the things we looked at was to do benchmarking, so Frank
was also involved with this, as well. Took some time to look across
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the nation and looked at several other community colleges, Sinclair,
Northwest, so forth, Glendale Community College in Phoenix, which is
part of the Maricopa system.
Looking at industry partners, when you start to look at Ford,
Chrysler, GM, et cetera, each one of them has a specific program, and
with that comes a specific set of needs and requirements from a space
standpoint. As we start to look through all of these different
programs, we came away with an area of 28,000, 35,000 assignable
square feet of area which had included a variety of spaces. Included
program that had classrooms, showroom pieces, faculty offices,
vehicle bays, specialty labs and student amenities amongst the few.
When you start to think about the ingredients I just mentioned,
it gets pretty large. So we picked as an average about 20,500 square
feet as a benchmark to think about your program and shaping it to be
where you'd like it to be in the next ten years.
The color codes you see there are actually just the ingredients.
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That's essentially a raw automotive program minus diesel and special
like small engine and alternative fuels. That's just to get you in
the ball game. That's just for today's purposes.
When you go to the next slide, this is adding in what the diesel
component could be. That's 22, 23,000 square feet to a program. Now
you're starting to see some pretty sizeable square footage dedicated
to these programs, again, looking at the gap analysis and looking at
where the future lies, could be necessary, could be looked at a
couple different ways, but at least you get an idea of how big a
facility like this could be.
To help with that, the next slide starts thinking about the
environments. Regardless of what you do, even though it's an
automotive instructional facility, and it's associated with the
building technology facility on Downtown Campus, you still need to
think about the student environments overall, whether outdoor spaces,
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opportunities for informal learning, cafe or lounge, the quality of
the spaces are key. This is just a way of reminding of not just the
physical impact but also the student environment itself.
Next slide. How does this all begin to shape up? Well, in this
study, we weren't set out to do a design. This was just meant to
give you an idea of the magnitude of what a competitive program in
scale size would be. What you're seeing, couple options on how you
could do this. Option A is just an idea of more of a linear process
of bringing a vehicle in, sort of a main corridor, various bays on
either side of the corridor, you can go to alternate bays, or purple
and white blocks, that's the automotive diesel, and collision areas,
so you can begin to see a threshold between those programs and how
they sort of separate themselves but could be combined together.
Option B is just more of a compact version of the same thing.
This is modeled a little bit like the Glendale Community College, but
essentially the same program. Can you see there is a lot of parts
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and pieces. When you scale them up you get a pretty sizeable
facility.
The next slides begin to show how a footprint can impact the
campus. Taking those blocks and pieces and just placing them on your
campus, we took four options to show you today of what the impact
might be. You can notice by the arrows and you can get a sense of
direction where vehicles would come in, visibility, access, and where
the front door might be. In this case, this is located just to the
north of the science technology building. The opportunities, site
impacts are huge towards draft, it could potentially could cut off
your circulation, internal mall between the old Roosevelt piece to
the science and tech building but nevertheless you get a sense of the
impact of the site. This would just give you an idea what the impact
can be on the campus. The next option is more of a compact version
of what that could be, saving a parcel of land.
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I should preface, too, all these examples we are showing is not
to show you an answer or a solution. Part of what's going to happen
in the next steps down the road on the master plan is thinking about
these things, but this is essentially a study that will help inform
that framework when we get to that.
In this case, you can see how the impact of circulation would be
if you took half a parcel versus two parcels, still saving room for
future development, a lot of visibility, but again have to work with
some circulation.
Next slide shows another option of taking 50,000 square feet
footprint, these are large buildings, very much of a warehouse-type
looking of footprint.
But in this case, it's showing an idea of where the building
could be much more centrally focused to the central part of the
campus, still driving a lot of student engagement between the other
classroom buildings, education facilities, and then looking at this
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as an opportunity for, you know, looking at the western side of the
campus and beginning to extend it more to the west, maybe moving the
center of the campus maybe more to the west.
The last slide is an opportunity to maybe take a look at the
existing parking lot that you have now, although you'd have to move
the solar parking covered spaces now, but it's an opportunity to
think about, and again, the impact of this building would be quite
large.
Again, this was just a study. It's not a solution. It just
gives you an idea of the impact of what one particular program,
destination program, could be on this campus.
