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Joint School Board and Board of Supervisors CommitteeJuly 10, 2008 at 4:00 p.m.

Board Room1 Harrison Street, S.E., Leesburg VA 20175

Members present: Sally Kurtz – Chair, Tom Reed – Vice Chair, Susan Buckley (Sugarland Run District Supervisor), Jim Burton (Blue Ridge District Supervisor), John Stevens (Potomac District School Board), Priscilla Godfrey (Blue Ridge District School Board), PaulBrown (staff liaison), and Dr. Ed Hatrick (Superintendent; staff liaison).

Absent: John Wood (EDC representative).

Guests present: Scott York (Chairman, Board of Supervisors) Eugene Delgaudio (Sterling District Supervisor), Stevens Miller (Dulles District Supervisors), Robert Dupree (Chairman, School Board), Jennifer Bergel (Catoctin District School Board), Kevin Lewis (LCPS Staff), Jim Rauch (County Staff).

Documents distributed: School Board Adopted FY09 – FY14 Capital Improvement Program, Typical School Project Timeline with Land Acquisition.

S. Kurtz: I move the Joint School and Board of Supervisors’ Committee to order. It is July 10th, 2008. We have with us from the committee Jim Burton, Priscilla Godfrey, Tom Reed, and as liaisons, Dr. Ed Hatrick from the Schools and Paul Brown, from County Administration. I am Sally Kurtz, Chairman of theCommittee. Our first order of business is the Public input. We have six speakers signed up today and we usually do 15 minutes, why don’t we do two and a half minutes each. If you could come in the front as I call your name and sit on the chair. I would appreciate if we could start with Barbara Munsey. Welcome Barbara, when your time is up, Denise will make some sort of movement to say that your time is up.

B. Munsey: Since you have so many speakers, there is a quick talk about the controversysurrounding the Lenah site but I will just going to get three points and then get off the air. Please do remember that the voters already approved the site acquisition money and it looks as though the School Board only intends to spend 80 percent of it. The voters have also already approved funding for themiddle school that is scheduled for this site. Since the Board of Supervisors voted this year during your budget process to keep that High School on schedule, please recall that to stay on schedule, it would need to be bonded this year and your drop dead date for that, I believe, is this coming Tuesday. Those of the three things I hope you will keep in mind as you work today.

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Good luck to you and thank you for your time.

S. Kurtz When we setup our procedure to hear from the public, we expected to literally hear from the public on any issue that they wish to speak. We as committee members will not be responding specifically to the information that you bring us to the request, but we are keeping notes. With that said, canwe hear from our second speaker who is Daniel Fisher. Hi Daniel.

D. Fisher: I’m going to speak about the Lenah site. I am kind of concerned about the procedures that have been going on. I looked at the traffic study and it seemsenormously flawed. There is a left turn on Lenah Road. It has about four to five hundred cars in evening rush hour making a left turn across Route 50. Using the School Board’s numbers, they will raise that by more than 50 percent. That is really going to slow down and block. Right now, they way, the traffic stops…the traffic in the evening rush hours is from 5 to 6, it actually backs up over a mile by 4 o’clock. That is such a discrepancy from reality that it got me suspicious. I started paying attention. I see that as soon as the Board of Supervisors asked to have the land surveyed, within a day, the Board of Education votes to ratify this contract... This contract was negotiated in secrecy and I am really concern about the secret land acquisition. It wasn’t but two or three years ago that this County got written up by the Washington Post, Loudoun Times, and at least one other newspaper about their secret land deals, where they do secret land acquisitions, it even suggested corruption. I don’t know if anything became of it, but this County has kind of a bad reputation for doing that. Now we arefaced with a situation where the Board of Supervisors is being asked to pass all these zoning exceptions and the Board of Education is coming out and is saying that if you don’t pass these zoning exceptions, we are going to bus your children all over the County that seems like a threat, an unfair pressure. It carries with it that you will subordinate the prerogative of the Board of Supervisors on zoning matters. They will become a subordinate organizationto the Board of Education with this land acquisition which is a very expensive part of our budget. And it is all done in secret. I am very much concerned that our government is going back under a shell of secrecy and that the process has to get reformed.

S. Kurtz: Thank you Mr. Fisher. Our next speaker is Lisa Melton, are you in the room? Alright, I will go back to her name at the end of the list. Our next speaker is Scott Peacock.

S. Peacock: I wanted to speak for a moment about the proposed Lenah site. I really don’t feel that this site fits within the vision of the transition zone. I’ve looked over that document. It doesn’t seem to fit in the spirit of what we intended todo with the transition zone. We are building a two-story middle school and atwo-story high school. The children will be entirely be bused or driven by their parents at this site. The community behind Lenah Run, which I live in

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has no sidewalk so the children can’t walk to that school. I have two children, one in grade one and one in grade six. I want the best education for them. I’ve participate in our schools and I am a strong supporter. I just don’t think this is the right location. Thank you Supervisor Miller for having the foresight for looking at the nine lots and called for a land inventory.

S. Kurtz: Thank you Mr. Peacock. Our next speaker is Robin Axelgard.

R. Axelgard: I just have a couple of simple questions, the main one is I’ve been asking for a couple months where the other sites are. I didn’t hear the introductions, is there anybody from the School Board here or are you all from the Board of Supervisors?

S. Kurtz: We have three members from the School Board and three members from theBoard of Supervisors.

R. Axelgard: Thank you very much. I just read the article from the Post. They used the figure, I believe, of 20 million for this particular site. I wondered, I do livein Lenah and sit in traffic everyday. I was just wondering how we can do that in the County…how we can spend 20 million on a school site. Worried about traffic, worried about well water, we are all on well water out there and propane tanks. These questions that haven’t been answered, wondering why the emergency meeting had to take place to buy the land. That is it. These are my questions and concerns, and why it is happening.

S. Kurtz: Our next speaker is Karen Ficker.

K. Ficker: Good afternoon Chairman and members of the Board and School Board members, my name is Karen Ficker from the Ashburn, Dulles District. I applaud the Board for this joint meeting. This is much needed and hoped thatthis will help you with your decision making. I come before you today because like many, if not most residents of Loudoun County, I opposed the Lenah School site. It is incomprehensible that at this time of budget constraints, or any time, you will propose an obviously over priced site at theexpense of taxpayers. And beyond price, there are other significant issues outstanding. Number one is that schools need to be build where they are needed, not to accommodate the long range plans of Greenvest whose long reach we continue to endure in Loudoun. We are al aware of the by-right housing numbers of this site, but if the schools are built here, this will indeedbecome a Trojan horse. I’ve said to you before, it would make it much harder for the Board to deny future applications which is precisely Greenvestplan. This is not misinformation but rather a realistic understanding of predatory development. As mother of two children who will attend school here for several more years. I am again astonished that you seemingly not taken into account the cost of busing the kids in this remote location. Within a year the price of diesel has doubled. Little has been suggested that it will

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become affordable in the future. The concept of having schools closed the developments have been explicably eluded by the School Board. In fact many students, although living within walking distance, are nonetheless bused to schools. I personally know of all the problem associated of forcing students to change schools to accommodate a community that was built too quickly. Ashburn in particular has been built like many other here with a carrot approach. Proffers of school sites were made, but the cost is always rezoning which resulted in hyper growth. It is something that new residents don’t under nor appreciate. Continuing this type of hyper growth has to stop.We can’t afford it we have to stop it, but will do nothing but to exacerbate analready problematic environment. The only sensible approach is to look at alternative methods to accommodate student overcrowding instead of the new schools or any approach or as I call it the all or nothing approach, whichwill adversely affect all the taxpayers of Loudoun. And finally, I can’t stress enough how the building of large campus type schools actually does not build community, in fact it destroys them. Building closer to homes, let kids have a real community stuff not spending our hard earn money of people that contribute to the spoils of the environment to schools that we can’t afford. A quality education is not about seceding to the whims of the developer plans but it is about doing the right thing for the community. Thank you.

