Queensland

Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]

Legislative Assembly

TUESDAY, 21 NOVEMBER 1933

Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy

1578 [ASSEMBLY.] Paper.

TUESDAY, 21 NOVEMBER, 1933.

.:.\11·. SPI:.\KER (llo11. C. Poll0ck. r; .. ·r:'Jf!l',i!) looL rlH• chair c i 10.30

Chnrital~lt.• lnstitHtion-En,ntidl' Hunn'. l'it:1rte~·~ TtJ\n.·r~

7G 1±3

LI.\B[LITY o: H.\lL'. -_\Y Sr·rER\S~\T_\I!O:\' Fcc:-;n. }lr ?\[( J{ tHE ,_t ul!i(Jit/J! ; .:keL1 d10 Trca-

~ u.ter-.. 1. I~ llr· correctl reportc>d i~l the

prc·". dated 17th in-3-r111t. a...; . .:ratin)..;' that tile Fnncl \rGlllcl

approxt-

•· 2. J ~ it a fact that the )uJLlitor-Gcn('ral's n'I)Ol't giYE'-6 tht• annual of th1.-: trn.:t fnncl Cl" and pCII::.!ou::.

-1 ~'I f:! I(

'· C'm:ducr.-G ood. '· Dili~·:.nc:c.---~ati;-:;fadOl'Y· "Ef:icierJcy.--( ~oocl. ···Art: 'll of opi11iou that hi..; [H~l'-

1 an1•:!t :oilltilH'!ll ..:lwnld lw J'CCO~ll-:HvndL·d

TllLtl ·tn:'~ ro proYl' rll 1~ llOI al:n\H'd io (1t•batc• a JH'r~o11al

t.":\.; ,],uratiOJL

:\1r. C:. l'. 'L\.YLUH: 1 ·u rhclt nr no tin\('

L( cult•t· of rllP ltppo·lt!oiL hon. ~ya:-; Pn'llllPr.

1·;al,f to 111 I C·Y('f

CYC·~l IYhC'll thn Ol' tllf• l1ead of

1 ~J~' ('t. to an C':"\tl't~:-:.1on of an\· ll}Prt:?llrP IYhich i~ in the pubhc iiith 11 lf" ~ '··hen. the .EurPau < f Indn~tn· \Yas r-:·e t. ::1. T0 the Jll'opo.;:;"'-] 1::1 u::-e it 'as the n:1.~tnwtio al authnrir-.-

1580 Industries Assistance and [ASSEl\fBLY.] Other Acts Amendment Bill.

by hon. nlfowucr> of such

lY11'. BEDFORD : It was who

l\Ir.

bor

l\h. BEDFORD: ::\c--undcr ship.

The CIIAlH::r1A:0: C1 clcr l

Mr. MOORE:

notes---The I'REo!IFR: The press indicatc'd

clearly--

Mr. MOO RE: The press indicated quite clearly and quite definitely that Dorman, Long, and Company made a proposal. lt also indicated quite defimtely that the pro-posal was submitted to Mr. Kemp, the Com-missioner of Main Roads, for investigation as to whether it was fair and just. One of the suggestions made by Mr. Kemp in his l'eport on the matter-and most of the report is distinctlv unfavourable-was that before anv further consideration was given to the proposal, it should be sub-mitted to some high financial authority, such as the Commonwealth Bank Board, to in-vestigate the conditions and say whether or not they were reasonably fair. The report

[Mr. Moore.

Mr. MOORE: What was

1\Ir. I\IOORE: Tlw bri6gc 1\-a:: not; the 1noney \Ya-3.

l\Ir. KEOGH: In spite of the Opposition.

The CH AIR}IA::\ : Order !

Mr. what "In

I \vould like to knovv member mean~ when he says

The SECRET.\RY FOR did try to " queer the

:Mr. MOORE : That

Pt:BCIC L\XDS : pitch."

ganda we get in this Chamber!

You

absolutelv no foundation in fact suggestio.n. Hon. members oppo3ite scatter broadcast throug·h the conntrv some anoe-ryphal idea that somebody endeavoured to " queer the pitch." I never heard of a more absurd suggestion than that the Loan Coun-cil could be influenced by the suggestion of a pnvate n1ember. The Government are hnrd put to it to justify even the suggest~on nf doing what they are going to do, and they aro prepared to adopt any method to mislead the pubhc and trv to create prejudice in their minds. The 'hon. member for lthaca, the present Home Secretary, in opposing the

Industries Assistance and [21 NovE11fBER.] Other Acts Amendment Bill. 1581

Mr. :\IOORE : I am.

not nrcpared to accept

cOnnection ·with the 1\:Ir. ICEOGH: Did

CitY Council about abattoir?

Mr. :\IOORE : I bane City Council. the Kangaroo Point during my term as every report, and eYery_ prc~posa. mitted to the Bnsbane C1ty CounciL

Mr. KEOGH: Then you took no notice of it.

Mr. MOORE: We did take notice of the Brisbane City Council. ~he hon. mell_l?er will not stick to a cllscusslon of the bnage proposal. Hon. members oppos1t~ are anxi-ous to justify themselves at any pnce. Every one of them has to admn that the abattoir has been a huge success b~th fr~m a he~lth point of view and a f\nanc1al pomt of V!ew. and from the producers' viewpoint also. The Secretary for Public Lands is unfitted

The SECRETARY FOR have the san1e povvers, have same rights.

Mr. MOORE: Apparently the Brisbane City Council has no right to make any sug· gestions of this sort. The Government have taken all their rights a way by saymg they are going to construct a bridge It going to be a burden on the people of Queensland

Mr. KEOGH interjected.

Mr. Moore.]

[ASSK\lBLY.j

:\l1·. :'1iUOHE: T!w llu11. lltL•nJbL'r for :\Icrtln:r will baY" an Ol1l>Ortullity of :-;peak-ill!.!' nn' thi~.; motion if he eh .ir~.~-:; b!..lt bccan··c th;, PL'opl(' of Fonittlde Ytdley deiirc .the c; Lut hP lllW-t hP is not in order in nwking

~lr. 3l(J0HE: \Yo do llOt. kllO\Y w1wt influ-enct L,tYC' bt'Cll at \York to Sf'CUrf' ihc C01J-structinu of thP brlclgP. 1t ccl"t3in1~.· look:-:; VL'l'V Pxtraordinal'v that tlw hnu. !Hl'rnbcr~ op1;o~itl' \\!to w~'rC very aH~ago11i~tic to, ~he qLu tion of building thn Kang nccc·,·;;ary was a question for the people of Br;sbane, throl)gh their rcprP->e•nt a ti ·cc body. the Bl·isbane Citv Council, and it wa..-; nOt n "·ork for tilf' G0Ycrnuu~nt to uncle L'takc_ There w.as th(~n no :--iuggcstion that the people of B1·ishauc. or Quc·f'nslaJ:cL 'n'rc to be taxed to construct another bridge for the cou,-onienro of the people of Bris-bane. S1'..Ch a ~uggcstio11 i~ outrag('OU-". Conf'idPring that there arc proposals for the df'Yclopntcnt of this ~tatc ;,Yhich can giYc an infinitely g-r0atcr return on the lllOn(~y that is inYoh-pd iu the constnJctiou of thi:--bridge) how c.u1 any hou. UlCinber rcprc-~cnting a country constituency justify a sug-o·cstiou to comtruct a third bridge for the people of Bri~banc and place an extra bur-den on the whole of the people of the State' It is an extra convenience to the people of Bri.,balH'. The people of Queensland ha,-e a!J·pady contributed £60,000 to the Victoria Bridge.

The SECRETARY FOR PeBLIC iVORKS: It is not correct to say it will place an extra lmrdPn on the people of Qt1ecnsland. because a toil 'vill be placed on the bridge.