Then finally, the last slide gives you an idea of the cost. This
is just a rough order of magnitude. We did get the professional
input of a local Tucson cost estimator to give you a feeling for
apples to apples of what the market could bear. Something of this
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size of a 50,000 square foot building, you can see the numbers.
You're just north of 10 million.
But again, this is just in today's dollars. It gives you an idea
of what a competitive program in today's dollars might be like.
That's the automotive study.
>> SPEAKER: Excellent. Thank you. In terms of next steps we
are nearing the midpoint of the project, and I'd like to highlight on
the last two slides, essentially the steps taking place over the next
few months. From an educational master plan perspective, we will be
working with a committee to review the analysis that we shared with
you today and outline a few of the recommendations from this as far
as opportunities for student success, retention, as well as space
needs and future program recommendations.
One item I'd like to highlight, March 28 and 29 we will be
holding student services best practice forum. Frank will be leading
this, and there is invited guests that's coming in who will be
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working with Pima Community College on student services best
practices.
If we go to the next slide, you can see the master plan schedule.
Frank will be nearing completion of educational master plan in late
March/April. At that time the facilities master plan will be ramping
up again, taking the recommendations that have come out of the
educational master plan and beginning to develop a series of
recommendations from more of a physical campus master plan side in
late spring in order to have a completed master plan to share with
you in late summer, sort of July/August time period.
With that, I'd like to turn it back over to you, Bill, and open
it up to any questions and discussions.
>> MR. BILL WARD: Thanks. I want everyone to know and the
audience when we talk about we are looking at, facilities, we are
looking at everything, all sites, looking at District, M&S, the
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satellite centers, all that.
Open it to the board for questions.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Thanks, Bill. Thanks, folks. This is very
extensive report, lots of information here.
I have a couple of questions just right off the top and then will
pass this along to my colleagues. No. 1 is I was concerned about the
comparison community colleges you used. You matched us in size and
racial makeup, but those colleges from just my quick perusal of them
aren't necessarily the most forward-thinking, highly-rated community
colleges, the kinds of win the Aspen Award, those kinds of things.
I would ask in the future that when you do some of these
comparisons that you not only look at size and similarity but also
the colleges that have really been recognized for their programs in
terms of moving forward and doing a really good job.
That would be important to me.
I also noticed that we just, just before your presentation, we
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had a presentation from folks from what's called the Arizona Tech
Council, and in the categories listed in your presentation, I don't
see a whole lot of tech stuff. There is some, but I don't see a
whole lot of disparity in workforce needs in the tech area.
So there is a lot of blue collar jobs which, that's what we need,
we understand that, but I'm just wondering what's going on in the
tech sector in our particular area and is there an issue there?
I think -- oh, one other question. I will be done here. I'm
assuming that you'll do some of these actual floor plan or design for
some of the other programs, as well? Besides automotive in the
future? Did you get all that?
>> SPEAKER: Yes. I guess in terms of floor plans, the
automotive was a special study I think that had a fee associated with
it. Typically in a master plan we are not getting that deep into
that particular analyses. The space needs analysis will basically
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talk about the amount of space needed. I'm not sure that it will
evolve to a floor plan, but it certainly will talk about the total
amount of space and the capacity needed to incorporate those programs
into the program mix.
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: One of your questions was you don't see a
lot of tech. Part of that is because aerospace and defense, which
fundamentally government funded is under the government category. It
is in their charts.
>> DR. SYLVIA LEE: First of all, I just want to thank all of you
that put all this work into this, because it's a very thorough
document, very well done.
I do have a couple of questions, and it was the slides that
talked about the certificates with the workforce needs. It said 62
have a gap between the number of awards and workforce needs.
So the question that I had, because I'm not quite sure, is that
I'm assuming that that is -- is that a combination between under and
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over? What is the gap on that one?
I don't know what page it is. It's just the EMSI gap analysis.
Figure 2.1.
>> SPEAKER: Yeah. Basically there are -- a gap is basically
where there is, when you look at it, let me get to that information,
a gap is an undersupply of graduates, a surplus is oversupply based
on you can see here in terms of some of the analyses. Michael, if
you go back a few more, can you see in essence this is the workforce
needs for Associate's degree level.
When it says that 22 are undersupplying the market, basically of
those 54 associate programs, that there is more demand in the
workplace than there are graduates for those particular programs.
