Interior to Lower Mainland Project• Record of All Communications with First Nations

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I Project IName:. ILM I

Meeting: XoFirst Nation:

Letter: 0

Nlaka'pamux Nations

Email: 0 Telephone:

Date: 2007/09/13(yy,mon,dd)

Initiated by: Darrell Mounsey(first and last name)

Recipient: Raymond Phillips, Legal Counsel for Nlaka'pamux Nations(position title, first

and last name)

Attendees: Chief Byron Spinks (CBS), Lytton (Chair)(if appropriate name» Chief Fred Sampson (CFS), Siska(position title, first and

last Chief Harold Aljam, Coldwater

Chief David Walkem (CDW), Cooks Ferry

Chief Percy Joe (CPJ), Shackan

Chief Arlene Quinn, Nicomen

Chief Prescott Skackelly, Nooaitch

Councillor Harold Joe (HJ), Lower Nicola

Councillor Mike Cambell, Boothroyd

Councillor Jim Brown (JB), Lytton

Councillor Fred Charlie, Lytton

Councillor Sherri Mcintyre, Skuppah

Councillor Rolene Edwards, Nicomen

Les Liebrandt (LL), CEO, Nicola Tribal Association

Gerald Etienne (GE), Band Manager, Shackan

John Warren, Adminsitartor, Spuzzum

Raymond Phillips (RP), Legal Cousel

Alison Duncan, Reseracher (and recorder), NNTC

(John Winsmith, Innegex: Kwoiek IPP)

Keith Anderson (KA), ARN

Melissa Holland (MH). BCTC

Charles Littledale, ARN

Darrell Mounsey, ARN

Julian Wake, ARN

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BChgdroKey Discussion

Summary:(150 word max.)

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Full Contact CFS: opening prayerNotes: CBS: Welcome. Nlaka'pamux Nations are taking stock of their position on how to

(If applicable. work together. The ILM is one of many projects. Those Chiefs who cannot beEx. meeting minutes, present today will be briefed. Any outcomes will be taken to the communities for

no word max.) their approval. This project is a priority betaise of its high impact. Now, they allneedgood information so that a response can be made. He noted the need tounderstand Nalka'pamux history and that the Fraser Rivers Wars Symposium isnext weekend at which Chief Spintlum's memory will be honoured.MH provided background on the project, its need, regulatory processes and theproject team. She described the definition phase to the end of 2009 whe permitswill be secured and the construction phase to the end of 2014.KA described how this is one of 13 to 20 major capital projects currently proposedor underway by BCH and this one has most FN's involved.HJ asked about rumours that BCH transmission lines may be sold to the US.MH replied that ths rumour had started after the government took steps to enablemore privatization in the province but realized that BCH's asets belong to thepeople of the province. No such plans for sale are known (although it is notknown if cabinet has said so). BCTC is set up so that sales are not possible.She described how the choice of the new transmission line was made: it canmostly parralel the existing line, despite challenges such as in the Canyon andspotted owl habitat. Route refinements will be made after more discussion withFirst Nations: several options are possible. The application to the BCUC for aCPCN will be made without knowing the final route adjustments, caknowlledgingthe need for more consultation and baseline study. She identified the five optionsfor a new series capacitor station ..In answer to questions from GE, CBS and CFS,MH and KA explained anticipated growth in demand for power, factors that coulddiminsh or increase or take care of that demand (such as a generator in theLower mainland, new technology). This line will add between 640 and 1600megawatts to the supply. The anticipated schedule and the possibilities offluctuations were outlined. They said that Site C is being consdiered as well asnew gerenerating units at Revelsoke (for which infrastructure is already built).In answer to questions from CPS, CBS and RP,MH and KA explained the history of BC's energy self-sufficiency, sales to andfrom the US and how sales to the US offset costs of infrastructure. The describedhow IPP's contribute to the supply and their relationship to BCTC and BCH.There is no plan now to upgrade the Canyon line. The next big upgrade could beKelly Lake to Shikay 2020-2026. They explained how the application to BCUC isbased on needs and justification. BCUC may require more detail, including costs,or it could say that another alternative should be proposed to fix the (supply)problem, or it may approve the next level of spending on the ILM project. Thenext big step is to get and Environmental Assessment Certificate.RP noted that the short time for this BCUC application is a problem. He asked:Does the BCUC process include public hearings? What criteria does BCUC usefor adeqaute FN consultation? Is it a line item or formal? Does BCUC ask BCHhow it plans to pay for the project?KA and MH noted that First Nations had been given project information since2006. The question is whether or not the group is comfortable about the need forthe line. Is there more information that BCH can provide? It is not yet known ifthe BCUC will hold public hearings or call for written submissions. It will be 9 to12 months before it either approves or gives furher direction to BCH. Thesubmission will show what consultation has been done to-date and the respond towhat intervenors require. Later they explained how budgeting has been approvedby a request in the past to BCUC to pay for consultation through the definition