[Jir. Jlo01·e.

(I :11~ llLl V ch: hOn. UH'IllbPJ' opposite \Yho repre-

,{u outside· cou::-.titucuc;: ju.;;tify the of people ill his area being called

U)!Oll to the obliu:ations in connectio'!l ,, Tth tl1e '? ..:\. t{inncl under the Bris~ b:1m• HiYPr ccultl be constructed for lPso than OUL'-qnir altitude .. T]1._,eir

uruume11t s'-r:111::3 to be thnt theY are JlBtlhcd j11 ._doing auything pro,·idt•d it- will crea!c

Industries Assistance and [21 NoVE)IBER.] Other Aczd Amendment Eili. 1583

will clo a way with the Bulit!l ba L rrv in onll'l' to compel people lo U'e tht> proi;ooed bridge. Is there a ~ugge.--rion that thC' Bri~batH' City ( 1 ouncil ·will not proYide all.Y othc•r tl'H113port ~en·icp.:; in order to cmnpel pcopk' to cro,~ thi~ propo-;ed bridge': That ~l't'!ll:-- to be the ~ugge~tlon PXL'l'cising the n1ind of tlw SecretarY for PuLliL· \York~. i reco.!.!.·ni~e the difficultY that hon. 1ne1nbcr OtJIJO~itc ha Ye to justify this pt·npo~ition: tLat clifl!enlty U1U"'r be ahuo-;r ill--lll>L'l'able. ll{>fl. iill'tuLer::; oppo:-;itc al'l-' prepared to .:_u1o 1JL

1584 f rulustriea .Assistance and [ASSE.:\IBLY.] Other _,_4_cts -'-4rnendn;ent fl,?f.

property COU1Il811Sation

are Yery anxious to Government ahead.

some individual who property there who cannot make it

pay Has the c:onsent of the Brisbane City Council been obtained'? We aro entitled to tlnc iEformation. How is it proposed to deal Wlth tlL' ''P!>Hcietion and depreciation of city values, seeing that the Brisbane City 0uuucil ha,·o no control? We know quite ·:,-:•:i thet it will divert the traffic from Queen

the Valley. Although it wili ;-al ues in Fortitude V alley, it will values of properties elsewhere in Is the city council going to

the whole of the depreciation or is to obtain advantage of the whole of

? These are questions of to the Brisbane City Coun-

whole of the ratepayers of nevertheless, have no say this Bill and to whom no

is g]yen. As a 111crnbor rcprc-most northerly electorate in

I ohj cct to my constituents l)eing to their share of the £2,000,000

lH cessary the construction of this bridge. \.\ t a-rr; t'ntitlcd to huse so1no information

the Go.-crnment. Thev sav thev are build thcs bridge to relieve unem-

Is unemployment to be relieved a ppreriation of a feV\_, businesses in

;_,.alley? How In any n1en are going ic he cm]w>ycd on the censtruction ef this

c' lYe should be told these things. many of the skilled workers are going

from other States? If we have not skilled "·orkers in Queensland--

M-c W T. Kn:G: v\'e have them all or rnost of

Mr. KEJ'\::\Y: The hon. member knows we have not. \Ve are entitled to know what number is to come from the other States. Is this bridge to be built bv clav labour or

contract? \Ye want ·to 'know that We know of the addition to the

cost of the Brisbane .sewer.age scheme by the adoption of the dav-labour system. [f this bridge is to be built bv 'coCitract how do the Government llropose to secu;e the

[,~Jr. Kenny.

(2uecnsla11d ~ Are Hnpo~e a condition on the

that he lllU:Jt ernpJoy only Yould be of immense beneGt to the >Yholc of Australia became the trraziers from the north-western portions of thE' State :vould be able to despatch cattle to th0 abaytorr and thereby receiv-e the price-fer fat.s _metPad of only that for ston,s, The !Traz1ers in that area are to-day suffer-mtr from !hP lack of thE' facilities for transport. \Vhile such neces,ary con;-enienr:es

[:21 ::.\'ovJDlBEn.J Othu A cr., A11: :udmcut Bill. 1585

arc rt·L1~ d i!te ]f'" .... ~·oJJ~t ru,_.:

tu · hc .. :t' ll~_'np1c 11H'Y .-:_re HeY er-to itr·~ll the.' ulOllC\~ for the

of thi~~ "

.:\1r ()'1\:tu E i~:l{'rj· 1:tcd.

~\lr. l.:E~\\"Y: Tlw ltoJL lllL'lliLl'l' for Cnirn-, can ::-.lrlJk on tllt' ;u,ttb'L' horn the 11oint of 'i, ;,. of :'\o ·tit (,iuc •n,Lu:d f 'k him to dectJ \\idt tlH' pnitlT~ I U!U lllaking fl'Olll the

~_f 'it'--' pf hi~ l'~L't·tor,,r '":ill hnnf'iit from the 'exrcrience which h~ h:~s Yt'ry dr,1rJy hought.

T!J,, CIL\IR:\L\:\": Orricr!

Jfr. lienn'J.]

1586 Industries A8sistance and [ASSE'.\IBLY.] Other Acts Amendment Bu.

Mr. KE::\1'\Y: The Tre.tSurer should reply to those quc.,tions before thi"' Connnittce i.o:. asked to ,-otc on the quc.•tion.

Mr. G. C. TA YLOR (l:'nouru r•1) [1L26 a.rn.]: l congratnlab: the Gon~nuncnt on thei1· nttCHtpt to do ::ol!lething to proYidc work for the people, and also in providing som· thing· for tho citizens of Brisbane for the Hlon';:y they are callecl upcn to fiucL Thi~ ~dH~nlc~ is in dirt'ct contra::,t \Ylth the \Ya:-·tage of 1UOUC'y which v:e11t on undpr the scht_'HH' initiated by the :\Ioor~...' CoYerntuent in placiug unclnployed at work on gra:::>s cutting. It i::- ~OllH'tl1iug prncti('nl. The iltticudc of th,, Leadc·r uf the Opposition retniudcd nw of the anf!tl' of the little bov \Yho had lost hi appl~:. }h~ i'3 eYi.deEtl}-,-cry \YOl'J'ind ~l being llPpri red of the oppo1·tnnity of to Parlinrncnt liw propo~al to coa~truct the 1\:.angaroo Poi11t brldgt', and uf not L· in&!· nblc• to halld it o\·cr tu printtc entl'l'}H'i~e. One \\-ould think aftf'r li~touing to rhe hon. Incntbers for Aubigny and Cook thnt the policy of the L·Inbraced the placing of a debt on people of Bri~hanc. an I that thL·ir ~c .H'nlc for the con~trnctiou of the bridge ·would free the pc01)le fnnu any liabiiit:·. \Yho do they think \Yould pay the dil-i:lench, in adxJition to the CO:'t of the brid;·e, if the sche1ne wc.:.·e undt•rtaken by priY.atc enterprise?

The lwn. n121nber charged the Govern-rncnt "\Yitll in.~.tituting anotlwr borro"\ving authority. The borrowing authority in thi:s ea c is the ),Jter alL the Oppositiou arc yery ~Ol'P t1Je G OYPl'l~-nwut ha n~ got down to ba~i

[:21 XovE;\IllEH.] Other .le! Atnc.:lJ:ICiit Bill. lii::\7

BilL

~o l1 :tt n tll1 r~ll, GoYPr;:uwJjt, \\CHild luYc t':'\.l:Cl't a1l lllafU'J':- relating 10 L'{''Jllmui,_·:-';

:Jf till.: ("UtlJ-

tJw

\Yord-... dwt \\C ~~llonld uot follow the hit (jl' rui:-:::-:. Hll_'tlJOcl:-' 1rhidi b; YC l>l'£'11 adoprecl in Cl•_- ;Ja-..r_ hut rLar \\ c should get ('X pen ach-ic:'c , 0 rhat \YbCll figures were lH't':3cntcd tlw correct illH'l']llTtation ·would be placed upo~1 rht nL The prr..;cnt GovCl'llllleiJt alt, l'l d tllC Bur~'au of Inllu~try.