That's in essence what undersupplying it is. That's in essence
what we call a gap.
So I think, first of all, when we look at this, you know, the
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graph you're looking at right now looks at administrative assistants
and secretarial science. Can you see the gray bars, supply, black is
the demand and the blue bar is what we call the gap, the difference
between supply and demand.
So one of the things you have to keep in mind is that many of
these jobs do not require a certificate or degree. Some of these
jobs can be basically completed by students that either have a high
school degree, can do on-the-job training, a variety of other things.
My guess is there is probably some high school students currently
working in some of these different areas.
So that has to be taken into consideration. I think what's
important as we move forward and start to really dig in and interpret
this analysis is of that gap, what is the true demand for those jobs
that have a livable wage and then do require some type of
postsecondary education to basically get into the workforce?
So from that perspective, I think you're going to see a little
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bit different results. But, you know, overall I think this analysis
is really designed to say that there is some needs in business and
industry and the college probably needs to better align themselves
with some of those different areas.
>> DR. SYLVIA LEE: You mentioned something very important. I
didn't know if I saw it in here. You just said that our actual
certificates and degrees and aligning those with the needs in our
region, I didn't see that in there. Or did I? Because this one, as
you said, are all of the -- they don't necessarily need a degree or
to do this, but will you be doing analysis of what we actually offer
in both the associate and certificate level and what are the job
prospects now and in the future?
>> SPEAKER: Yes, that's basically what most of this is. This is
your data with, in this case, data that's projected out 10 years in
terms of what's going to be needed in business and industry and
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employment.
Now, with that said, I think what I was trying to communicate was
in essence that there's got to be some sifting through the data to
make sure that when we talk about some of these areas that we are
going to have an opportunity to make sure that if we are going to
basically educate students in these different areas that it can be a
viable wage and then second that this is a job that will attract
students to these particular areas and get them some training to go
out and earn a livable wage
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: As I look at the data, when there is that
huge of a gap between supply and demand, there is usually something
else at work like some kind of price elasticity or something like
that, because normally supply meets demand unless there is some other
constraint, and, you know, those jobs may just pay so poorly or the
minimum wage that you have to pay them is so much higher than the job
is worth that they will go unfilled.
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>> SPEAKER: Yes. Yeah, there is a lot of things going on. If
you look at the restaurant culinary and catering management, manager,
there is a huge gap there.
So I think from this perspective, the next step is to really
start to dig into some of the data. You know, the good news is that
EMSI report breaks all these occupations down. These are larger
categories, but within the administrative assistant category there is
a variety of jobs. In this case, working with the data for years and
years, that category comprises probably about 10 to 15 different
types of occupations.
Some of those occupations require postsecondary occupation. Some
they just require high school diploma.
Once we start to pull out some of these, we can start to, you
know, compare more realistically what may be opportunities for the
college.
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>> MR. DEMION CLINCO: Could you talk about the method? I was a
little surprised by seeing the registered nurses was the number one
oversupply when we have a critical shortage in our region and state.
So if you could give us some information on the method in how we are
creating an oversupply.
>> SPEAKER: Well, that's interesting because it's trying to
match supply and demand. What it doesn't take into account is
basically some of those registered nurses will go on and get their
Bachelor's, they will move out of the area and go into various other
fields.
So from that perspective, the registered nurse category is taking
into consideration, there are so many jobs and so many graduates, and
in this case, they are not matching.
But I think, as everyone knows, registered nurse, basically
registered nurse has lots of opportunities. From that perspective,
those programs, those students don't have to go directly to a
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hospital or clinic. They can basically further education, do a lot
of different things. Those are the types of things when we talk to,
you know, the nursing factor if we talk to the dean of allied health,
we can probably get a better perspective of why there is, why the
information is saying these particular things.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Okay. Any further questions from the board?
>> MR. SCOTT STEWART: It would be helpful, I think, if you had
one of those categories, any one of them, I don't care which, that
had some actual specific jobs that would highlight the supply and
demand issue a little bit better. These broad categories, it's just
very difficult to connect with the data.
>> SPEAKER: Yes. I wholeheartedly understand that and agree.