S. Kurtz Thank you. Lisa Melton?

Lisa Melton: Members of the Board, School Board and the Board of Supervisors, I am a mother of two children. They go to the Arcola Elementary and the Mercer Middle School. I am hear as a mother of students who would be facing overcrowding, but I am also here as a taxpayer, I think there is a responsibility for the School Board and the Board of Supervisors to work together to provide the best education for the children and to use the resources to the best fiscal management possible. I think..what troubles me about the $20 million site is that there doesn’t seem to be any indication that the School Board has looked over the assessed value. Are we paying over the assessed value? If so, that money is going to fund Greenvest rather that having our children’s education. I know that I watch and participated in the budget discussions over white boards, I can’t help to think that we can fund a white board in every single classroom with the amount of money that would be overpaying Greenvest. I am not a fan of white board but I’ll rather see a white board in my kids’ school than money in Greenvest’s pocket. I would hope that you would also factor operational cost. This is a transportation dependent school that means that every child will be bused. That means that money, they only budget $3.75 per gallon for diesel and we know that they cost more than that, that means that excess is going to cut in operational costs, that means it going to cut in to my child’s education. There is a responsibility to consider the operational costs, the infrastructure and to consider the assessed value. What I don’t see, I don’t see the School

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Board is looking at those factors when they are making their vote. Perhaps it is an issue of transparency which is being reviewed. There is not a public dialogue. I would hope that the School Board and the Board of Supervisors can come together and have an honest discussion with public input to discusswhat’s the assess value. How would this eat into infrastructure and operational costs? The other sites might work as well. I will ask today that perhaps that this should be looked at more thoroughly in a public setting and that the two agencies that control our future will come together and work outthese issues so that there will be a transparent good faith solution. Thank you.

S Kurtz Thank you. You are our last speaker and I will make a generalized comment.The kinds of issues that you are talking about and have come forward to speak your opinion on this afternoon are precisely the subjects that the Joint School Board and Board of Supervisors Committee will be looking at. Not only the capital facilities of this particular meeting and the process and what the plans are, but also the month of August, we will be looking at the site selection criteria and hearing from our two staffs that have been working andhave recommendations and a report to give to us. That said, I will also note that Mrs. Buckley from the Sugarland District, a member of our committee from the Board of Supervisors has joined us. I see from our audience, Ms. Bergel from the Catoctin District School Board; Mr. York is also here, and Mr. Stevens from Dulles District School Board. Our next … first item that we will be having is for your health bingo competition presentation.

C. Edwards Good Afternoon, I am Carol Edwards, Benefits Supervisors of LCPS. Last February, LCPS Administration building was challenged by LCG Administration building to participate in a four-week wellness activity. The goal was to incorporate healthy behaviors and to have real fun at the same time. The object was to register participants to complete horizontal line on bingo cards each week. The activities include physical fitness, healthy eating. The LCG had 60 registered and LCPS had 115 registered. The winner was based on the highest percentage participants completing the four weeks. I may add that LCPS participants have just finished 10,000 steps a day. An eight week program achieving 50 percent participation school wide. So we must have been worn for that, because they drop out half way throughthe challenge. Regardless, today, the honor of this first annual wellness challenge to the LCG Administration Building, congratulations. Keep this reward safe because we will be getting this back next year.

N. Larson I would just like to thank Carol for bringing this today. We’ve been anxiously awaiting its arrival. I will also want to thank the members of the Board of both Boards for supporting both Carol and I in our wellness initiatives. We have come quite a long ways. I want to recognize a couple of people today, Alexandra Pratt, she is our health education coordinator of Cigna, Tom Chunta and Keisha Cross, our wellness coordinator from the

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County. They did an outstanding job for us in all our initiatives. Last but not least, I would like to thank Kirby Bowers and Mark Adams for their support.They are always open to support these wellness initiatives. Kirby, if you will, I would like for you to come up so I can give this to you and you can put this in our trophy case.

K. Bowers: Thank you. (He accepted the award).

E. Hatrick I guess Madam Chairman I want to know if we are going to get credit too. As of January 1 2009, the use of any tobacco products on any Loudoun County Pubic School property will be prohibited. I guess there should be some kind of credit.

S. Kurtz I’ll let you and Kirby figure that one out.

P. Godfrey I was there all four weeks.

S. Kurtz I won’t comment.

T. Reed I moved adoption of the June 12th Minutes. (Seconded by Ms. Godfrey).

S. Kurtz That passes 6-0-1, with Mr. Wood absent.

T. Reed I moved that that the Joint School Board and Board of Supervisors Committee adopt the resolution supporting energy efficiency in public buildings.

S. Kurtz: It has been made and seconded by Mrs. Godfrey. The floor is now open for discussion. I also have an amendment to the last paragraph of the resolution. That alone it reads, what I want to do is to substitute for “and further sufficient funds that would be vested for by the School Board and provided by the Board of Supervisors would adequate timelines to accomplish these goals”. The amendment that I would like to substitute says “and further the Joint Committee of the School Board and the Board of Supervisors urge bothbudgeting and funding of public facilities by the Loudoun County School Board and Board of Supervisors to reflect cost containment and life cycle cost.” The reason behind this is that the resolution itself gives us standards, which is the LEED certification, but as always we get to talking about taxes that comes down to funding. What I handed out to you also is research that has been done that shows essentially that we have sustainable buildings, we can go LEED certification without it being a hard and fast case and that we have to spend our money. I don’t know if you had a chance to look over it. Essentially what the study shows that there is no significant difference for the average cost of green buildings compared to LEED green buildings. Thiscan be achieved with little or no added cost. If budget is way over the (inaudible) for some of the program points for myself because we had this

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come up in looking at one of our own buildings, is that I am not willing to pay for the learning cost for either architects or designers. I think if they are going to be building their own buildings, they need to absorb their own learning curve and I think we can in fact move to LEED certified without it being a guarantee that we pay more money. This is why you have my proposed amendment, any discussion?

J. Stevens Are you suggesting a new bidding process by which we define the best bids for construction/design?

S. Kurtz It is up to you. We are making a resolution that gives both board’s policies. How this is carried out is certainly up to each system. We have a resolution which we set a standard for green, for LEED silver certification. We are saying that we urge, in the budgeting, and in paying for it, that we consider cost containment and that we also consider life cycle costs.

J. Stevens I think it is a good resolution. I am concern only that it implies that we don’t all already implement the best containment practices available.

S. Kurtz It does not imply anything. It is straight forward what you see in the paper asa resolution to go forward as both Boards to buy into LEED certification. Anyone else?

P. Godfrey My concern is that we put ourselves in a box here. We are saying that we take 10 percent off the cost already of projects we are projecting in the future. Then we are layering onto that, oh by the way, you’ve got to get 38 points of 69 and there will be a price tag for that. When you’re starting up anenergy saving situation here where you have certain basic requirement that you maybe have to add to in what you’re already doing, there is a cost. I am concern that we are squeezing from the bottom and then we are going to add to the top. What happens if we can meet this, is there any negotiating room to say that maybe not this year but maybe next year?

S. Kurtz I will say to you is that it is not a matter of myself, you get a certain amount of money to get a school on the ground, this resolution simply says that I am not squeezing from the bottom, that you have to consider cost containment, you have to consider life cycle costs which may in fact lower the cost, and that we are shooting for this standard. That is what it simply says. Mr. Burton.

J. Burton This is a resolution from the Joint Committee recommending to both Board whether or not it is binding on both Board will depend upon how they receive it. I think the effort to move towards green building is a good effort. How fast we go and how far we go, I think we should perceive caution. Yourcomments about the learning curve, I think are very appropriate. I noticed that Los Angeles County, according to the National Association of Counties

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financial service news indicate that a year ago, Los Angeles County adopted a procurement policy trying to deal with this very subject, in which they saidthat if a green feature design will cost more than 10% more than non-green, that they will not proceed with it. That will be an arbitrary number and I think we are too early in the process to pick arbitrary thresholds and arbitrary values. I will support the amendment that you proposed Ms. Kurtz because it keeps in front of use the notion to keep life cycles costs down and cost in mind while still moving towards green buildings. How fast we go or how far we go in the first year or two is still open for discussion.