T~::0 PHL\l1EH: \Y c est ablishcd it.

Jl.h. JL\ YLEY: It ''"''s '"iab!islwd by the J\.1oorP Gon:nnuent. Tb~ PHL\fll:H: ~o; the...- l'::-tabll~hed 1vhat

they t.'uph('llli-;tica 1ly ca1l(,c1 thr~ Burc~Ht of Ecm1mnic::--.

~lr. IL\ YLE-Y: ··~ll ,~; and ih1..'H 1he lH'e:-;cut GoYPl'lJIIH'llt fanned the Bnrea~t of Indus-try.

The JJRE.\JIEH: _.:\n entirely dlJfercnt thl11g.

::\lr. BA YLEY: \Yhom clicl they appoint to that board·: Tht> Trva:-'Ul'C'l' -..-ra~ the hr>a.d. aJJd y;irh hin1 \Yere six lJublic :~cn·aut::i v.·ho~ spt>akiug fron1 Ill' 111ory, were ::\lC:-3;-,l'~. l)ayne. Story. Co:lc>dgc' (\dJO took tiJL' place of tho late ::\Ir .. ~. H. Smith). "~mtin, Kcmp, and Brigc!Pn. The11 dw union~ \YCI'e called in to 'a,~~i~t the UoYC'l'llHlCJlt. aiHl the thn•c rPprc:'entatl\·c··,. appolntPd \Yt:'re. I thruk, 1\'1"'''·-. FalloJJ. Lamont, tUJd Carroll.

Tlw l?RE:\rJER: :\-o; OIJ1y t\Yo-~It'::;~r~. C11rroll and LauiOilt.

1Ir. BAYLT()(: \Yho iook d1'-' p1ac:t' of Mr. Hic.nLtn ·:

T1w Plu:_\flEH: llL' i:' :-'ti11 ihc1·e.

J\Ir. H_\YLEY: Then inclust1, '""'" n•mc· scuLd. :Jlr. Bell \Ya~ 'frmn }le~ r:-. J a11H •:- Can1plwll and Lin,ited, ::.Ir. \Y- L:··u'r L·v_d t1ll' Collcn i 1 o:trd. ~lr. Ronorttlt'~,T fl'O!ll tlH' Ho.':al 2\atiollal A~-ricuH LU'.l'e ,, Jll,•ntlwr oi tlwt Lmud instead of l'rof,•,;or H.ichard:::, l wuu1cl ~ay. .. "\~e.:;, thl're wa::; IJllP Iuan on that board \dJO \Yfl:-' c1paLlr of g-i-..-ing proppr ach·iC'P."

'!'he PRE.\l1EH: }lr. f\:crup i~ prohaLl:·: tlH: abksl J'CHt{l t'llglnN'l' in ~\.u;:,tralia to-day.

\1L". B.-\ YLEY: I 'lty that :'.lr. Kt'mp i' .:1 l'nad euginPf'l'. It will be IH'''"' to Il1l jf ~~e be a ('On~tructicmal C'ugjJiccr. If }lr. Kc 1np had tlwt in aclclitio!l to his otlH•r qualifit 'Lt.ic:n~. 1hcn he i~ a qua]ifi(•d lncrub!~r nf the beard, but apart frorn Jlr. I~>n1p, there i .... no man on the bun:-uu qua lifil•d of acting in an adrisor:; caparit.y-.ar lea~t. as a con~ti'uctional cngi1wc.~r. But ii rhc 'Go~ Yf.)rnmcllt want to build this hric1ge, lu-nre the:v not thPir O\Yn dcpartn1Pnt. the .. D01Htrt-Tll in the lllfl:llllCl' pl'Oliosed. rrhe Prelnjcr cL.;: \"Cry l'C'ticcut j his ll10l'lliug. He told ne little or nothiug, an cl t hereforc I shall hct\'l' to po':-~t ;;_;,;; 111y :--oul in putiC'nc·.

The PRE:\llEH: You wl1~ gt\t it all on ~he :->c-·ond l'\'adi11g.

:'.It·. JL\YLEY: I cannot "''e tlw " of th(' procedure \Vhi('h rnak(':--J it lJo::;siblc lengthy :-'pc:eche:-3 to bl' Iuacle ou nlO\'ill!--: for lNtYe to introclucc a Bill. -

:'.lr. DEACOX (Cunninylwm) u.a1.]: The PrPHliel' gaye us Yl'l'Y utfonnation \Yhich \Youlcl jtl;;tify the intrudllc-tioll of a Bill \Yith suvh a ;serious plll'lJD~u 1 to con,t"ruct a briclge, it will ha n' to ha\" a.n office and cugineer;3-it \Yill have to bui~J up auothcr {_lcpartuleut. That i~ what vrovo"d amouut-· to. \Ye han· alrcad0 the Connnissioncr of ~Iain Road:::; a ccn-~tructing authority for bridge, and road:-;. \re h;LYt! 1u the lJcpartrucnt of Pnblie \Vod-:~ another COll8hucting authority. \Yo are now to han· nnoti>l'l" dcpartlllNtt built up. and ' • can take it for gralltf'cl that it Y, ilt not Old.: LL' ill overa i iou for .a li1ll i tcd tinH'. \Y hen \\ ·-' lmno put somebody at the hectd and li~hcd & Lig office, it \Vill Lot cea~e after a \Yhile. l'uttiHg nciclc for a moment tht' que~tion whether a bridge i~ at Knugaroo _lJoint or not, thj~ c·ou~tructing authority is not nC'etlecl. \\-c already ha\ t.' a deparinlL'nt \Yh1ch b C:lpabL~ ]H'l'fOl'tlling the t•_'('llllir:tl \YOl'l.;:

11itl1 tlw Lnilding < f t 1l'-' Df'rwrtnwnt of J?ubli(' \Yur'-::-..;

l nnd qu.:tlili.'d l!Jt'IJ \Yho \'-L·n now arc dc:i]J~' work

1588 Industr:es As8:1tance and [ASSEMBLY.] Oiher A~ts Amendment Bit{.

State·: T·he hou. ntetnl ·r "'Pt :tkiug foolishh·. Tl1c nart of tht' cost of tl1e bl'i(lge will the c~st of the tnaterial, nnd it \Yill LaYP to lJt.' purcha.:.;ed out:3id,• the State. \Yhei'L' l'be eau \'d:- oLrnin it': l:.L. Ye' \Yr gvt all i1·on 1uinc and steel \Yorks: Tile (3oYCl'!Hlll'llt Llitl m: oup tiuH? lll'Oposc 10 Guild a \York~. LHn they abandoned the project. goodnt>~~ ~ That is O~h' of d1o.--e thin·:-- for \Yhicll \YC ougln to lJ: tl~a1ddul. Th~E n.:.o~t uf rhc- Hllll unploycd t!lJ tln· •s1lt l1aYc to lw il1JlHJrtcd.

in \..1LtCl'li"LdHJ.

