engaging digital natives using the resources of web 2.0 to engage 21 st century students jennifer...
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Engaging Digital Engaging Digital NativesNatives
Using the resources of Web 2.0 to Using the resources of Web 2.0 to engage 21engage 21stst century students century students
Jennifer Carrier DormanJennifer Carrier DormanCentral Bucks School DistrictCentral Bucks School District
We are at a turning point We are at a turning point in the tech industry and in the tech industry and
perhaps even in the perhaps even in the history of the worldhistory of the world
Tim O’Reilly – Feb. 14 2006 Tim O’Reilly – Feb. 14 2006
Digital NativesDigital Natives
• It is now clear that as a result of this It is now clear that as a result of this ubiquitous information environment ubiquitous information environment and the sheer volume of their and the sheer volume of their interaction with it, today’s students interaction with it, today’s students think and process information think and process information fundamentally differently fundamentally differently from their from their predecessors.predecessors.– Marc Prensky – “Digital Natives, Digital Marc Prensky – “Digital Natives, Digital
Immigrants” 2001Immigrants” 2001
Digital NativesDigital Natives
• ““Different kinds of experiences lead Different kinds of experiences lead to different brain structures” - Dr. to different brain structures” - Dr. Bruce D. Berry of Baylor College of Bruce D. Berry of Baylor College of Medicine. Medicine. – it is very likely that it is very likely that our students’ brains our students’ brains
have physically changed have physically changed – and are – and are different from ours – as a result of how different from ours – as a result of how they grew upthey grew up
Who are the digital natives?Who are the digital natives?
• Our students today are all “native Our students today are all “native speakers” of the digital language of speakers” of the digital language of computers, video games, and the Internet.computers, video games, and the Internet.
• Those of us who were not born into the Those of us who were not born into the digital world but have, at some later point digital world but have, at some later point in our lives, become fascinated by and in our lives, become fascinated by and adopted many or most aspects of the new adopted many or most aspects of the new technology are technology are Digital ImmigrantsDigital Immigrants..
The ChallengeThe Challenge
• Our Digital Immigrant instructors, Our Digital Immigrant instructors, who speak an outdated language who speak an outdated language (that of the pre-digital age), are (that of the pre-digital age), are struggling to teach a population that struggling to teach a population that speaks an entirely new languagespeaks an entirely new language
The Nomadic Grazing Patterns The Nomadic Grazing Patterns of Digital Nativesof Digital Natives• Digital Natives are used to receiving Digital Natives are used to receiving
information really fast. information really fast. • They like to parallel process and multi-task. They like to parallel process and multi-task. • They prefer their graphics They prefer their graphics before before their text their text
rather than the opposite. rather than the opposite. • They prefer random access (like hypertext). They prefer random access (like hypertext). • They function best when networked. They function best when networked. • They thrive on instant gratification and They thrive on instant gratification and
frequent rewards. frequent rewards. • They prefer games to “serious” work. They prefer games to “serious” work.
MethodologyMethodology
• Today’s teachers have to learn to Today’s teachers have to learn to communicate in the language and style communicate in the language and style of their students.of their students.– This This doesn’t doesn’t mean changing the meaning mean changing the meaning
of what is important, or of good thinking of what is important, or of good thinking skills. skills.
• It it It it does does mean going faster, less step-mean going faster, less step-by step, more in parallel, with more by step, more in parallel, with more random access, among other things.random access, among other things.
The New WWWThe New WWW
• WhateverWhatever
• WheneverWhenever
• WhereverWherever– Tom March, Web-based educator, Tom March, Web-based educator,
author, and instructional designerauthor, and instructional designer
The New WWWThe New WWW
• The New WWW—offering us The New WWW—offering us whateverwhatever we we want, want, wheneverwhenever and and whereverwherever we want it— we want it—may seem like just an extension of our may seem like just an extension of our already-technology-enhanced contemporary already-technology-enhanced contemporary lifelife
• To counteract the New WWW's potentially To counteract the New WWW's potentially harmful impact on youth, educators must harmful impact on youth, educators must use technology to create learning use technology to create learning experiences that are real, rich, and relevant experiences that are real, rich, and relevant
What is Web 2.0?What is Web 2.0?