S. Buckley I too will support the substitute amendment. I wholly support the goal of moving towards greener buildings. I think Mrs. Godfrey raised a valid point that we have to be concern about the squeeze in the construction of schools both in the top end and the bottom end. I will support the substitute amendment because of the use of the word urge as well as the phrases whereour policies will reflect cost containment and life cycle cost. I would have trouble supporting the original resolution as written because it was committing us funding on an open ended basis, which I would not feel comfortable with.

S. Miller I am a member of the County’s Energy Efficiency Committee. I think Mr. Stevens’ raises a fair quote that can also be applied to the effectiveness of methods already employed by school people to save energy independent of the fact that it saves you money or that it is a cost containment tactic. I take this change to reiterate that I already have seen significant evidence of energy savings methodology employed in our schools already. I would be a mistake if anyone would think that we are not already aware of that and that we are not dealing with these things. I want everyone to be aware again that I’ve noticed these, I approve of it, and I applaud it, and I expect it to continue with enthusiasm.

S. Kurtz: Mr. Burton seconded the motion. All in favor of the substitute amendment? That passes passed 6-0-1 (Wood absent).

T. Reed I only thing I want to add is that, Mr. Miller thank you for bringing up the Energy Efficiency Committee. As I understand it Mr. Dupree, our Chairman,will be a member of that committee. What I would hope is that this resolution will be referred to them for refinement before both Boards take action on the final document.

S. Kurtz I am in favor of that.

J. Stevens I have a couple of amendments. The fourth whereas, reads, whereas, Loudoun County Public Schools and Loudoun County strive to build the most energy efficient buildings possible; and this is a concern I brought up during last month’s meeting. I think that this implies that we are going for

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platinum certification all 69 points and LEED. I don’t think we build the most energy buildings possible. I think we make reasonable trade offs with energy efficiency and operational costs and other building costs. I think we build very responsibly, but I don’t thing that we, either body, build the most energy efficient building possible so I would like to strike that. I make a motion to strike that a stand we are not trying to achieve…energy efficiency at the cost of everything else.

S. Kurtz What I am hearing you’re saying is that the fourth whereas, which readsWHEREAS, Loudoun County Public Schools and Loudoun County strive to build the most energy efficient buildings possible; and, you’re saying that you want this removed from the resolution. Mr. Stevens?

J. Stevens In the therefore paragraph, where the wording reads all Loudoun County public facilities will strive to attain a minimum Silver Certification level, Iwould like to substitute public facilities will meet or exceed the Silver Certification. Changing will strive to will meet or exceed I think is says that it is more than an intention, it is a commitment. At the end of the paragraph I would like to add the words, unless the Board of Supervisors votes to exempt a particular building for this standard. If the Board of Supervisors decides that meeting silver certification for a particular building is not appropriate or not cost effect, or for ever reason is not the optimal course, then I would like to see a vote from the Board of Supervisors stating we are going to exempt ourselves from this requirement on this particular building, which doesn’t change the standardthat we do build for a silver LEED standard.

T. Reed I second the motion.

S. Kurtz What we have for discussion is a motion to amend, the motion was distributed. The motion was moved and seconded.

J. Burton: I am comfortable in adopting a resolution which says that we are going to tryto move towards more green buildings. In this stage of the process, I don’t know enough about our status and our abilities. I don’t think we do either to make a hard firm commitment on a specific number. I will be opposing the motion.

S. Buckley I think in a context of a resolution, which is what we are dealing with here, language similar to strive or moving toward is much more appropriate than anything that commits us that is really more appropriate for another type of legal document.

S. Miller There might be a constitutional component here. I would make sure the resolution doesn’t bind the School Board to the action or inaction of the Board of Supervisors.

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T. Reed The only thing I would add is the recent referrals concerning the Lenah Run Property, the environmental review team asked the staff to provide an analysis where public facilities are already planned. This will be the LEED Silver which is recommended by the Washington Metropolitan Council of Government for a green building report. This lays the goal for us and I think it is an acceptable goal. If the budget interfered, it is merely a resolution, but I would support the motion.

S. Kurtz You mean the amendment.

P. Godfrey I wish I could support it, but I agree with some of the other remarks that have been made in terms of putting us out there. My concern is that we are going too fast with this. We need to do some experimentation, we need to get some more bids, we need to analyze what we are doing both County and School in terms of energy consumption and containment cost and life cycle cost and have those all broken down. Maybe a couple years from now, if we made improvements in the buildings that we are constructing over the next two years, we might be ready for something like this. Now I think too much too fast.

S. Kurtz I too will not support the motion. I think that Mr. Reed’s original resolution gave us enough concrete standards to be working toward and it does give us time to work a little bit more of the kinks out. At the same time, it allows both Boards to sign on to a standard to work on the goals. That said, I call for the vote. All in favor of the amendment? All right that is two. All those opposed? That is four. The amendment fails on a 2-4-1 vote (Wood absent). We are back to the original resolution. So I would like to call for a vote on that. All those in favor, raise your hand? All right. That passes 6-0-1 (Wood absent). It is my understanding that this particular item will now go to the Ad Hoc Committee on Energy Efficiency. They will indeed look at it over and from there it would go to the full Board for approval or disapproval. That brings us up to Item #5, Capital Facility Planning Overview and Discussion.

P. Brown Thank you Mrs. Kurtz. Before we start I would like to give you an overview of what we will be doing in the time we have on this topic and how it links with your August meeting. Attached to your agenda today is the long range planning calendar. You will be receiving a lot of written information today for you to read. It is homework. Some are related to today’s topic and there are a whole packet related to your August packet for you to read. What we would like for you to do is work through those packets and submit any questions any topics you wanted discussed in detail in August to us. Probably two weeks before the meeting because we have to mail the packets out to make sure we have all the information in. So that would be around the2nd of August. If you could get us your questions and you can e-mail those to

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me and I’ll make sure that all staff has them. That way we will be prepared for the meeting and we will really do have a worksession and spend our timetalking about the topics. You’ll notice on the long range calendar that we have amended your September meeting to include a panel discussion about land valuation. There has been quite a lot of talk of these past couple of weeks about the value of land in Loudoun County. In coordinating with our County Assessor, Mr. Todd Kaufman, and with the appraisal community, they are willing to come together and have a panel discussion for the joint committee about the difference in assessment methodology and appraisal methodology. So that panel is being put together and they will be at your September meeting to deal with land valuation. I say that so you know that in August, we will not going to talk about value of land, we will hold that to the September meeting. So that brings us to what we are going to accomplishtoday.

J. Burton Dealing with the agenda for the 14th, I noticed the second item there is on condemnation. I would ask that that presentation, or the materials given, be as thorough and exhaustive as possible. I think those of us in our Board needto know a lot more about that process. The pros and cons and pitfalls, exactly how the process works. I really would like have to spend a lot of time understanding that at that session.

P. Brown We plan to have legal staff provide that guidance and in your homework, you’re going to actually get an overview from the County’s prospective of State Code and process requirements of condemnation. On August 14th we are actually going to use a recent condemnation that the School Board experienced, the O’Connor tract as a case model study from beginning to end of what that involved from the point of view of time, money and effort. Ithink it is really a good case study to really flush out all the issues with condemnation.