: Yolt iulpOltt·d }lC'OpL to run Your null\ ,t \':'. lf \Ye

a fe\Y L l':'(lK·rt-- fo{· lmilcllug

:1\lr. Dk:.-\C{ l:\: Tu l'Jot cla1ul ru !:iJk•; ~I 1 ( ' I t l (' l l l

c::u·ufnlh-trnct th(, I\., L£!:l100 1'oiJ~t

Cotnn10H\YCJ.lth loan lw . .:.:. dcnlo!l-'Yondcrfnl Enancial .... rabiEty nf

bc-~J.ks. of IYhich \Yt' haYe proud. Lut ir also oJTers

tlwt a c1uh- dc·...-oh·es upon and a lJ Trea:o-urerB- 1 o

1J10l1C'\' j:. C

Industries Assistance and [21 NoVE)IBER.] Other Acts Amendment Biil. 1589

a

T~1e PEE}HER : \Vho do yoa thjnk 1~ :

,vho in trade anxiouslv

it -..vill involvE-know that when a

resumes through

Other property o\vners see a result of the construe-

These people do not frotn a State-wide a lHtlTO\V, parochial,

Those the people 1nean that

at the are mostly

street

\Y. Fc,·gan Smith, I 1HO\-('---

'"That the que~tiou be :no1\.- pnt.')

::}lr. G0!'7HEY ?rlORG.\X Shanle ~ This is an n1atter should he dis-

l~ou are afraid ot \Yhat I a1n going to say.

The PRE:\IIER: 1n1at do I care what

That the quc,o.:.tio~l be ncnv put'' 1:hc Con11nittee diYiclcd:-

Mr.

"'Ir.

AYES.

AYES, 28.

Mr. King, W. T.

::\"OES, 23.

LurcombB Llewelyn Mull an O'Keefe Pease Smith ~!,O?,ford.1 1.a..:uor, G. C. 1Sellington Williams

Tellers: Gair WaterB

Mr. Roberts Russe]J Sizer Sparkes Swayne Taylor, C. Tozer Wieuholt

PAIRS.

Tellers: Brand T1Iaher

11r. n K.

1\·oES.

l\I1'. Daniel King, R. 11. \Yalker Coi!.roy

Cor:nnltree

:Mr. Barber Bedford Brassiugton Bruce Bulcock Cooper Dash Foley Funnel! Gair Gledson Hanton Hayes Hynes Keogh

resolution (MT. to''-put; and

AYES, 28.

Mr. King, vY. T. Larcombe Thiullan O'Keefe Pease Smith Stopford Taylor, G. C. Waters Wellington Williams

TelleTs: Copley, W. J. Ll.ewelyn

Hon. W. Forgan Smith.]

Kor.:s, 23.

:\lr. Barnc::; :\Ir. Hol.Jerts IL1yley Rn8'el! Bran cl Si1:er Dectcon Sr)arkcs Ed.wards Sway ne Fad~len Taylor, c. l{enny :\laher It .\faxwell ?\:oore Tellers: J.forgan Clayton l\i1nmo Nickliu PlnnkPtt

PAIHS. AYES. l\OES.

~Ir. Copley, F. K ~Ir. Daniel Collin;, Kin.~. R. ~L Conroy Walker

H ,oll'l·t1 in the uHinnati\'l'.

Tl1e 1-lon-.:e 1'e~u1nc·d.

Tlt tin1e "-put: and tlte I-lou-

[21 NOVE}!BEH.] Regulation Bill. 1591

Th" 1-lECRET~Ut Y F( iR :\II:'\ES. :Hon. J. ~topfoni, Jlur/Jl;fiJ'UUf!li} [12.21 p~rn.J: l can-not accPpt the arnPndn1Pllt. _\\hen ~~ ('?ll-fere--lcc of the intcrc-:·ted p·J rtlc ... \\as callr'L~ to con:;.ider a propo::ial to tlw _coat ind of nn c-xpenmPlltal :-chcnle that '' boYPr~n1f'llt representatiYP _shonlcl bP tht' board. T \\an1- a l'C']H''---~L·ntattYP on tht' ard v.·ho ,. ill be· alde to to 1110 011 the

--iuns \Yhich take do not WYi:l be Mr. Ferry. If the l\llinister is sincere in hi~ dcsu:c to as~t-;t the

1502

l'mi~uui: r~ uud llH' Felil'ra~ "lliter._· it i~. I clnc .. 'l

f .-'0 lo11g a...: it ! .. !,'et-.. ::..oult' coll."~drra tiolJ ottr of it.

Tln ... L' i"' ne Hl thi~ Bill to rhe Connui-...-.,iolH'l" H.ailv. a ..:;, who 1~ the lar::,:·t•:::.t {_·oal nscr Quccn~lnnd. H(· ·will Le at til

i:-iou for a GoYcruuiCIJt l't.'pn~··entatiYe on t 1:c board; Yet the hon. member for :\Iurilln

~tare~ that we arc 111aking no pro-for a Go•,·f'r11U1Pnt reprc,·.,pntatiYe.

\\ :wr arc we to uwke of the po::-ition •Yhcu (';_,_, ( lliPO~ltion rnPrnhcr ~ays one thihg aud 1: i.Olt. Itlf'tnlwr fo1· 1\Iutilla ~ anothPr? ~ r :--, o ';~ llwt tlH~ hn:l. llif'lnb;•r :\lurilla r ra:..t-:( tll~· doe::: not kno\V \du-tt IH:~ is ta1kiJ•g-al · regard to the coal indu;rry. It il-:.e 1HNnbcr \Ym.dd learn f'On1et1Jing

cliffi("ultie~ nf producing and p1ac-lll!2.' on t ht' nwrkct. the trouble that he{-~ to 1-~e tak(·~!. both hv colli('l'V O\Ylll~rs nJ!cl co:1ier~· wod.;:~_•r:". tn l~cep d1e. iL lu.-try

[Mt. J!organ.

l?·~·.;u!·-aion Ea!.

\Y(~u]d 1Jff, et dJ' Hill \\"ill han:: upon tiH:~ prodt;cticn of und ('leetric1ty. As l lHJ;llU·d 'J~n the dav, th·-~ (•il"cct it. htb oa j~ that tlle ('{• .... t of .lH'nducing 1,000 cubic of ga:--; l'llllS intn 1:--. 6d. per 1.00:] cubir- feet for tltL· cnal eo 1-·"UH1C·cL .\'C't the COltljl

~\L. c;t;lJFH\·~Y :JI{Jl{t~.\~\ .. : 1-i(_· --ratr>·-1 \\ h·_'ll l ',Ya..: St•:> ·:'rar · I t'\·,·r thing po.:..-..ib]P to· to tl!t' fad thnl \\v to tnon• for our co;1] rhall wa-.: South \Ya!c."i; onr coal nbo

~pl'aking-. to the there. wa:-: 1ny duty to prolect thP pcopk.

111~· priY ]tLClil' it,• J !ll_'-' jlCH i~ (. thL• !1011. llid•J;, _ Tn..: 'it 'n \\·ould haYl' (' tU-..C' to com-:\Ltill; IJut r' ~~:~1:' tlll' i\Il;Ji~ter l'L'/ll'l'"l''~ting

l~,t;' ·a--;; and 1 l tiTled nnt t 1·· lt·-inc

::\L·. Hrs~1-:u.: That do~~ noi (·OHll' in1CJ thj~ d i_~(·u~-..ion.