• Web 2.0 is a term often applied to a Web 2.0 is a term often applied to a perceived ongoing transition of the perceived ongoing transition of the World Wide Web from a collection of World Wide Web from a collection of static websites to a full-fledged static websites to a full-fledged computing platform serving web computing platform serving web applications to end users. applications to end users. – Tim O’ReillyTim O’Reilly
Web 1.0 Web 1.0 Web 2.0 Web 2.0
• oFoto oFoto Flickr Flickr
• Britannica Britannica Wikipedia Wikipedia
• Personal web sites Personal web sites Blogging Blogging
• Publishing Publishing Participating Participating
• Directories (taxonomy) Directories (taxonomy) Tagging Tagging (folksonomy)(folksonomy)
• Stickiness Stickiness Syndication Syndication
• Backflip Backflip del.icio.us, furl, etc. del.icio.us, furl, etc.
Web 2.0Web 2.0
• Static content transformed by Static content transformed by dynamic participationdynamic participation
• CommunitiesCommunities
• NetworksNetworks
• Read/writeRead/write
BlogsBlogs
BlogsBlogs
• A blog is a website for which an individual or a A blog is a website for which an individual or a group frequently generates text, photographs, group frequently generates text, photographs, video or audio files, and/or links, typically (but video or audio files, and/or links, typically (but not always) on a daily basis. not always) on a daily basis.
• The term is a shortened form of weblog. The term is a shortened form of weblog. • Authoring a blog, maintaining a blog or adding Authoring a blog, maintaining a blog or adding
an article to an existing blog is called "blogging". an article to an existing blog is called "blogging". • Individual articles on a blog are called "blog Individual articles on a blog are called "blog
posts," "posts," or "entries". posts," "posts," or "entries". • The person who posts these entries is called a The person who posts these entries is called a
"blogger". "blogger".
BlogsBlogs
• Every blog is in fact a web site, and Every blog is in fact a web site, and could be used just like any other web could be used just like any other web site. site.
• The difference is that a blog has The difference is that a blog has some kind of tool that makes some kind of tool that makes updates, or posts, very easy to do. updates, or posts, very easy to do.
Why the sudden popularity of Why the sudden popularity of blogs?blogs?
• RSS - Really Simple Syndication RSS - Really Simple Syndication • With RSS, you don't have to go to the With RSS, you don't have to go to the
web site any more. web site any more. – Instead, when you see a blog you like Instead, when you see a blog you like
that offers RSS all you have to do is that offers RSS all you have to do is copy the RSS code on the site into an copy the RSS code on the site into an "RSS Aggregator" like "RSS Aggregator" like BloglinesBloglines. .
– Then, whenever that site has new Then, whenever that site has new content your Aggregator tells you. content your Aggregator tells you.
RSS Aggregator – BloglinesRSS Aggregator – Bloglines
Blogs in School?Blogs in School?
• Blogs are tools, and like any tools Blogs are tools, and like any tools they can be used or misused. they can be used or misused. – Misuse occurs more often when there's a Misuse occurs more often when there's a
lack of instruction. (MySpace, Xanga)lack of instruction. (MySpace, Xanga)
• Interactivity, publishing, collective Interactivity, publishing, collective intelligenceintelligence
Blogs in SchoolBlogs in School
Teacher BlogsTeacher Blogs
• HomeworkHomework
• Keep Parents in the Keep Parents in the LoopLoop
• Virtual InserviceVirtual Inservice
Student BlogsStudent Blogs
• This week in class, This week in class, we...we...
• Student WorkStudent Work
Why Students Shouldn’t Why Students Shouldn’t BlogBlog• People will read it. People will read it.
• People might not like it. People might not like it.
• They might share test answers with others. They might share test answers with others.
• They might be found by a child predator online They might be found by a child predator online
• They might write something inappropriate. They might write something inappropriate.
• They might find something inappropriate. They might find something inappropriate.
• They might get other students to start blogging. They might get other students to start blogging.
Why Students Should BlogWhy Students Should Blog
• People will read it. People will read it. • They might like it. They might like it. • They might share what they've learned with They might share what they've learned with
others. others. • They might participate in a collaborative They might participate in a collaborative
learning project. learning project. • They might become inspired to learn. They might become inspired to learn. • They might inspire others to learn. They might inspire others to learn. • They might get other students to start blogging. They might get other students to start blogging. • If they don't talk in class, they might on a blog. If they don't talk in class, they might on a blog.