S. Adamo We got the data, we have the information.

P. Brown What we are going to do is a quick overview of your direction to us. In otherwords, everything we are presenting to you is in the realm of your policy andoperating guidelines that directs us to do the capital planning for public facilities, schools and county. We will do a quick overview of that then we will do a little of role play exercise. I will ask you to suspend your current identities and you are going to be part of a new governing board and it would not be a School Board or Board situation. You all will be able to participate in a new Board for Paradise County. Unfortunately, you have me as the Chairman of the Board and Sam as the Vice Chair, and Julie is our legal counsel. We will use the role playing exercise to illustrate one of the areas in the planning process that we continue to bump up against and we think it is now the time for us to have a serious conversation. With all that said, the packet we want to start with is the one with visual diagram on the

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front. I will quickly go through the visual diagram, Julie Pastor is our director of our Planning Department and Dr. Adamo is the director of the Legislative Planning Department of the Schools, they will give an overview of how the Comprehensive Plan, the Revised General Plan documents guide our decision making process. Julie is going to give you some of the themes that Staff work through planning for capital facilities. And Dr. Adamo will share their process internally. And then the chapters of the Revised General Plan that we have given you is by no mean exhaustive of all the chapters thatwe use, but these are the specific chapters, at the very least, we need you to read at the August meeting. The chapters that we spent most of our time withare chapters 3, 11, and then the various subareas rural, transition, suburban, and towns. Those are the chapters we work with most frequently in doing our capital facility plan. So we are asking you to read those chapters. As we go through these, I will tell you what our recommendations on what discussions should be are. In the area of the revised general plan, as you are working on all these chapters, our question to you is – is there language you feel needs to change in the capital facility planning area. What would that be? That is where we probably will need the dialogue. As an example, Mr. Burton participated in the Facilities Impact Committee several years ago where they made a language change recommendation on co-location policiesto amend it just from county facilities being collocated to include County and Schools. So that is one example of a recommendation that came forwardon changing some plan language. I know Julie has more to say about that butif there is one work area that we want to talk about as far as the plan document it is…after you read it, and how it guides us in capital facility planning, what you want to dialogue about? And get more information on. So very quickly, when I started work for Loudoun County almost 17 years ago, what impressed me about Loudoun County is that it uses an integrated planning process for its capital facilities. It takes it land use policy and capital facility planning and integrates them in such a way that as we deliver capital facility for the community, we are using the comprehensive plan as…I joke with Julie, I pull off the shelf, this is one of my bibles that I follow. I don’t know a lot of jurisdictions who do that. To have one chapter dedicated to capital facility or public facility planning in Chapter 3, is that unique or it is more incorporated now? Julie can answer that. Basically, thereare timelines to find, but the real quick one minute overview of what happens is that we start with the revised General Plan guidance as it is provided in both policy and language. The plan says that you both the School Board and the Board will adopt capital facility standards which are those kinds of facilities that you both as governing boards feel that add to thequality of life of your community. Those standards that you adopt are our work plan. In other words, that is what staff is implementing. We are going to build these facilities, the standards include triggers on when we think those should be built, and how many should we built. There is a formula andI can run the spreadsheet and tell you how many jails you need and how many fire stations and how many schools. Within those standards, the

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program departments participate in a dialogue with you as decision makers both boards on what is the standard building footprint the land that is required to deliver the program has been defined for the public and their quality of life. So you have an overall standard, but you have a standard within a standard. Those standards are then put up against the work of a committee that you have appointed called the Fiscal Impact Committee. ThatFiscal Impact Committee develops a 20 year growth scenario. It looks at how many houses we are building, it looks at pupil generation rates that come out of those houses, and it looks at general population rates that are generated. As staff, we use their data to start projecting out what needs to be built and when because your standard has identified a trigger on when it should be triggered. Using that work of that committee, which is made up of folks that you have appointed to represent the development community, citizens, Board members sit on it, the schools sit on it and actively participate as well as financial staff. We developed a 10 year capital needs document that says, based on your standards here is what you should expect to build to achieve your standards over the next 10 years. Now this is an interesting…one of the discussions I think, as I said as we go through this, this goes though a very public process. I am amazed on how many of our citizens do not know that it exists. Recently, I was asked a question how would I know how many facilities are going to be built in my neighborhood?I may not be able to answer that, but the fact that we are identifying what facilities are going to be built in which planning subareas for the next 10 years, any of you can just quickly go to the back charts and what is provided is a chart that says, here are the facilities that would be built in this planning subarea for the next 10 years. One issue that I want to talk to you about is why the public does not know about this information. I’m still amazed that a citizen moves into this community and is not aware of the public facilities that are coming their way and we have a 10 year plan that says if you live in a Dulles subarea, and I have complimented Mr. Miller at this point, when you came recently with the item to evaluate sites, it was very refreshing to have you say the CNA identifies that we are going to be building 23 schools in this planning subarea in the next 10 years so we are going to be looking atsites for quite a while. You tied it back to the planning process and where this goes to two public hearings, this goes to your Planning Commission, they weigh in on it, then it goes to the Board’s public hearing before it gets adopted. I am still amazed that the public is not using this to understand. Hey, for the next ten years we have a lot of facilities in the pipeline. I do think that is one area what we can talk about. So we have the 10 year, we have identified what year it going to roll into your funding plan for the six years, and generally, I have experienced that both administrators of both organizations, if you proposed something out of order you have to have a justification for why you think it is moving in. I’ve also seen over the years that if it not in your capital needs document, it is not going to make it in the CIP for funding because you want to have the flow that we planned for it and now it is time to fund it. Those links are made between this document

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and then your CIP. Then finally in your CIP, the first year of the six years is the year you’re actually funding, the other five years are the proposed funding schedule that is coming your way. On top of that, several years ago, we have joint staff teams that met when this Fiscal Impact Committee recommended at collocation. We developed collocation guidelines. We provided those to Dr. Hatrick, the superintendent of the schools, and to County Administrator, Mr. Bowers, and our joint staff planning team when we are looking at sites, we use those guidelines to say what we can co-locate. I will tell you that on a weekly basis, the land acquisition managers call each other, we are working on this, we have this much acreageand here is how much we are going to use, do you have any in that area fromthe CNA. The collocation over the past two years has been brought to the forefront as a planning process. In your homework, we will provide you with those guidelines so you can dialogue with us and say, you are not on target we would like to look at this or not. So, that is the planning process. It has been in place for a long time, but we start with is the Revised General Plan. So I will turn over to Julie and let her work you though the landscape matrix.

J. Pastor As Paul indicated, we start at the Revised General Plan but it is a little bit of the chicken and egg thing, which comes first the standards or the plan. I think we chose the plan and put that first on the list because it does set the 20plus years horizon on how we envision land use to develop in the County. It too goes though a public review process. It is a consensus document that the County says this is how we are going grow over the next 20 + years and it establishes the level of development, the type of development, and the configuration of the development, what it would look like. And so, that translates directly into our growth projections, what is our population going to be based on the number of housing unit or what is our growth and employment would be based on the amount of business development that weare going to experience. Those numbers, if you will, the projections are fundamental to the plan but they are not all land. The Plan goes beyond that into areas regarding policies regarding the development of capital facilities. So I would like to establish that the plan is the big picture on how we are going to grow and where we are going to grow and to what degree we are going to grow, but it is really the next level down which says--- ok we as a county are going to grow this much, now what are we going to do? How do we want to grow to meet the needs of citizens that we are planning for? Paul alluded to the uniqueness; I don’t think the plan is unique in its addressing the capital facilities. I think most plans do address capital facilities and standards, or the guiding picture. What is unique about Loudoun is the capital needs assessment document. That was created in the mid nineties. It really serves as the bridge document. It puts reality to our plan, it is unique. I’ve had many jurisdictions in the Commonwealth come to us and talk to us about the capital needs assessment because it is so unique and it is real opportunity for us to drill down by subarea or by smaller policy area. It kind

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of identity what the needs are for those particular areas. We also have envisioned in our plan that be more fine grained planning at the policy level, at the smaller area level. We are doing some of that in our outreach effort with the community plans in two areas of the suburban area. Right now we envisioned at building on or maybe an outcome of that planning process willlead us to some more fine grained planning related to capital facilities. The bottom line is that capital need assessment document is a ten year snap shot of –ok, we have envisioned this many people, and as Paul indicate, we have these standards that are adopted by the Board for these types of facilities. This is where we envisioned based on the triggers we know of population and development in these subareas, these are where these facilities need to go in our ten year time frame in terms of number of facilities. The specific thing that Paul has given you on the homework or the chapters from the plan, what I tried to do was give you a little help on your homework assignment. It is four sheets, and this to just help you…I think it is importantfor you to look at all the chapters to get a sense of the areas. This goes to your specific task about, what are the real co-location policies that the plan has and in each of the planning subareas, which are the suburban area, transition area, the rural areas, the towns and villages and joint land management areas. As well as kind of general policies it basically tries to layout for you what are the policies that apply in each of those cases. As you can see, there are general policies and there are specific capital facilities policies on schools, fire and rescue and libraries, etc. If I were to give you again a one step up from that again give you my feelings about what are the key elements of the plan, what do I think the big theme are of the plan or where the plan is coming from? Number one is the honoring the direction of the service plans and levels that are adopted by the Board. That is throughoutevery facility that is what we say that we are doing to honor the direction that the Board provides and what is the appropriate service level for each facility and what are the appropriate standards. The second is another topic that you already mentioned which are opportunities for co-location. That occurs in virtually all instances. There is a policy about co-location with respect to school facilities. It is not just school facilities that were talking about. Co-location is a big idea that the plan contains. The third one is that these facilities, whether the schools or fire rescue station or libraries, that they be the prominent and visible focal point of our community. They are thekey elements, that kind of knit our communities together and that is a big emphasis in the plan that there is adequate infrastructure. That is another biggie in terms of, it is not just roads, it is utilities, other uses that are compatible, but having that infrastructure is very important. It could be something as simple as sidewalks; it could be something as complex as the road networks. Having those adequate infrastructures is paramount in how we plan for these facilities. Another one is probably more specific to schools, but I think is an overarching concept even for other facilities that is it is at the center of the population where it going to serve. Whether it is central to the attendance area that the schools established for their planning