~Ir. U. C TAYLOR: Tlri' i< an opnor· t i111L' to l'ClllPllli-'Pr jr. Thorp i.-;

\\TOlJg' \YitJl Ol1l' ('( U1J011liC' wLen at a tiulC of CJ\ pr-productio11 Uo-.;;-crn-

... art' foiTPd to i11to operation a lik, the OllP und{'l' to provjdp

f,T t-l:(' ::::t \Yorl~l to tllf'ir ::-upportcrs. thr farn1er~ and other.s. l1ui- \dl('ll it con1cs to a qnc~tion of pns:;.ing a BJ!l to help nn indn~tr.- that 0n1ploy~ t hon

112.45 p.lll. J : Thi.s is a Yf'rv an1cncln1Pnt. and after rt ~\I l"\rP.Y ()f the cla.U~(' to clisco>;er the povo;crs of tire l;onrc.l one realises ir }.:; that the ov:net of tllP shunl(1 fair rt'lHP:::entation. 1t ha~ alre tilf' c-oal industry there J ..... a cmnplc'tf' l'CYPrs;Jl of policy. Gon•rn-ny;_l collieric< prnumably \Yill be free to

"·ith other collierie

1594 Goal Production fASSE:vlBLY.] Rer;ulat·ion Biil.

conYinclng. He suggested that the Conunis-Picncr of Prices should oc-eupy an indepen-rknt poeition on the Central Coal Board, but prr•·umably he was to be like the umpire who \Yas said to be impartial except that he nf~Yer gaY(' his OYvn side out. Lnder the clause as it stands the preponderance of voting power will be against the colliery owners. The Con1n1issioner of Prices will b0 a Gon'rnuicnt rcprcscntatiYe, dt'spite what the ::'IIinister mav sav. He will not b" there solely to reJ1rcscnt' the interests of the COll."llllH'r;o;, The e1nployccs arc to have one reprc:;;eutatiYP on the board. It is ~1 bsurd for the hon. n1P111bcr for Enoggcn1. to draiY an analogy between the dairy farnter.;;, aud the coal trade. The dairv faruwr~ JJan_~ no n>·trictions as to hours V; tllC' colliery Pn1ployccs haYC'. They l1a \"(' no f-ixed rat0 of \Ynges; the colliery proprietors have. They cou1petc on the 111arkcb of the world, and must accept price< fixed on the \Vorkfs parity. The eoalowncrs haYe a 1·ight to Ct)-OJ1eratc between tllen1~clYes and say, "'Ye will decline to sell our coal unh:.-s, \Ye get a certain prirc.'' The colliery e1nployees are protccrPd by an induslri al tribu1w l \Yhich fixes hotn~ and \Yagcs. If colliery proprie-tors desir~, to invc::;t JtlOilE'Y in (D.altnincs wlwn there i::; not sufficient' roo1n for the prt~st·nt nntubcr of 111inc::;, \\hY should the GoYernnleni intl'l'YelH' ancl -eon:.;;Cnt to appoi11t a board wi1it'h \Yiil lw ahlP to regulate not onl~, dll• production of coal but the pri-ce of (Oal abo, ill order that the < c)lliery proprie-tor~ 1uay grt ''- rctnrn 011 their inYt>-,tnJeut?

:\'lr. FOLEY: X.,.. on knov,· the• hoard i~ not a price~fl~ing trihunal.

:\h. ~'OOHE: The Bill pr01·ir1''' Lll· che f1xing of a n1lnianun prlce 'Yhat dor~s the ~H~n. g:Pntleuwn c.all th •t Lut a price-fixillg tnbuua1?

Thr• 8ECRET.\HY FOR ::'lh:o;ES: ThPre i; noth-ing in tlw Bill which S>l,-s that the board ~11:.:11 not fix a pnre lower than the prc~ent. pnc:'.

l\1 r. ::'IIOORE: The whole object of the Rill '"ill lw dc•feated if that \Ycre done l·u:t :n1sc such a price \Youlcl not tri\·e a retun~ 011 the illOllPY inYcsted iu coalu;ines.

Tht• SECRET.\RY FOR ::\lr)..'ES: TJwt can h0 done by organisation.

"\h. :\!OORF:: Alrl'ady the Bri;banc City Council ha.' been cha1·g·rmit a IlliJJilllUlll price to Le fixcdj and to "' ,. th,1t no noal ,;ha 11 be sold at less tha:t thi~ · pric;.. irn~~r

c [21 X on 'Hmm.] 15()5

'J-,eli

thP (·oa!O\\'llf'r:-- .•dw I hrl\-;-. thP rjg1n c, lwn~ d~C'V cou:-:id(~r 1110-;1 .snitable

,e11t them.· and likc·,·isc that th of

' iil :\Jr. Stnf, t~nd the Go\·f'rnnJPnt 1Ht YC' th0 definite

rig-ht of HP\)ointing tLP rhalrrnan--tha~ is, the~ Con1n1i.' . .;.ion T of Pr;cc"". T ,,.01dd like to '-C'f' it elcu rl,Y ~f'i' out ln the Bill 1Yit:11out n nv contingent ~~1g.£?:e.;;tion:-; that may b0 put fol' 1 ''~Jrd fi·om tirne to timP; \YP should then knu · f'\:nctly \YltPi'f' ,,-(' .-;tDnd.

1! :s !aid r1ov:n that tlw cli . .;.tric t h(Hll'd~ tll'P to lw rlPch>cl, nr1d I flrn lHiethlt· to fn.tho:H \Vhy lhcrP :"lJo~dd b0 a discrimin:-ttiou

bet \\eeu tl1•.• central rtlHl Uislrict hoard~. If it ]::, good enough for di,:.;lrict bo:li'd:-' to be Plecu:-d, it i~ ouly right that thP CPlltral board chould Le dL•ctcd. I aw at H lo's to LUHier.,tanJ the difference; tho Minister may be all1l' to explain. Tlw n,ponsibility with regard lo l he first hoard rests on the Go-

b tot the next onr• ,hould be 1n the JH'J'.--on:-: 1~·lto :u·P Hffect~'d

r-hc colJjl'l'\ 0\\Jit.'l':-' 011 O!H sidl' and the (';lllJJO,' {'(' . OJI dw ot]H'l'. dlid thP e_;-on~rn-l11L'l!f J f the amcnchuent WP l'{' t fJ(• ('tfpct j Y('JI(-'8~ of tlJP not :-;n_s·ge.'t it) but it ~('l'lll." to llU' 10 lJl• a rea onablP proposal. ,.\ll orlH'r board:-' in con1tection witl1 difrPl'cnt 11~dn tl·ie-.; i11 Qt!f'('JJ:-laJtd an• ('lPctcd, rxrPpt

Bof-tl'd in l'l!~jH'Ct of \Yhich that \' !0ct thPil· own rcprc"Plli-atiYe·;:. it. i:-; upon t!utt fonndatjon thni- :-:o l'lllOJJy h·1" bC'PI1 btJilt in the past.

TIE· SvcRJ:LIRY FOH :\In·~-:": I ''"ill 'lrcept the anJcndnH:nt.

:\lr. l\IL\ :\" ll: that.

~1.lllf'Jill1I.ll'!lt (Jlr. Jluon:) agn~ed to.

( 1LHt:--C' 7, a:-; amended, agreed to.

Clan'"' 8 to 12. both il!clu,in·, agreed to. Clan~e 13-'' Ft,'l'f!ur JiOI{'(/'S of c.,ntral

Co•tl /loan! ··-

:\lr. :\IAHER (lr•sl Jforrtou) [2.13 p.m.j: I rnon_• tlte foll(,wiug alllC'ilC]UlC'nt:-

··On [•age 7. linP 4C. aft

lliGf3 [ASSE:\IBLY.]

The SECH.ETARY F()H :\II:'\ES :FL)!i. Stor1f?rd. Jfo,·y 7JIJJ'fJ'fUh): I -,\·]11 at.·::q;t anlt:n;rin¥ anlclHhnc!H :-

t~ft(•r line 35, in':·\--'l't t!! 1:; lH'OYi;:;o-

. Pro\·id('Cl that l.L in iih of tLc cl'llTl'al Coal Bcn:1l'd a

for di~tri1:L con-it ]'('(l:Yill b0 in1p~se(l npJn cli~trict until a deliberate

i~ nut de to 1 ll"C'Yellt a ~chC'U1C'- fronl

mittcd to the tllf Yc1ting.