Blog HostingBlog Hosting
• Blogger - Blogger - http://http://www.blogger.comwww.blogger.com//
• Blogmeister - Blogmeister - http://http://classblogmeister.comclassblogmeister.com//
• NovemberLearning - NovemberLearning - http://http://nlcommunities.comnlcommunities.com//
• Edublogs - Edublogs - http://http://edublogs.orgedublogs.org//
PodcastsPodcasts
PodcastsPodcasts
• iPod + Broadcast = PodcastiPod + Broadcast = Podcast– Podcasting is the method of distributing Podcasting is the method of distributing
multimedia files, such as audio multimedia files, such as audio programs or music videos, over the programs or music videos, over the Internet using either the RSS or Atom Internet using either the RSS or Atom syndication formats, for playback on syndication formats, for playback on mobile devices and personal computers. mobile devices and personal computers.
Why use podcasts?Why use podcasts?
• Podcasts enable students to share Podcasts enable students to share their knowledge and expertise with their knowledge and expertise with others through a creative outlet.others through a creative outlet.
• Podcasts tap into a mode of media Podcasts tap into a mode of media input that is commonplace for digital input that is commonplace for digital natives.natives.
How can podcasts be used?How can podcasts be used?
• In the classroom, educators and students In the classroom, educators and students can use podcastscan use podcasts to to informinform others about others about class news, current events, and areas of class news, current events, and areas of interest.interest.
• Students can use a podcastStudents can use a podcast forum to forum to persuadepersuade their peers to help others, make their peers to help others, make a difference, or try something new. a difference, or try something new.
• Podcasts can also be used to edutain Podcasts can also be used to edutain others through creative others through creative narrativesnarratives..
How can podcasts be used?How can podcasts be used?
• Podcasts engage students in thinking Podcasts engage students in thinking critically about their speaking fluency critically about their speaking fluency and communication skills. and communication skills.
• The opportunity to create a show The opportunity to create a show about what students would like to about what students would like to discuss and share with others is discuss and share with others is extremely motivating.extremely motivating.
Other Enduring BenefitsOther Enduring Benefits
• Along with the use of technology there Along with the use of technology there are certain responsibilities that are certain responsibilities that educators and students need to follow. educators and students need to follow. – Educators need to instruct students on safe Educators need to instruct students on safe
and acceptable use of technology in and and acceptable use of technology in and outside of the classroom. outside of the classroom.
– Not only do students need to learn how to Not only do students need to learn how to appropriately research, but also how to appropriately research, but also how to safely and properly share information online. safely and properly share information online.
– Podcasts allow students to learn first hand Podcasts allow students to learn first hand about copyright laws and fair use issues.about copyright laws and fair use issues.
Creating a PodcastCreating a Podcast1.1. Record an audio file. (Record an audio file. (AudacityAudacity))2.2. Edit your audio and add music if you Edit your audio and add music if you
wish. (copyright and fair use issues)wish. (copyright and fair use issues)3.3. Convert the file to an mp3 format. (Convert the file to an mp3 format. (
LAME mp3 encoder libraryLAME mp3 encoder library))4.4. Upload the file to a web server. (Upload the file to a web server. (GCastGCast
and and AudiobloggerAudioblogger are both free) are both free)5.5. Create an RSS feed. (Create an RSS feed. (GCastGCast and and
AudiobloggerAudioblogger will create the feed for you) will create the feed for you)6.6. Listen and share your podcast.Listen and share your podcast.
Examples of Classroom Examples of Classroom PodcastsPodcasts
• Educational Podcast Network - The LaEducational Podcast Network - The Landmark Projectndmark Project
• Radio Radio WillowWebWillowWeb
• Room 208 PodcastRoom 208 Podcast
• Mr. Mayo's Audio PageMr. Mayo's Audio Page
• Coulee Kids PodcastCoulee Kids Podcast
• Mrs. D’s ProducersMrs. D’s Producers
Examples of Educational Examples of Educational PodcastsPodcasts
• Monticello PodcastsMonticello Podcasts • Smithsonian PodcastsSmithsonian Podcasts • Colonial WilliamsburgColonial Williamsburg • PodictionaryPodictionary • Speaking of HistorySpeaking of History • Teach42 PodcastsTeach42 Podcasts • Discovery Channel PodcastsDiscovery Channel Podcasts • NPR PodcastsNPR Podcasts • PRI Program PodcastsPRI Program Podcasts
Pedagogy for PodcastingPedagogy for Podcasting
• Education Podcast NetworkEducation Podcast Network
• University of Wisconsin-Madison PodcUniversity of Wisconsin-Madison Podcastingasting
• Pod PedagogyPod Pedagogy
Online Podcasting Online Podcasting ResourcesResources
http://jdorman.wikispaces.com/+Podcasting
WikisWikis
What is a Wiki?What is a Wiki?