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or whether it is central to the service area to fire and rescue response time that is a very important concept. Again, we talk about the infrastructure, convenient access, but when I talk about access I am thinking about not just road access but are there other modes of transportation are there bikes, sidewalks, trails, and how it pulls together. Then finally, are we taking advantage on adoptively reusing facilities we already have to the extent that is a theme not just for the rural area but in general. Are we taking advantagesof the resources that we have and expanding them when we need to, but acknowledging that they may already provide a focal point that we should take advantage of that. I need to emphasize and I know that Dr. Adamo hearsme say that all the time, we do not look at one of these policies and just say that ok, we check that box we are done. When we do a referral, whether it is Dr. Adamo asking us to comment on sites that he has identified as possible for consideration or whether we are in a special exception process for a review of a school site or a fire station, we look at the plan holistically. We look at how all these policies fit together and/or if one policy can’t be met, are there others that can support that, or decision making then we give all that information to the decision makers to make those decisions after they weigh in on the information. Staff recommendations, policies and regulatory recommendations, and then what the citizens have to say as well. That is all critical to that process. Mr. Miller, I saw your quote in the paper today and atthe very end of the article, that is exactly it, we don’t come to the conclusion until we hear all the information. Maybe it is important because we shouldn’t go into a process with a preconceived notion that... Anyway, that is what we have.

P. Brown I would like to save all the questions at the end, please write them down.

S. Adamo Basically, we just have a one sheet handout. I’ll walk you though what the schools do within the context of the County’s General Plan, the Zoning Ordinances. Every fall we anxiously await the countdown to September 30th and depending on the enrollments that we see and the growth that we have experienced, we begin essentially looking at enrollment projection for the County. That enrollment number drives our operational budget drives our capital improvement plan. This is something our planning staff looks at. We then take it up with Dr. Hatrick and other members of the senior staff, we discuss that. We try to get this number and early as possible before we move forward. Once we begin looking at those numbers we analyze the areas of critical need. We are going most. What you’ll see at this summary chart, thisis page 11 of our CIP, I know you all have it. It kind of gives you a quick guide. You’ll see all our total enrollment on the first line by elementary, middle, and high school. Then what you’ll see is that the enrollment is broken out by cluster. This gives us, you as policy makers a good idea as to where we are anticipating growth or where we don’t think anything is going to happen. In that case we also going to call your attention to some of the areas like Dominion, Park View, and Potomac Falls clusters that we believe

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are basically done with their growth. What you’ll see is that they have very flat enrollment growth. In other areas of the County, it is slower, and you’ll see in some areas for example in the Dulles area with Briar Woods and Freedom, are the areas we are anticipating a significant amount of growth as well as Western Loudoun. Again, this gives us an idea as to where that growth is going to occur. We then weigh that current data with the projected data and how our facilities are viewed. As you know we do an analysis everyyear of our projected enrollment in the schools that is included in a school byschool basis. It tells you how many rooms are there how the rooms are beingused to calculate that capacity. Based on the available seats that we have, how quickly we are projecting how those seats will be utilized, we begin programming schools. As you begin looking at programming, there aren’t any new schools for some areas like the Potomac Falls area. We are also generating a lot more interest and a lot more schools in the Dulles area. Again, that is where the lion’s share of the growth is. We also have a significant amount of growth in the western Loudoun. Again, it is a by-right growth that we have been experiencing there as well as in the transition area.As we begin to prioritize the many needs, what you ultimately see is a document and a money page that everyone quickly turn to as they hear the number to see how all these will cost. Again, this basically breaks out our sixyear enrollment program into capital projects. You all will see in there the anticipated funding, for schools and funding for land, and where we anticipate those facilities are going to be. Also in the packet we do have some information about some of the land planning that we look at as far as school site. I think that is self explanatory and I will conclude my remarks.

P. Brown: Now we will do the role play and each one of you is a Board member. I really want you to have fun with this. There is no intent of …in any of these examples trying to point the current situations into discussion. The purpose of this role play is to emphasize that as policy makers and staff, we come up against decisions that are very complicated. So have fun with this because there is no right or wrong vote so we are going to ask you to vote. You’ll see, we have some motions. Those who are setting at the table are not part ofthe board.

E. Delgaudio Mrs. Chairman, can I vote too?

P. Brown Yes, you may vote Mr. Delgaudio.

S. Kurtz I would like to acknowledge that Mr. Eugene Delgaudio has joined us, at least an hour ago or so. And Robert Dupree is also in the audience. Hi, thankyou.

P. Brown Here is the background. Mr. Smith has come to you in a public input session and said I would like to donate five acres to Paradise County if the county will construct, maintain and operate a dog park. As Chairman of the Board, I

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move that the Board accept the deed of gift and further move $250,000 be designated in a capital fund to construct the park.

S. Adamo I second that motion.

P. Brown Discussion on the motion

T. Reed Where is the property located.

P. Brown For the purpose of this discussion, that is irrelevant, but that would be one ofyour first questions, where is the property. All right?

J. Burton We can’t afford a dog park. I will vote no.

P. Godfrey As a county project, would we be liable for insurance and things that would happen on the property?

P. Brown Yes.

S. Buckley What are the costs of construction and maintenance. Is there a community support for a dog park or how would that be measured?

S. Adamo We understand that there is a significant amount of dog owners that would really cherish a dog park. We believe that it will be a great public service.

P. Brown The maintenance cost has not been identified yet. The $250,000 is to construct the park.

S. Miller Where is the $250,000 going to come from?

P. Brown It is coming from your capital contingency fund.

S. Miller How big is that?

P. Brown Current, you have a balance of $4 million. Any other questions?

T. Reed Will this dog park be constructed with LEED certification?

P. Brown It is possible.

P. Godfrey I am not familiar with the zoning laws, what are the restrictions for the location of the dog park. Do they have to have public utility do they need access, are they centrally located or just to anywhere. How does that work?

P. Brown Staff has determined that Mr. Smith met all the zoning categories to permit adog park.

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S. Buckley Is five acres sufficient for a dog park?

P. Brown The dog owners in the areas would prefer 10 acres because they own a lot of dogs, but they are willing to support the five acre option.

S. Buckley what are the other uses of the capital contingency funds?

P. Brown Typically, you’ll use that where a capital construction bid comes in higher than the budgeted amount for this project due to market conditions for pricing of labor and materials. It is used to supplement land purchases or to buy land if an opportunity comes along.

S. Kurtz Can we co-locate a parking ride lot on it?

P. Brown There is not sufficient acreage to co-locate a park and ride lot.

P. Brown I call for the vote, all in favor of the main motion to build a dog park? The motion fails. We are going now to motion #3, Mr. Adamo?

Mr. Adamo Fairfield High School is 95 percent capacity. HS12 is the next high school tobe constructed in this community is not funded for another two years in the capital improvements program. The School Board has requested that the construction schedule be advanced one year in the construction schedule of the CIP for the next fiscal year. I move the HS12 be accelerated from FY12 to FY10 and supplement the appropriation using VPSA bond funding be approve in the amount of $22.5 million for the purchase of land for the high school.