. I can lial'dlv il!1a~.ti11c \\"OLI1c1 bu auttigoni::-:.tic to

The· c;:;chnul' t:Yt'tltualb- )Jl'OJllnl-Ccntral Coal Board a;;; TlH)

tht.1 di::.:trl, r llnard ~11onld be ~nbrhe { o down!.:r:-: in th

Coal Praductz"on [21 NoVE}IBEl'.] 1597

it to :::l' Utn'•-'l'lJn· 1!1 :-.nit alt]~, for

r+:.•J)J'(_• ..... c:JtatiYe:-:: on rlle CC'lltnl! l.o,nd ~ un.-:.uitallle fol· tlH• otlwr be inq)os::-·d on the lc~tit l'. tlrat it 1noJv be. U!i'i:ttai the owner:-:; 'thoro will .tJO o]•portnnity of :'aying ,y!JcthPr thv at·cel)t it: or othcr·wise.

TlH' :-:.Ecnt:L\RY J< JH ~lr:\E:-:i: Xot. ar alL It ~ .... l'roYlclcd tlli.H rq)l'C"t'ntation~ can be l.llf!.dt' 1 o t 1ll' Co\Ter11or in Council. 'Ye d(·cid~...· utorc itllJwdnnt watt1~1·::: rhan that in 1l~e ]),_,pat'tllJl'~!t cf ~Iinc~.

=~lr.

rlt('

oi the Bill hnn.: tl1c right ~rill ~uit their a voal board

11 .... c/a:lllt_' 011 anotlwr for ',YlticlJ it u1ig!Jt. be tnl··d1y nn .... uitt'd.

Thl' ;-)ECBL.:. \HY .ron ~\i1:\E·,: \'re arl' c11nitting alto_:2 ... ·thl'l' till' pO"'.\'t'l' ihat j.., u nally cuutainod · of ParlianlL·lli 10 111ake Order::; iu

and in doing .. ~o hcl\ e 111Ud!-:> lhi~ 8ii1 a ... 1\" e:onfPl'cnce uule·,~ ln-- this arnend~ went I giYt' rlte Central (coid Board the po\\·er to call them into coufr1·cncc. If they are :::tjll oLstiEate and will 11ot. formulate rr schcn;e then the Central Coal Board will ~ubwit- a sche1nc to the Go-..-ernor in Council~ and jf approYed it wlll becm11c operative. Orhcn>:i-.C', ;1 Trivicheme.

I kno\\" n·Lat tll(' a11H·11d~ I can nllder _.tand th,, po.-;i-ll1Crel.Y cxln·c:;:::.; rhc opinion

tlwt tlH' elc·ctcd board. rcprc~euting thf' whole of

in ,- ctu~J. fad; repre·cnt

Tlw E'ECH!T\RY FOR ::llr-..;r~,; : If that is so, rhe -.,-.,- ltolc d1euw nw ~- hn'ak do\nL

}Ir. ::\lOOnE: It uot break down, but, tlt~u "ill 111ake for ~n1ooth -.,yorking. Tt :--.t'Pllb t:J JJJC that after a definite schEnle ha:::.; fonnubtod b·.- rl1c central board the board ,iJmilcl hHY

1598 [ASSE:'YIBLY.] Reuuiation Bill,

mav be portions

FOR }lEES: \Yhat about the

Mr. GODFREY MORGA:\: gentleman had better be careful or be slaughtc-r·ed in it. (Laughter.) point out, ho\YeYer, that whereas the tion dealing with the establishment Bri~bane abattoir 1nakcs proYision f')t' representation of conommers. the Bill now before the Committee is singularly deficient in that respect. The interjection of the Minister shows that either he does not uacler-3tancl his o;,-rn Bi:l or he has no kno1v:edge of the legislation under which the Bri,bane abattoir was estab'ished. The boards are quite different. vYe would be quite satisfied with a boa rcl similur to the Meat Industrv Board. The iirst board under this Bill 'be srttis-factory, because the Minister its compo.,ition, but it is the

about. The have a greater

northern and southern l)ort!on

repre;::.cntatiycs but if they

reprcscntat; ,-i:1 interest~ the vvould have no representation at all. and the southem intere;-ts predorrrinate. The district boards are ach-isory boards which will make reprewnta-tions to the central board. Lntil a mutter is finally decided by the central bo,ml, it cannot come into effect.

The SECRETARY FOR MINES: It is finally decided by the Government.

Mr. GODFREY MORGAN: It 1s finally decided by a political body.

The SECRETARY FOR MINES: You are ou~ of order in calling it a political body.

Mr. GODFREY MORGAN: It is the Governor in Council, which is a political body, which has to make a final decision. If the Labour Government were m power and clesirrd to obtain a few Yotes, we know how the decision would be g·iven.

The SECRETARY FOR l\1J:\E~ interjected. Mr. GODFREY M ORGAN: The Minister

is going to hand ovor control and somebody is going to fleece the people. When a man takes out a gun and does something he IS not entitled to, he does it for his own benefit, and not for the benefit of other people No-body uses a gun for tbe benefit of some body else, but entirely for his own benefit. That is what this means"~a gun is going to be used, but it is going to be used for tho benefit of a section of the community only, and the rest of the people are going to be penalised.

The CHAIRMA?\: Order ! I would ask the hon. member to confine his attention to the amendment.

},mcndment (Mr. Stopford) agreed to. Clause 14, as amendPd, agreed to. Clause 15~'-Election of Jlistrict Coal

1Jour1Z "~

The SECRETARY FOH :\11::\'ES (Hon. J. Stopford, ;1'£ruyborough) [2.41 p.m.]: I moYe the following amendment:~

" On page 8. after line 51, inscrl the for owing proviso:

' Provided that in the e\-ent of anv District Coal Board not being eslab-

[Mr. Morgan.

to, Clnus0 16-'' Ofjicr rs n--agl'C'Cd to. Clame 17--'' Qwdu ''~-

rncrnbers \vlll roali-;c the rnagnitutlc of conferred upon tho boa rcls, but

no snch thing as infallibi! ity. It is to gnarcl. aga.inst any injus!ice. All

that I Hirl rc9uesttng 1s that ':~en _tJte b-,.oard ·:~ deciding the quota and destn1ation or tho output of a colliery, it should pay so_me regar,d to the business done by that particular col· liery during the previous s!x mont~s. I~ may be that the colliery has grven sat1sfactron to its consumers by reason of the Sluality of the coal supplied or by pron;pt delrvery or some other action, .and the desrre to _mamtam rela-tions is mutual. Due attentron should be given to existing arran!-Sements :vhich have been in force for come trme, and mstructwns should be issued to district boards that regard be paid to th~ arra_ngements entered inlo during the prevrous srx months. That is onlY fair and reasonable, and l trust the Minister will accept this very reaoonable nrnendrnent.

The SECRETARY FOR 1\H:\'ES (Hon. J. Siopforcl. JfatyiJorouyh) [2:45 p.m:J: I realise what the hon. gentleman " strnyog for. In his electorate there is a coalmmc adjacent to the Shx colliery and the hon. member wishes to "preserve 't~ that colliery its quota on the basis of its six months' output. In my opinion the amendment asked for. ;yould probably do more harm than good. It rs f';'r-reachinu in character. It may Qe qurte aeceptallle in the case of the mine in the hon. member's electorate, but in another part of the Bill there is a safeguard which pro-vides that notwithstanding that a mine on coal has 11roduced nothing during the t\YelYe n1onths. "it Jnust rerei Ye a permit anto-rnaticall1". That mjne is entitled to sorne

There is a not her aspect of the matter taken into consoderation. After carry·

nYining operatious for years some OYf'rtakc a mine-as happened

it maY have there" is no

the dPYelop· atnenchnent

r:o quota. The matter good seEsc of the board.