• A A wikiwiki is a type of website that is a type of website that allows users easily to add, remove, allows users easily to add, remove, or otherwise edit and change most or otherwise edit and change most available content.available content.
How is a Wiki Constructed?How is a Wiki Constructed?
• A single page in a A single page in a wikiwiki is referred to is referred to as a "wiki page", while the entire as a "wiki page", while the entire body of pages, which are usually body of pages, which are usually highly interconnected via hyperlinks, highly interconnected via hyperlinks, is "the wiki"; in effect, a wiki is is "the wiki"; in effect, a wiki is actually a very simple, easy-to-use actually a very simple, easy-to-use user-maintained database for user-maintained database for searching and creating information. searching and creating information.
Are Wikis Safe?Are Wikis Safe?
• Wikis are generally designed with the Wikis are generally designed with the philosophy of making it easy to correct philosophy of making it easy to correct mistakes, rather than making it difficult to mistakes, rather than making it difficult to make them. make them.
• Thus while wikis are very open, they Thus while wikis are very open, they provide a means to verify the validity of provide a means to verify the validity of recent additions to the body of pages. recent additions to the body of pages. – The most prominent, on almost every wiki, is The most prominent, on almost every wiki, is
the "Recent Changes" page—a specific list the "Recent Changes" page—a specific list numbering recent edits, or a list of all the edits numbering recent edits, or a list of all the edits made within a given timeframe. made within a given timeframe.
Tracking ChangesTracking Changes
Managing WikisManaging Wikis
Using Wikis as a SourceUsing Wikis as a Source• Wikipedia is as reliable as the external Wikipedia is as reliable as the external
sources we rely on. sources we rely on. • Properly written articles cite the sources, Properly written articles cite the sources,
and a reader should rely on the Wikipedia and a reader should rely on the Wikipedia article as much, but no more, than the article as much, but no more, than the sources the article relies on. sources the article relies on.
• If an article doesn't cite a source, it may or If an article doesn't cite a source, it may or may not be reliable. may not be reliable.
• Students should never use information in a Students should never use information in a wiki until they have checked those wiki until they have checked those external sources. external sources.
Ways to Use WikisWays to Use Wikis
• Use wikis as formats for subject Use wikis as formats for subject guides. guides.
• Invite students and teachers to Invite students and teachers to annotate your catalog on a wiki. annotate your catalog on a wiki.
• Make wikis meeting places for Make wikis meeting places for communities inside the school. communities inside the school.
• Link librarians and teachers in your Link librarians and teachers in your district in a collaborative enterprise. district in a collaborative enterprise.