P. Brown I second that motion.

J. Burton Did I hear you say that the school was planned for FY12 and you haven’t purchased land yet? And why not?

P. Brown You have not appropriated land funds for this HS. It was scheduled the land fund was scheduled for FY11.

J. Burton I kind of like to see your enrollment projection and the history of the projection in this area, and all the projections that we look at.

S. Adamo We have received communication from the School Board and they are very sure they see the light.

J. Burton I would like to see the data please. I don’t like data for pre analysis.

S. Adamo The School Board will get that to you.

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S. Miller Let me take note that this is an excellent simulation because the reality, for those of you who don’t know, the discussions we have are having. The question I would have is what would our financial advisors say this would do to our credit rating if we put this bonds early and what would this do to our debt cap. How close are we on this?

S. Buckley I too would need more information about this. I would also want informationas to what the standard trigger; is 95 % the trigger? Is this unusual to be taking this action based on the 95% capacity.

P. Godfrey I feel a sense of urgency. Is there a timeline for the acquisition of the property for the school? Do we already have our ducks in order? Are we already looking at a site or sites?

P. Brown We have not begun looking for sites. It was scheduled in FY11 so we are going to find a site. It may involve an accelerated land review process.

P. Godfrey Do we have to decide tonight? Is there a possibility that we could delay to get further information.

S. Adamo Not according to the School Board staff.

E. Delgaudio This being Paradise, are there any other schools?

S. Adamo All the other schools are full, Mr. Delgaudio. They are running at 101%.

E. Delgaudio How come we did not propose new schools for those areas? I got the resolution, got it. What is our debt capacity in Paradise?

S. Adamo That is why it is called Paradise. We have plenty of debt capacity.

S. Buckley What did you say about the debt capacity? We have room to afford this?

P. Brown Yes. The resolution is actually to accelerate it, but to buy the land now with VPSA bond financing.

T. Reed Paradise is in Virginia?

J. Burton I assume you are going to call the vote. I would not be squeezed into a vote not knowing very much about it. Just having come right out of the blue.

P. Brown Touché.

S. Buckley Could you vote on it in this hypothetical, assumed everything they said was 100% correct.

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J. Burton That is an assumption that I am not ready to make.

S. Buckley For the purpose of game playing.

J. Burton If we are planning a game, if everything that was said was 100% correct thenI could support, but it would take a track record of being accurate of being 100% up to this point before I will be willing to accept it without seeing the data myself.

P. Brown I would call for the vote.

J. Burton Do they have a site in mind?

P. Brown For this exercise we haven’t thought that far, but we could say yes or no and that would be a reality. Because sometimes we have a site in mind sometimes we don’t. Third scenario, this one is real quick.

S. Kurtz We are way beyond our time.

P. Brown We can stop there. What that little exercise, and I will hand this one to you, these are your currently adopted standards. These are work plan, it also has the triggers, standards within a standard, the building foot prints, the acreage, and this is what we think and what we will recommend we have ourjoint worksession on. Because this is what drives the decision you are dealing. In the County side, back in February, we did a very interesting exercise. We have a team of staff that got together and review all our capital facility planning. The last sheet, to give you an indication of what you actually funding in the last few years on the County-side. Should a dialogue about affordability about our standards be included in the capital planning process? So that is another issue we are identifying for you to discuss. This will be part of the homework that would look at the worksession, to really dwell into these. We are not going to plan to talk about it now, but these really drive a lot of the planning process.

J. Pastor I just want to comment about your first exercise. I just wanted to note that one of you asks whether or not the dog park was part of your capital facilities standards. And that is the point that Paul is making, is that we take those standards that you adopt and we translate them into facilities based on and needs per area. And so if dog parks are not in the standards, which they are not, then that would be your first signal that maybe that is not what you would want to approve.

S. Kurtz Why don’t we take a break, but you also promised that people have some questions, and I also have some questions from the original presentation. Why don’t we take a break and let’s get back it in about 8 minutes.

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J. Stevens I would like to apologize that I would be unable to return after the break. I need to attend a family event.

S. Kurtz Thank you.

(Break for eight minutes).

S. Kurtz Does anybody have a question for Ms. Pastor?

R. Reed In the matrix on schools, the very last bullet, it says wherever possible, locate new schools in or immediately adjacent to existing villages, towns that would provide convenient access for students. Would you define wherever possible and who makes the final determination on possibility.

J. Pastor First of all when you read that item that is applying to the towns villages andJLMAs, that policy. To answer your specific question what I said earlier, that is one of the criteria, one of the location policies that govern the locationof school. So what it is basically saying is that our preference is that they be where the infrastructure is and the infrastructure is in the towns, immediatelyadjacent to the towns, or existing villages, or in the JMLA where we anticipate the infrastructure to be. So that is what the policy is saying, it is saying that wherever it is possible, this is our preference, but this is not, there is nothing that falls in that category that we look at all the policy to see how well is that location meet everything else. Then it is not just the school policy, it is all the general policy that is up on the first two pages.

T. Reed I guess my issue is, if land is cheaper far outside the town than those closer to the town, the possibility of buying land cheaper?

P. Pastor Is the land cheaper?

R. Reed Is it?

P. Pastor This is would be a question I would through back to you all. Is it your due diligence of whether it is cheaper because you’ll have to transport the children further. The roads are probably not in a configuration that is able to carry the amount of traffic that they need. They would have to figure in the road improvements. The utilities are not there so you’re going to have to consider potentially alternative system to serve the school. All of those things need to factor in that decision. It might end up being less expensive orthe better solution. That would be the kind of due diligence that you go through with all of these policies, figure out if that is the right location for you.

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E. Hatrick Isn’t the bottom line from Staff’s perspective and eventually the Board perspective; there are no two cases that are the same. It is like appraising land or assessing land. You have to look at each parcel individually. You canhave a situation like we have in Lovetsville where you have a town with utilities, but the main street in town can’t accommodate school traffic. So you have to build new roads to get to the site that is adjacent to the County. We have the plan as the guideline, we use the plan standards to measure against all the properties we considered but the fact of the matter is, every property you look at in Loudoun County has some features that make it unique. Eventually, it becomes a balancing act. You decide, ok we get A, B and C, we don’t get D and E, but A, B and C outweigh D and E or we don’t get A, B and C, but we get D and E and D and E outweigh A, B and C. I think that is why the process takes as long as it does. It is not just the complexity of the whole administerial process; it is the weighing of all the possible variables that affect land.

S. Kurtz Any other question for Ms. Pastor since she has to leave?

P. Godfrey Along the same lines, when all these documents are drafted up and public facilities will be located here there and everywhere, or they would be near infrastructure and the infrastructure would be expected to come from the town, we seem to have a communication gap. Because those same towns, and they are a very few of them, that have public utility, they are not huge system and they are not particularly willing to extend to property adjacent too, as cited in your policy. When the rubber hits the road, we have a major problem.

J. Pastor Our Board members are familiar with me saying this but it is not my plan, it is the County’s plan and these policies were adopted with the full consensus of the County. If the towns and individual jurisdictions are not with the program, then that is a leverage point for the Board of Supervisors to say that this is our policy and we think that it is paramount that we put it here because this is the best place for all, as what Dr. Hatrick said, we weigh A, Band C and D & E. I can spend a lot of time talking about this, I would be more than happy to do so offline or some other time.

S. Kurtz I have a couple of questions myself, Paul you opened up the discussion here,so this 10-year document, if I as a member of the public really want to know what is happening in the neighborhood, it is not only this one that I have to go through, but it is this one. It seems to me that if we are talking about making it is easier for the public why is it we don’t have something on the website that has the map that has the outline diagram of the district or what we are talking about that has.

P. Brown That is online.

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S. Kurtz The map that I am describing..