J.\Ir. GODFREY JI,IoRGA:\: The amendment ;, to protect the collic'rie~ that have oecmed quotas.

Coal PToduciion [21 KovE~IBER.] Rurulation B:a. 1599

SECRETARY FOR :\11::\ES: \Ye 1 hat a district hoard will act

anv 1110rc than \VC ha ye the right to n, "UUlC thcl to tlH' dctri!llcnt of the furure. I-Ie :-'tilted that one objt_>c·t of the Hill a--. to pec,·ent the• iwJi~crin1iuatc r_J,,,-(·lopn,lvn"i of eo J ~(ants, and ac1\led !.hat ·1t \'ioalc: l_,e Lf"-'•"':"Gry to ··rcpatnntc a nund ''l' of C'OHhlliners to oihcr industrit.'s. C~Jll"~' J.7 nrrn-ide.., tL1t a di~trict ,-,al :.;;cht:'llle t 'JI nrn\·id(' th;.' dt t-;n~nion to \\hich the re: ·1l . hcl] J L(~ fon .. Yanlr:rl. Cl a u.,e 21 say~-

di::::;LL'ict COftl ~c}H'll1· lll quite all right; lmt Ino\.ing at thP run.itce ft·o111 tbe point

of dc-sti11ation \YLic:h lllL1 Hll~ the A purc·lw ,pr bu~-s c-oal of a cer-

it ~uit~ hlu1. iu rhar it !1in1 bt ;;;t YahF'. The nnH'tHlmf'ut

Jlll ... ~ibly i1 c:·e,":"f' the cou~Lnnprion of

Th(' ;'-. TILT\RY FOR ),JlXL:': '\\" e cannot iu('lud,, ('\'t'l'V elcwc'llt of tl1P schcnll' in the Bill. Tlwt ·j, 'riJY rhl' rcqniJTlllPlH abcn-,: the quota f-ron1 :-:ome min~·. or tht' cclll .. U~.1er i~ cOnl-p~·IlC'd to t;:_kt' 110rt:ion of hi.:: J'C'qnirc·tneuts frorn -.cut(' other tuint•. Tlwt uJil'C' nw,v h'c!l, will not g·cr

1600 Coal Produc#on [ASSE:.\lBLY.] Regulation Bill.

and that onlv those mineo operat-the last six lnonths and producing

obtain a There are 1nanv who have in the business

forty year~ and ha Ye not pro-coal during the last six months. been spending money on develop-

That ,,-ill mean thev will be debarred fron1 rern3:ining in In effect the amendment says

" If vou ha n· not sold a.ny last six months, you go out

altogether, and all ·the spent in the last eighteen

in deYeloping your full production has

has " imaginitis ' 1

kno\Y what I arr1 is more than the

does on this Bill. argument of tlw Leader

to its logical conclusion it meant thftt one after

would be clos.-,where like' ~·o1ne inforn1ation a'> to

rnt'ans that a rninco\Yner or !;come that he can sell. that he is entitled to sell

so rnany or thousands of tons, and if it wonld pay better to sell his quota or right to some man he can do so.

The SECRETARY FOR MINES (Hon. J. StDpfoi·d, Jfaryborouqh) [3.11 p.m.]: A rea-sonable interpretation of the clause is sug-gested by the Leader of the Opposition. The idea of inserting the provision was this : A

has developed a mine and put into it amount of moncv to enable him to

a certain quota. "He has put every-be had into the naturally on the

that haYe a quota. If a took placP n1ine or soxne other

eo a 1 requirements be supplied. It

the mine had no his. tlw mine-

hn.-e to \valk out of the industry l'l""~tart.

He not be abh' to a license.

Tbe SECRETARY FOR MIXES: If a n1an i~ en coal. h0 gets a JiC'ensc. lie vvould

tramfcr or give the trade to else whn enulcl fclfill his orders.

Coal Pr('Juction [:!1 ::\OVE}lBElL] 1601

1 i v;o;__dd ~nli tb0 C')~: ~nlu('~' becan,:;c that anwunt of c 'Jalnnt-..r LP ~upplit'd. The asslgll-u:wnt ,,·ould be onl~· u·rll]'nrar~:. 1f he is going o·t~ of illdu:-try he is ~ellin:;· ~ornething which ];,. ha, the legitimate right to selL The sale of a. C?arw fann carriL·~ \Yith it thP as.signrnent

-t,f tht" qunntit:; of UtnC' allO\\·ed to be grown ou it. \Yithout tilL' a;;;.slgnnlPllt tlw calll' fanu \'.-onl.J bt• of little· Ynliw tu nHvbodY. The ~t . .;;':-i§rnment can lw tra11;:;f0rred. · ~

:\h. BR.\XD: Tho Secrl'ta!·y for Agriculnn·p \Yallt:3 to take It a\\ay fron1 n ......

The SECRETARY FUR :\IL'\ES: I do 110t kno1r wl1at the Set_Tl'tUrY for Agriculture i~ doing l>ut I ha\ L' tried to cxl)lain the l'O'='itioa ill tiJC' bc'"t v;dy I eau l1~; rnakiug l'L·fercncL' to tlw af':-:igtnlH'llt of ea no Land. An OW1ll'r of a !"DJ;dl eoahninc ntav Le able to carry on for .u fuw :·en.r-o, bnt th~'re conw_, a tiu1c whLn l1c requite:-; additio1utl capital in orJPr to c~paud hi~ !Jn:c,jue~~- In the pre-:::-l'llt CL"OllOtllic condition that coalowHer no doubt >Yill Le• nhle 10 get capitnl. and

l J'llt:-.

lws to Le uwdc for his by H·lling his as_sjgn-

TLt' Lc·ader of talked aLou'v t!H_' .. repatriation lll1llC'l'8-. This Bill doP:; 110t deal with Tlte ·· l'C'fHlt· ri 1~nn·mn and Tp"wich diotrict'. \Yill the Sccrctarv for ;\lines make a statcmc-11t on this l'lHN'. fl' to his policy iu l'C'SpPct of the 1ninc- under his jurisdic-1 ion ln rebtinn to t11e f'lxatiou of nrice~? \Yill titYord--• hYenty.' ~·

Tlre Bill proYiclcs that any coalo\YIJer who nPglcct~ t.o con!ply with anv provi~ion of a c·entral or di,!rict ,cJH•me 'hall be liab\,o to a penalty not cxcL•eding £100 and a claily penaltY of £2 flir f'YPrv da\' durin~· vd1irh the lh~fault contiuue,, ·The· penalt~ i,; too ""·ere, and it should be reduced. The sncce·.; of this Bill depends upon good>Yill, and not upon -Lhe in1po:;jition of scYere penal-ties.

The SECRETARY FOH :.\fT:\'ES (Hou. J. Stopford. JiaryborrJII:th) [3.20 p.nr.]: The hon. member o,-crlooks the fact that the JWnalty of £100 is a maximum penalty. and ll{J rnagi:-'tratc- \Youhl irnpo::;(' a n1axi1nnn1 penaltv mlle,, thnc >Ycre a clcliLCl'atd fol' catrhing- thPn1! Thi~ Hill if' ali import aut one nHd·- in Yiew of the fact that th

1602 Ooa 1 Production [ASSEMBLY.] Regulatian B&!l.

This clause proYides a penalty not exceeding £1CO for failure to make certain returns. I haYe had considerable experience with legis1a tion proYiding for the rnaking of retu1·ns~ but it did not proYidc for a rnaxi-mum penalt:v ot £100. In the case that I haYc i11 n1ind the rnaxiu1um penalty \vas £5, anrl although the breach had not been deliberately committed the maximum penalty was imposed. This clause is uot a vital one in the Bill.