Professional Learning Professional Learning CommunitiesCommunities
What the Experts are SayingWhat the Experts are Saying
• Wikis are helping young people Wikis are helping young people develop “writing skills and social develop “writing skills and social skills by learning about group skills by learning about group consensus and compromise—all the consensus and compromise—all the virtues you need to be a reasonable virtues you need to be a reasonable and productive member of society.” and productive member of society.” – Jimmy Wales, founder of WikipediaJimmy Wales, founder of Wikipedia
What the Experts are SayingWhat the Experts are Saying
• ““The media is controlled by people The media is controlled by people who have the resources to control it,” who have the resources to control it,” he says. “Wikis show that all of us he says. “Wikis show that all of us have an equal opportunity to have an equal opportunity to contribute to knowledge.” contribute to knowledge.” – Andy Garvin, head of the Digital Divide Andy Garvin, head of the Digital Divide
Network Network
Social Social LearningLearning
Social BookmarkingSocial Bookmarking
• Del.icio.usDel.icio.us
• FurlFurl
• BlinkListBlinkList
Social NetworkingSocial Networking
• FlickrFlickr
• TaDaListTaDaList
• BaseCampBaseCamp
• ClipmarksClipmarks
• Yahoo! AnswersYahoo! Answers
• ProtopageProtopage
• RallyPointRallyPoint
• ShadowsShadows
Photo Editing ToolsPhoto Editing Tools
Phixr Phixr http://http://www.phixr.comwww.phixr.com//
Pxn8 Pxn8 http://pxn8.com/http://pxn8.com/
Picasa Picasa http://http://picasa.google.compicasa.google.com//
GIMP GIMP http://http://www.gimp.orgwww.gimp.org/windows//windows/
Free Serif PhotoPlus Free Serif PhotoPlus http://http://www.freeserifsoftware.comwww.freeserifsoftware.com//
Paint.Net Paint.Net http://http://www.eecs.wsu.edu/paint.netwww.eecs.wsu.edu/paint.net//
Pixia Pixia http://park18.wakwak.com/~pixia/http://park18.wakwak.com/~pixia/
PhotoFiltrePhotoFiltre http://http://photofiltre.free.fr/frames_en.htmphotofiltre.free.fr/frames_en.htm
Ultimate PaintUltimate Paint http://http://www.ultimatepaint.comwww.ultimatepaint.com//
VCW VicMan’s Photo VCW VicMan’s Photo EditorEditor
http://http://www.vicman.net/vcwphoto/index.htmwww.vicman.net/vcwphoto/index.htm
ImageForgeImageForge http://http://www.cursorarts.com/ca_imffw.htmlwww.cursorarts.com/ca_imffw.html
Video Editing ToolsVideo Editing Tools
Eye Spot Online Video Mixing Eye Spot Online Video Mixing http://http://eyespot.comeyespot.com//
Jump Cut Online Video EditorJump Cut Online Video Editor http://http://jumpcut.comjumpcut.com//
Windows Movie MakerWindows Movie Maker http://www.microsoft.com/http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/moviemaker/default.mspwindowsxp/using/moviemaker/default.mspxx
Avid Free DVAvid Free DV http://http://www.avid.com/freedvwww.avid.com/freedv//
Storyboard ProStoryboard Pro http://http://www.atomiclearning.com/storyboardprowww.atomiclearning.com/storyboardpro
Microsoft PhotoStoryMicrosoft PhotoStory http://www.microsoft.com/http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxpwindowsxp/using//using/digitalphotography/photostory/default.mspxdigitalphotography/photostory/default.mspx
Classroom ResourcesClassroom Resources
• SCORE Virtual Projects and Field Trips SCORE Virtual Projects and Field Trips (History/Social Studies) -(History/Social Studies) - http://score.rims.k12.ca.us/virtual/http://score.rims.k12.ca.us/virtual/
• SCORE Real World Mathematics -SCORE Real World Mathematics - http://score.kings.k12.ca.us/real.world.htmlhttp://score.kings.k12.ca.us/real.world.html
• SCORE Language Arts Activity Bank -SCORE Language Arts Activity Bank - http://www.sdcoe.k12.ca.us/SCORE/actbank/actbank.htmlhttp://www.sdcoe.k12.ca.us/SCORE/actbank/actbank.html
• SCORE Science Resources -SCORE Science Resources - http://scorescience.humboldt.k12.ca.us/http://scorescience.humboldt.k12.ca.us/
• Module Maker for Online Research Modules -Module Maker for Online Research Modules - http://questioning.org/module/module.htmlhttp://questioning.org/module/module.html
• Filamentality -Filamentality - http://http://www.kn.pacbell.com/wired/filwww.kn.pacbell.com/wired/fil//
Classroom ResourcesClassroom Resources
• Tapped In online educational/classroom community Tapped In online educational/classroom community http://http://tappedin.org/tappedintappedin.org/tappedin//
• Survey Monkey online surveys Survey Monkey online surveys http://www.surveymonkey.com/http://www.surveymonkey.com/