P. Brown There is so many projects there; I am not sure you could do one map and get the data to the point that someone would be able to read it. The reality is the public should be starting with the yellow document because it is a planning document, as you see. When this was adopted, it was this fiscal year all the way to 2018. If they want to know then when you want to build them and how much you’ll spending then they go to the second document which is thecapital improvements program, that is what you adopted to fund and construct. So depending on what point they are in the inquiry, at the very least, by going to the capital needs assessment, they can look at their particular planning subarea and discover over the next ten year period where going to have two fire stations, six schools, a police station, a library. Whereas, it is not neighborhood specific, it is the geographic region in whichit is going to be delivered. They could start dialoguing with you, with the school board --- about oh we see all these coming, here are some of out thoughts on where we want to see these facilities located. They are interestedin how much you’re spending and when it going to get built, we refer them to the capital improvement document that has been adopted and is also online then they can review that.

S. Kurtz I am wondering why we don’t provide the planning area. If I am checking in to see if I want to buy a house, why can’t I go to some site on our web system where I can check on a general area and go from there to see what is coming in the next 10 years.

E. Hatrick I think you could do that better when all of the sites on which we will be building schools and you are building public sites were proffered sites as part of subdivision development. The problem now we are purchasing site throughout the County. I don’t know…we know the areas in which we need schools, you know where you need libraries and fire stations. In most cases we don’t have identified sites for the projects that are more that a year or twoout. We can tell you a broad area that is what you see that in the Dulles South area, you’re going to have x schools, fire stations, libraries, community centers, but being site specific, unless I am missing something…

S. Kurtz I am not asking for site specific, but I want a little bit more…

E. Hatrick I heard you saying that if I am moving into a neighborhood, if I am moving into a subdivision, can I figure out what is going to happen in and around theplace where I live. I suggest to you that rather than proffers that went with that subdivision, I think it would be very difficult to predict if we don’t already own the land and have it. In most cases, we don’t own the land and we don’t know yet where the site will be.

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P. Brown I now understand your question. I think what we can do is a simple link that gives you the map of the planning subarea and the list of facilities by year that would be coming into that subarea. We could do that and simply that if that is what you’re asking.

S. Kurtz Yes, just being a member of the public, I would like to have a way get this information, even from my realtor if she could in fact give out and give it to me. My second question is that in looking at this collocation of capital facility, I understood you to say that this policy was adopted two years ago?

P. Brown It is a guideline and you’ll get a copy of this guideline to take with you.

S. Kurtz I was wondering if we could also at some point note know -- have any of these things actually been collocated.

S. Adamo The substation in Sterling right next to Rolling Ridge Elementary School. I think that was the very first thing, then we were talking to Paul and the Sheriff’s Department and we start finding any land and we did it…. When we talk about that, first with my staff then with Dr. Hatrick then it was brought to the School Board, I don’t think there was any hesitancy in our Board.

S. Kurtz So, that is one thing that we actually accomplished since...that was what I was wondering…I mean…good. Ms. Buckley do you have a question?

S. Buckley I know this discussion has been on CIP enrollment projection, how do they get involved in the other parts of this process, beginning with the revised plan…do they weigh in or what is the nature of their participation?

J. Pastor They definitely weigh in. Actually, when we devise the Revised General Plan, when we were going through the process, they were a referral just like they actually function as referral agents on a lot legislative activities. But specifically, we did do a fiscal impact of the Revised General Plan when we were preparing it, which results in that this much population, this much employment happening, these are the facilities that you’re going to need to serve that and what’s its going to cost and that is run by all of the agencies and the schools are involved in that. In the case of fire and rescue for instance, they got so specific that actually did do some service planning as part of the Comprehensive Plan. We don’t have to do Commission Permits for a lot of those facilities because we drew circles around those areas where we needed them. We did not do that for schools, we could have at your next worksession we may get in to some more discussion about what the opportunities are for, what Ms. Kurtz is saying in having some sort of an appendix to the plan that speaks to this whole capital needs assessment like what are we going to need and keep it up to date with our capital planning.

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So that we don’t have to keep on going back and doing Commission Permits for this facilities because these are the areas that they are needed or desired. We also hope that if we do get to the suburban area plan, to do more targetplanning for capital facilities to ascertain whether or not the service standards are right or appropriate for each subarea, they might not be. A certain subarea might be not really interested in dog parks or not really interested in whatever we have on the standards. So we could work that. I am not quite addressing your question. We do work together on these things,the problem that we have with schools in all honesty is that the schools establish their services standards. The County facilities, we develop a standard through a process where we have those agencies, develop services plans, research the standards, how many books per person or how many acres per whatever, and we take that through a service level discussion. That is the discussion we are hoping to have on the County side. And you heard Dr. Adamo talk about how they do it on the school side, but the County Board of Supervisors does not determine the service levels of the schools. And so, we can talk about or you can talk about where the school, I think that is one of the purpose of your committee is to talk about with them what kinds of schools are you looking at….two storey schools, how many acres per school, how many pupils per school. You are looking to weigh in on howto design standards on how to do it, but we don’t tell the school or the County does not tell the schools how many schools they need per pupil.

S. Buckley So, they are using their own triggers.

J. Pastor Correct. They do their own triggers and then they come in to our process because from a location perspective, that is the County’s role. The County’s role is…ok here are your standards, how many people, how many children are generated by those houses or whatever then we weigh in on this is where we want it. These are where the houses are going to go, or this are where the employees are going to work or whatever…that is how we connect.

S. Buckley That is very helpful information because the purpose of this committee is so both boards can collaborate. And I think the starting point is finding out where we diverge. You just pointed out that it is at the service levels.

J. Pastor That is correct.

S. Kurtz Are there any other questions on this particular topic? Ok, we have one member about to flee here. Looking at this agenda Paul, it looks like we have a total of 50 minutes dedicated on the overview of this…. 

P. Brown Quickly I have Kevin Lewis and Jim Rauch; we’ve given you the handouts of what they will present. So what we’d like to do at this point is to quickly tell you what those handouts are and they will come to the next meeting and we’ll get into details because actually it’s the…you get a role on how long it

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takes to do a capital project. It is the devil in the detail and actually at the next meeting, this is part of the homework assignment where we are going toidentify areas in this process that we think we could save time and money and have a dialogue with you about it. Kevin and Jim real quickly tell them what we are giving them.

K. Lewis I’ll start with the 11”x17” with the different colors, it is a typical project from one of the school projects. Specifically set up for elementary school and what you’re looking at is what we call the roll up version, it does not have all the individual task for this schedule, and it is looking at the main categories. The second page is simply the breakdown of those individual categories to help you with that, if you want to look at that. I thought it would be easier to understand if you look at it from a broad sense. The…there are several major categories; you can see it outlined – acquisition, project, and so on. The land acquisition is intended to talk about when we are buying a piece of property…it is our process. Dr. Adamo and I work in different phase of the project but we still come together and work together for land acquisition.

J. Burton I have one quick question, why in the world does it take 1086 days to purchase a non proffered site. I don’t understand.

K. Lewis Paul said it is the devil in the details there and part of what we are trying to express is that if you consider this to be a worse case situation of a rezoning application, it might take two years just for that. The first year that is getting to the bond, maybe I can point out the ink in the blue stripes are the differentfunding when there is currently exist in the capital improvements plan as we implement it now. The pink starts in November of year 2 once it gets to the bond and gets approval by the citizens. They that window typically last for two years until the funding is scheduled to come on board for the actual school project, for an elementary school at this point. So, that is what you’re seeing there as the window and the process is extending on both sides of thatwindow.

J. Burton I would like to talk off line about this because I don’t understand half of that stuff, why it has to be that way.

P. Brown Actually, that is the focal point of the August meeting. Why this timeline is what it is.

S. Kurtz So you don’t have to talk offline, we are going to talk about it in the meeting.

J. Burton I want to talk offline.

S. Kurtz Ok.

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K. Lewis The rest of this chart is simply showing that when you get to the blue sectionthat is the funding of the actual project is. The white windows on the page are our issues are, that’s what are challenges become, that is what the stress becomes in our project to squeeze on our architectural engineers on design on the County staff for review and ultimately on the contract to go in contraction. Ultimately, what we are trying to do is find ways to help those white sections from the schedule which are challenge area are, if we are in worse case situation. So we can certainly get into that and what generate all that. In the interest of time we need to get to the County part.