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phase (permitting).A long discussion ensued about rates, revenue going to maintenance and assetdevelopment, depreciation schedules, cost recovery and returns on equity. Moreexplanation of costs to ratepayers and proft was provide later in the meeting inresponse to questions from CFS, CDW, CPS, GE and LL.KA and MH said the current project costs are between $531 and $736 million andagreed to arrange for a financial expert to meet with the group and explain thefinancial aspects of BCH and BCTC's operations. Now is the time to do whateveris necessary to identify impacts.HJ spoke of the need for the GVRD to share benefits with the hinterland and FirstNations. Benefits the GVRD and the military-industrial complex down south havebeen at their expense.JB provided some Nlaka'pamux history and how they had fought to protect theirlands which were now disappearing to rights-of-way. BCH needs to pay for oneNlaka-pamux person to provide information and work with the group. They mustknow what will be lost and therefore need heli-flyovers. There is nobody here totalk about compensation for lost territory which is priority one. Approval is beingsought before meaningful consultation.CFS said you just have to look around to see how ROW's had affected theterritory, economy and culture. There is no compensation 'for pastencroachments on the table yet which are happening at so many levels. Just atake-it-or-Ieave-it approach which is not what the Nlaka'pamux seek. Capacity isneeded for language and culture. A TUS is critical. Any disturbance chaspotential to reveal an important resource like medicines or food or a sacred site.The Siska cannot seen the need for the line without benefit to Siska.CDW asked why Fist Nations should say yes without benefits. He referred to theColumbia River Treaty. Effects of past projects must be taken into consideration.Why would BCH not consdier revenue sharing as pipeline companies in the northare?KA said that the Columbia River Treaty provides benefits to residents of theColumbia Valley. BCH is not now asking First Nations to say yes. It isunderstandable that the process can seem like a steamroller. BCH is asking for aprocess to work together and address the question of accommodation whereneeded. Where avoidace and mitigation is not possible, then compensationshould be discussed. BCH wants to know who to work with on this process.AD said that issues of trespass have not yet been resolved. The BC governmentis imposing a process and assuming authroity contrary to court rulings. TheChiefs are fighting the same battles as in 1858 with many issues like the railwaystill unsettled. The Nlaka'pamux do not live by that system and must be at thetable which makes the rules. It is unnerving for a reasearcher to see the samethings happening from Ashcroft to Spuzzum.CBS said that there are real concerns with an imposed process and with howeach agency brings issues in a piecemeal way. Cannot look at one withoutregard for the whole territory. There is a need for a big picture review paid for byproponents covering impacts of mine. Forestry, transport cooridors andtransmission lines. The EA proces is not wide enough in scope.Nlaka'pamuxknowledge must be marshalled to protect the interests of future generations.CPJexpressed disgust that even as land is alienated from Nlaka'pamux without anybeneft to them, they still have to pay their Hydro rates. There are two manycorridors without consultation. Now is the time to change that. Nobody askedhim how much it would cost to consult. Talking with BCH is time away fromworking for his people.KA replied that the budgeting was only based on estimates. BCH is asking whatcapacity funding is needed, including Nlaka'pamux costs.

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Lunch

CBS mentioned that the map of Nlaka'pamux territory had been accepted by theCrown in 1987. This area was what was needed to be self-sustaining for which

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they were responsible, treating it and all on it with respect. Title and rights stemfrom that. Now they wwant real partnerships with any and all proponents whowant to operate in their territory ..