• NiceNet online discussion board NiceNet online discussion board http://http://www.nicenet.orgwww.nicenet.org • Task Oriented Questions / Bloom’s Taxonomy - Task Oriented Questions / Bloom’s Taxonomy -
http://www.stedwards.edu/cte/resources/bwheel.htmhttp://www.stedwards.edu/cte/resources/bwheel.htm• MarcoPolo Internet Content for the Classroom - MarcoPolo Internet Content for the Classroom -
http://www.marcopolo-education.org/home.aspxhttp://www.marcopolo-education.org/home.aspx• NARA Educational Resources - NARA Educational Resources -
http://www.archives.gov/education/collaboration.htmlhttp://www.archives.gov/education/collaboration.html• Federal Resources for Education Excellence - Federal Resources for Education Excellence -
http://www.ed.gov/free/index.html http://www.ed.gov/free/index.html • Blue Web’N (A Library of Blue Ribbon Learning Sites) - Blue Web’N (A Library of Blue Ribbon Learning Sites) -
http://www.kn.pacbell.com/wired/bluewebn/ http://www.kn.pacbell.com/wired/bluewebn/
Classroom ResourcesClassroom Resources
• NoteStar enhanced research tools NoteStar enhanced research tools http://notestar.4teachers.org/http://notestar.4teachers.org/
• RubiStar rubric creation tools RubiStar rubric creation tools http://rubistar.4teachers.org/index.phphttp://rubistar.4teachers.org/index.php
• QuizStar online quiz creation tools QuizStar online quiz creation tools http://quizstar.4teachers.org/http://quizstar.4teachers.org/
• TrackStar online hotlist and Internet activity creation tools TrackStar online hotlist and Internet activity creation tools http://trackstar.4teachers.org/http://trackstar.4teachers.org/
• Web Worksheet Wizard Web Worksheet Wizard http://wizard.4teachers.org/http://wizard.4teachers.org/• Project Poster online project-based activity creation tools Project Poster online project-based activity creation tools
http://poster.4teachers.org/http://poster.4teachers.org/• Discovery School Puzzle Maker Discovery School Puzzle Maker http://http://www.puzzlemaker.comwww.puzzlemaker.com
//• National Library of Virtual Manipulatives National Library of Virtual Manipulatives
http://nlvm.usu.edu/en/nav/vlibrary.html http://nlvm.usu.edu/en/nav/vlibrary.html
WebQuestsWebQuests• A WebQuest for K-12 Teachers utilizing the WebGuide Template - A WebQuest for K-12 Teachers utilizing the WebGuide Template -
Internet4Classrooms version - Internet4Classrooms version - http://www.internet4classrooms.com/lesson_plan_quest.htmhttp://www.internet4classrooms.com/lesson_plan_quest.htm
• WebQuest Template - http://www.internet4classrooms.com/lesson-WebQuest Template - http://www.internet4classrooms.com/lesson-template.htm template.htm
• San Diego State University Educational Technology Department San Diego State University Educational Technology Department WebQuests Page - http://webquest.sdsu.edu/WebQuests Page - http://webquest.sdsu.edu/
• Best WebQuests - http://bestwebquests.com/Best WebQuests - http://bestwebquests.com/• WebQuest Templates SDSU - WebQuest Templates SDSU -
http://webquest.sdsu.edu/LessonTemplate.htmlhttp://webquest.sdsu.edu/LessonTemplate.html• Teachnology WebQuest Generator - http://teachers.teach-Teachnology WebQuest Generator - http://teachers.teach-
nology.com/web_tools/web_quest/nology.com/web_tools/web_quest/• Differentiated Instruction WebQuests - Differentiated Instruction WebQuests -
http://www.lakelandschools.org/EDTECH/Differentiation/nine.htmhttp://www.lakelandschools.org/EDTECH/Differentiation/nine.htm• Using the Using the Understanding By DesignUnderstanding By Design Model to create WebQuests - Model to create WebQuests -
http://www.bclacts.org/Using%20Ubd%20to%20design%20ahttp://www.bclacts.org/Using%20Ubd%20to%20design%20a%20webquest.pdf%20webquest.pdf
David Thornburg – David Thornburg – Campfires in Campfires in CyberspaceCyberspace
• The main thing that's holding The main thing that's holding technology back is ... a fear--a well-technology back is ... a fear--a well-placed fear, I might add--that if placed fear, I might add--that if technology becomes ubiquitous, it will technology becomes ubiquitous, it will totally transform the practice of totally transform the practice of education. There are a lot of people education. There are a lot of people who don't want the practice of who don't want the practice of education transformed, because they're education transformed, because they're very comfortable with it. very comfortable with it.