The SECRETARY FOH '\lrxE~: Tt 1s a brPach that anYone might make. I will accept the ameiichnent. ·

An:enthncnt (Jl1·. Rnuul) agreed to.

Ciau~L~ 25, a~ arncndcd, agreed to.

('Jnu~c 26--·'' Indrmnity "-agreed to.

CtauUc:h appca}, rLUC1 t.JJ(; 111::..CC~:l

[21 NoYE:\IBEn.] 11euufation n;u. 11i03

aucl in:--,__rt in lit·u thereof ihC> \Yord"-

. fnr rl!D prcct>dure in re~p('Ct of :·ppt•nb uuder p: thC' lfon .... ('. 1~ tha't tlH't\.' :-·hall. L(' t:1J cpponunity of disclL,;-;ing tlwnJ, It l:' only a fQrco to pnt a clause in .a Bill 1f lt i~ to bt• a dead ]{•tier. It n1cans govcrnnJellt by reg11latin11 to lllP utmo~t drgn-'~'. It h~ll':- always bet-n f•onh•nd, J that rtDPinbPrs of PoTliamC'nt ~hou~d lHtYC an o_rporttmir~- to rli:'cus~. and cEsH]low l'r tho { :ovPl'llllH'llL ·,, ho, b(•( J.u c· of their majorit,,

u1 l1aYe thl' n·~nlatioll.:' appron•d. but it will giYC' Parliament nn opportnnity of di~cv2.~i11g thew. ),ftPr nll. n'gulaHons beron1e part. of t!JP \et '. ·hpn thf'..-,· arc i~'-ucd and pnbli:-:hed in the'' (:o\-l.'i'lllll('nt C·azPtt.c.'' Tht:- are not lial)1t' tn (1l1P..;tinn arn; lllOl'P than anv :'Pction i11 tlll' .\ci. \Y~, h,ulJ-c·~·tdarioH~ })f'd they should The\· had a n1nclt l1!0l'C far-JTaehinp: tluu~ \Yas antiripated. \\-t' do ;.ot kJJO\Y \\ .Jat tht' l'egn1at1ons

1804 Coal Production [ASSEMBLY.] Regulation Bill.

abo·_a the Govt._•rn~ C~en;g gov _ rning Qy rcgu-

th~_, case \Yhcther it a Labonr Oppo~ition or a

( lpp(>itlt no fnrthC'r ah~: a.d. lm111t-diatelY another Govel'urnent got into pcrwer thcyv conlDJC'llCl' gc•"·erning by regula-1 ~

Coal Production [21 NOVE:!\IBEH.] Regulation Bill. 1605

Mr. KEN:\"Y (CoaX) [4.1 p.m.]: I regret that the :I\linister has not looked at this amendment in the correct light. The hon. gentJeuwn is trying to Ini~lead not only him-'elf but al,o rhose people who are vitally concerned in tl1is legislation. The :\lini,ter dates the amendment may be interpreted to mean that we shall have to cail Pm·lia-ment together to deal with regulations, hut I \oron~d refer the hon. gentlen1an to the \Yay in ,yf,ich the clause would read if this an1rrHlrucnt \YCre agreed to-

,, If Parli~1mcnt fails io pa~~ a rcsolu-rion approv:i11g of any ':3-uch r~ (i'Ulation within fourJ een sittl11g da~v~ of such I")·. i;ODFHEY :\IORCA:\: Fonrh'en d:tvs ;Jfter l 1nrlianlt'ltt lill'l·t:-..

1606 [ASSEMBLY.]

ju--tilic th" effect of ihis clau...;,:_:-. \Yhic!J gin':-; tlH' Co\en1or iu f'otlltcll po\1,'t'r to do an: t!ting. ..Anyihing· du~t he n1ay clo wiH l!aYc 1eg-i..;lative forcP. I ;'ccog-nl~c that there rnav he a donbt in the J\Tini~tL'r'~ l'tind as to. \Yhethcr he ha.-:. C( ;·0rcd f'\·l'ryt hiu;.- h~;1ltv: .,:\;;; J !'aiel bPfon'.' ll!PrnLeJ: slloulc1 :-et> to it th;Jt th of Parlianw11t arc pre;;;Pl'YPd to Parlia~·rlt.:'nt. Tlw pOY\''r to legi·:;da1P re~b with iLe HlPHl-her."' of ParliniUCllt aJHl 11ot ·with i"hP nwln-lx•r·, of the Exccutin·, >yhosce durv it i.s to achnini:-:tPr tL~· la1Y ,"fter jt ha;;; becu pac.:s0cL liere. th0 GoYcnnncnt art' giYing to the Gon:'rnor : tt Council-\\·l1iclt i;1 other \:ord~

!!:-' t}L' {'"abinC'i"--t];•(' }IOW('!' i"o 1nakc rcgn~ tl1at 1vill hnv(' r-qnal fo1·rp ·with lrgis~

cnactmr'nh. I object to it.

Au:endmcnt (J!r. Stnpforrl) agreed to.

Clause 33. as amenclcLI. agreed to.

Schedule and prean1hle agrr·•d to.

Ti:c Hom,c· ,·cwmed.

Th,, Cn \JmL\:< rcportr cl I he Bill with arnendn1cnts.

'l'HlRTl IL.HJI:

objc·c-tion.' >HTC rai~c(l Lv the HarLollr' anrl l\Iuinc Departnwnt. I\olh· ing wa.;: cluJie. ,1ltltoug!l I p('rsonally favoured

Gas Act Amendment Bili. [21 NovE~w:c::c:.j aas Act Amendment BilL. 1607

p1ocedu1 e The Southpcrt To\Yn ~~,as cornpellc~.l to ::-penJ a consider-

v year after Year in Olv:rari- _g the hJ.~culC ~pan for tLe sole

of allo\\~iHg one small trading ycsseJ nrcL·ecd to the \YLarf in the :\'" craEg

RiYc~r, \"rhen arrangcn1cnts n1ight haYe been made to lit an adjustable llH!'t which could lw ciropped to allow it to proceed under the LH-idge. The CXlJen~c was urnvarrantcd, allC! Yery often the lifting of the span iHYoh-ed :;::crious congestion and delays to tuffic, C'spocially in the holiday scaso11. This Bill will obYiate that congestion and delay wi1ich ha re occurred for rnany years.

2\h. PLL::\KETT (Al1J1J"/) [4.27 p.m.]: This Bill will scne a Ycr:: usdul purpos

11308 Gas A_rt AYu3ndm,ent J)il!. lASSK\1BLY.]

:\Ir. L;ODFHEY l\!URC:A:\ i.l!11rilh) [4.35 p.m.j: It is n'ry difficult to follow the l'dini:-:tvr Jn l'P:rard tu the altf'ration:-; ~et out in thi:-. Bill, \Yl1id1 is P~~entially OlH"\ for di::;;-eu~..:ion at tlw Connnittcc' ~tagc~. TlH' Oppo.:-;ition will go into the rnattcr carefully at that ,ta.ge. It is Yery popular for any (ioYt'l'llnient to introduce a 111ea~uro to try to rPdttc(~ ilw {'Of-t oi a comn1oditv to con-Slllllt'l'~ g"f'llCI'ally. Lnt to U"C' rh'e phrase the Secrctar\' for )-line;:; u:-:cd 111 another ckbar('. this~ would PPllC'UL' tu Lt> u~ing a steam hnrruucr io t'l'a{_'k n nut. The -:\Iiui~tcr and tiH' CoYf'l'I'llll'nt ge~1crally hnYP inclulgL'd in a gTC'