KA summarized BCH's priorities: negotiate capacity funding agreements inwhatever way they wanted (Band by Band or together); work out an agreement toget through the process (BCH is open to proposed processes); the process needsthe outcome of identifying the effects of the project on the Nlaka'pamux within 10months according to the schedule. Then discuss how to move forward with morecapacity funding and accommodation.MH summarized BCTC's priorities: have the necessary information so that theproject can be designed to avoid or mitigate effects, or work out compensation.There is the Working Group meeting next week with Golder who will discusseffects on the environment. There are AlA's to do as well as other studies to bepart of the Application for an EAC.RP summarized Nlaka'pamux priorities: Arrange a number of meetings on how toapproach the Project in which discussion will:

• include an assessment past impacts of the existing line which would berealistic even though the EA process only addresses some widening ordeviations from that line built in the 1970's.

• Capacity funding up-front;• No one band owns title. It is held in common, therefore there will be

negotaition on that basis, unlike in the past;• This meeting has been a get-to-know meeting so that issues are better

understood;• Resolve the question of past impacts;• AlA's on proposed project route an whole of existing route;• TUS to cover whole of existing corridor where uses continue;• Approval from all Nlaka'pamux communities will be needed;• Some communities are more affected than others but approval of all is

needed; BCH must understand and use Nlaka'pamux approval process.They must give informedconsent (unlike open house processess);

• Accommodation will go to the Nations as a whole, earmarked forlanguage;

• From this day forward there will be a relationship but it must benefitNlaka'pamux

• A small group will be struck to address these things;• Revenue-sharing must be on the table.

He noted that the Columbia River Treaty Trust does benefit communities thereeven though they losy all their sockeye. The Trust is their compensation.Nlaka'pamux want to wean themselves from 90% dependency on federalprograms and BCH can be a part of that.

KA thanked him for this clarity and asked how the smaller group will work, howthe question of greater impacts on some than others will be worked out so thatnobody will come to the table later and say that their interests were notaddressed? BCH is open to hearing more on impact assessment of existing linesbut noted that BCH is not the province Even though a Crown corporation, BCHhas no mandate to address right and title. He also suggested that revenuesharing is one form of compensation. There are others and BCH is open to seewhat from is best. An evaluation of appropriate compensation does followassessment of impacts.CDW suggested that revenue sharing might be considered a line item like "rent",a cost of doing business which rate payers should know. Other proponents havesaid "identfy impacts first" and have then ignored the issue. Benefits must beworked out up-front, sooner rather than later. Total impacts of this andassociated projects in the territory should be assessed. It is a question of areaimpacts as well as such things as wildlife.KA said those discussions can take place as a TUS is done. Negotiations can

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start without knowing where they will end up. BCH is happy to start discussionsas soon as feasible.

MH said that BCUC mustapprove anything that increases rates. BCUC is thethrid party at that table. BCUC can be approached about this separately from theproject's CPCN application.JB cautioned that other such assessments can take 28 years. Nlaka'pamux willwork out its approach internally.CFS questioned the Terms of reference which did not have First Nation interestsin every bullet. He also questioned whether they weretalking t the right people.He and others want a liaison person who can be an advocate. They would like tomeetwith Elmer Derrick or Gerald Wesley, BCH Board members.MH pointed out that the province wants a separate chapter documenting FirstNation interests but BCH is open to respond in whatever way First Nations wish toshare information.KA said that the team can make decisions about the project. Liaisons have aninformation-sharing role .

. RP said the next steps id Nlaka'pamux internal organizing, arrange the nextmeeting with a smaller group and get capacity for these discussions.CBS thanked veryone and siad it was informative.

Concerns Raised: The Nlaka'Pamux Group will act on a common Title basis.

Assess impacts of existing lines as well as new line modifications.

Assess impacts of all projects in terms of area lost in Nlaka'pamux

territory.

Revenue sharing in some form

Keeping the Native Language alive through any compensation it receives

from the project

Actions Required: Arrange meeting with smaller Nlaka'pamux negotiating group and arrange(name and action capacity funding

item)

Follow-up: Ensure that a financial expert is present at one of the next meetings with thisgroup.Send profiles of Elmer Derrick and gerald Wesley.Maintain communication with raymond Phillip.

Recorded by: Darrell Mounsey, Julian Wake

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