 J. Rauch Good afternoon. We have a handout that is similar, the landscape version, the smaller pages, the front cover, just like what Kevin has mentioned, is ourroll up of our major activities projects phases from the very beginning of a project. Buying a land all the way to occupancy of a building. Behind that is the detailed breakdown of the activities that make up each one of these. I think the only that I would add or mention is that we use this as a management tool; it is kind of a check list. The real value in it is I think all of these activities that are listed on this subsequent pages, is a good checklistfor us to make sure that we are aware of as we plan a project, everything thatcould possibly happen with the project in the way of permitting and all the other stuff in its phases. Everything on here generally will apply to most projects. Some projects, depending on the location, depending on the size of the project, not everything might apply for certain activity. In general, it is a pretty realistic timeframe and it is about five and a half year time frame. Starting with the land and moving into the….

P. Brown Before I forget, I do want to mention to the public that after this meeting, wewill be getting all the handouts and attachments and posted electronically on the website that were discussed here today. If you’re worried about having a copy of it, we will get those posted up on the internet. I am handing all your homework for August. Make sure you walk out with it. What is in this document is currently all the written guidelines that we use in a site acquisition and budgeting process. As you review that, we welcome your questions for the discussion in August. Right now that is all we have.

S. Kurtz Ok, thank you. I have a couple of question coming from the left. Mr. Burton?

J. Burton Not a question but I just want to make a comment. I look forward to the August meeting. Everyone knows now that we are in a different kind of an environment; we are in a business of buying sites. We have not been in that business big time in the past. It is no secret to anyone there is some problemsthat have arisen a little friction here and there between the two boards over this process. I hope we come out of these discussions in August with some kind of an agreement on how we are going to proceed collaboratively and

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the purchase of sites for facilities. We need to figure out a way for the two boards to work closely together in agreeing on the purchase of sites, particularly the school sites because that is where most of the action is. As you know, we have a couple of issues right now with the last two purchase contracts and we need to sort through those issues. It was my understanding that the School Board wants to come to the Finance Committee next Wednesday and discuss some of that, but we haven’t received any of the information that we have asked for so we could have a meaningful two way discussion.

T. Reed We will provide the information at the July 15th meeting. Mr. Dupree and I will be coming, and possibly Mr. Stevens.

J. Burton Ok, the July 15th. Well, see that is my point, the Finance Committee meets on the 16th, how can we prepare for a meaningful discussion. We asked for information, one could consider a FOIA request because it was requested four times verbally and in writing twice and nothing has shown up.

E. Hatrick Mr. Burton the information is coming in your pony delivery tomorrow. There is a letter from Mr. Dupree and information about the presentation on the 16th this will be distributed to the Board of Supervisors tomorrow. It has been transmitted to you. Don’t you have a pony delivery tomorrow?

J. Burton No, tonight…today.

E. Hatrick Oh, tonight.

J. Burton We have not received anything, not this afternoon. Nothing has shown up.

E. Hatrick It may have been

(comments made by Dr. Adamo, but the mic was turned off).

E. Hatrick I also might want to suggest that one of the reasons we request that we come before the Finance committee on the 16th is not to have everybody predetermine what the answers is going to be. I would hope that there is an opportunity for us to present the information then for you to take time to analyze the information. Once you’ve seen not only the documentation, but heard some of the explanations that go along with it. I don’t think we are looking to solve or finalize anything on the 16th. We are looking to present information that we hope will inform you about the process that the school board follows in setting a contract.

J. Burton In both contracts, Rouse and Lenah. They are the topics on the table right now. We have been dancing all around them for the last two hours and we need to find a way to do this better because it is a new era of buying sites

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and I would envision, coming out of all of this, a process by which we are involve in the negotiations with you for the sites. I just throw that out as my own opinion right now and I just throw it at you to think about. I look forward to receiving the information that we asked for and having a dialogueon the 16th.

S. Kurtz Ok Mr. Burton. Ms. Buckley do you have a comment then I have a comment?

S. Buckley I have a request in dealing with this very complex information. There is a sense of urgency because of the issues raised by Supervisor Burton. I think itis obvious, we can accomplish what we are trying to accomplish in the context of a two hour meeting. So I would --- that you and Mr. Reed discuss the possibility of a meeting, in addition to our regularly scheduled committeemeeting time, schedule worksessions or doing something like that. There is asense of urgency so I hope we can do that sooner vs. later and hopefully resolve some of these issues.

P. Brown I would ask just for the point of clarification, you have a long range agenda that has not identified the discussion on Rause and Lenah as work coming to this committee. So I would have to ask you as we are working through some of these issues, if you have immediate issue, you need to coordinate with Ms. Kurtz and Mr. Reed. Staff is not aware that we are going to discuss Lenah and Rouse, we have a long range agenda. So I just want to make sure that we are all in the same page about what is the agenda for each meeting. I don’t want it to do something you don’t need at that moment.

S. Buckley I know this meeting is very helpful. I think Supervisor Burton was talking about the Finance committee meeting. I guess Rouse and Lenah are suppose to be discussed at that meeting, but we are still trying to accomplish a collaboration on process and maybe outside of the context of these two issues, but there is still a sense of urgency. I am hoping that we could meet more often.

S. Kurtz Mr. Reed and I will certainly be willing to talk about it. Mr. Dupree, do you have anything that you want to contribute to this, not about Finance but about what we are discussing today.

R. Dupree Since I came up, I thought I would clarify but if you don’t want me to talk about it, then I won’t.

S. Kurtz What I heard from you all is that you’ll be coming to the Finance committee.

R. Dupree We were requested to provide information regarding the Lenah issue and I requested an opportunity for us to do so in a cooperative setting in the Finance committee that we would bring in information. I understand when I

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was out of pocket this week, that it became more of an urgent request to provide the information. So staff did work to get the information together. We still would like the opportunity. Today is the first time I’ve heard that wewant to talk about other issues than Lenah. It was not in the request originally. We certainly do anything but we need to be prepared ahead of time.

S. Kurtz I think that is fair so I will going to let you and Mr. Burton decide what you all will do.

R. Dupree I will be out of town so I ask him to coordinate with staff and just let me know because I will be out of town for the next few days.

S. Kurtz You’re not going to be there on the 16th?

R. Dupree I will be back by then.

S. Kurtz I think there is opportunity for that to happen. Can you do that offline? WhatI can also tell you in terms of, I think we are as a committee laying a background and working though the issues that we have. Tom and I have talked and I’ve run it by some of my board members, and those I run it by thinks it would be a good idea. This County is going to be on the development pressure, and pressure to get infrastructure, to have the facilities on the ground for quite a while. Both Tom and myself, it seems to me, I brought up the idea and you seem to agree, the School Board goes on aretreat and works out its strategic plan. We have a Board of Supervisors that is moving on July 23rd with its strategic plan. We have management, your top managers, and yourself go on retreat get your strategic areas together andso is the County Administration. The only two Boards who don’t do that andwho are facing the policy on the decision making, at least on the next four years, is the School Board and the Board of Supervisors. So Tom and I have felt that we would like to have these two Boards meet, in the November timeframe, and try to get a handle on what we are going to be facing, the challenges we are going to be facing and the major issues that would be before us, and opportunities we have for institutionalized collaboration for these goals in November. We are going to work together to set up the parameters and try to bring this, unless other members of the School Board do not want to do that, to bring this to an actual reality.

T. Reed I would second that as well. Just a reminder, in my first term back in 1999, we met with the Board of Supervisors in our first day in office. I think we need to do something like that, do it in an atmosphere away from the public eye. Not necessarily secretive, but in a time and place that we can be open with one another.

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S. Kurtz We will be looking for a facilitator. I thought I would let you all know that. If there is anything you would like to contribute and hope to gain from it, give it to the two of us and we will work it into the program. Is there any further question for anyone?

P. Godfrey Paul can you clarify the expectations on the homework again?

P. Brown The expectations were to read the first handout on the planning process, Chapters 3, 7, 8, 9, and 11 of the Revised General Plan. If you already read itthat helps. Are there any areas you want identified for further discussion for language change? Then the red packets are the internal staff guidelines on how they do land acquisition and site selection and the criteria that they go through to do that. So it is identifying areas you have further questions or want to change that process. Thank you.

S. Kurtz No further business, the meeting is adjourned.