So in fact the material we are working on right now basically
will be coming back to campus next week, next Tuesday and Wednesday,
and in this case we are going to be looking at a little bit different
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components. This is where we are starting to look more at the
individual data instead of these very large types of program
clusters, we will start to dig into the data more realistically.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Again, a timeline for when this next, the
final recommendations will be made, or what's the next step?
>> MR. BILL WARD: What they will be doing is we are thinking
about probably two more of these study sessions, or if more than
that, we will have them, but the goal would be to have this project
totally completed by the end of this summer.
I think the facilities master plans a little further along than
the educational master plan, but as soon as we catch the educational
master plan up then I think the team will be able to apply the
educational to facilities, all of it together. That's our goal is to
have this project completed by the end of the summer.
>> DR. LEE LAMBERT: I just wanted to answer one of the points
you made about the list of schools. So El Paso Community College is
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viewed as a leading community college. I don't want you to think
that all that list isn't comprised of some leading community
colleges. Also, Kahoga, they are doing interesting things,
especially as you look at that older demographic. We can learn from
some of these colleges that -- I started looking some of them up on
here. Just to be aware of that. But also trying to do a size
comparison becomes important, because some colleges, they have the
advantage of being smaller so they can be more nimble and more
focused in certain areas, and so trying to compare our automotive
program to Shoreline, you can't compare them. Any of those programs
don't match to Shoreline. Shoreline is not the size of some of these
schools, either. So you have to keep that in mind.
>> MR. BILL WARD: One other thing I would add and I'd like to
ask the planning team, aren't most of these colleges up here Hispanic
serving institutions?
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>> SPEAKER: Yeah, this was the very first question that was
asked by the board this evening and I'm good we didn't appropriately
answer it. Actually, the first cut we did at this had a very
different cross-section of institutions on it. It did include a
handful of Aspens to institutions, colleagues of yours. I think the
critique came back were not matching what is happening at Pima with
what's happening in our benchmarking.
So, chancellor, to your point, we matched it with urbanity, the
scale of the host city, enrollment size, FTE and head count, overall
size, graduation rates, and then perhaps one of the more important
measures was the Hispanic serving institution status. That's the
genesis of this list.
>> SPEAKER: That's correct. And you're right, Doug. When we
presented a first cut of this based on what we thought was some of
the more innovative community colleges, especially the Aspen Prize
winners, the committee and some of the faculty basically said that's
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not where they wanted to go.
So this list was created with Pima Community College faculty and
the educational master plan committee. It's a little bit different
list than we would have developed, but there was good rationale for
that, and especially as it related to, like you said, Doug, the his
component was very important, but also, they felt that the poverty
level, because it is so high in Pima County, that that was also a
significant factor. Some of the institutions that we had proposed,
especially ones that were very innovative, Santa Fe college, Aspen
Prize winners, had very different demographic makeups, ethnicity and
the areas. Santa Fe college near Gainesville, it's a feeder to
University of Florida, so from that perspective, there was a concern
that we weren't comparing directly with some of their key components
of their student population.
>> DR. SYLVIA LEE: Is it worth looking at, too, you look at the
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graduation rate in Pima at the 150%, we are at 10%, but what is the
actual transfer rate? Because again, a lot of our students move on
and don't get that degree.
>> SPEAKER: Yes. I understand. You know, we have a variety of
different factors that we put up here. One is the transfer rate. We
can also do other IPEDS factors. This is the one that the committee
decided was most important, but, you're right, there are other
factors we can use to compare these institutions.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: I agree with all that, and obviously if the
committee felt that this was more comparable list, but I would just
cautious that, you know, we can reach and especially when we come to
student services and best practices that just because we match up
better with some of these schools doesn't mean that there aren't
other things we could be doing we could excel at. I would cautious
to take a look at some others, as well.
>> SPEAKER: Absolutely.
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>> MR. MARK HANNA: So unless we have any more questions for
those folks, we very much appreciate this information. It's really
helping us shape the future of Pima Community College. I feel very
grateful that we have, we're able to have this type of information to
be able to make decisions that we have to make come up very quickly
in terms of our future and what's the best for our community and most
importantly or students.
We very much appreciate your input and the work you've done on
this and look forward to what's coming next.
>> SPEAKER: Thank you very much. Appreciate it.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Thank you.
>> CHANCELLOR LEE LAMBERT: Thank you.
>> MR. MARK HANNA: Unless we have anything else, we are
adjourned.
(adjournment.)
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