transcript – live from london: tech hacks, gut bacteria ... · being interviewed live in london...

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Transcript – Live from London: Tech Hacks, Gut Bacteria, Positive Energy & More - #324

Bulletproof Radio Live from London #324

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Announcer: Bulletproofradio.Astateofhighperformance.

Dave: YouarelisteningtoBulletproofradiowithDaveAsprey.Today’scoolfactofthedayisthateverydayBritishpeopledrinkabout165millioncupsoftea.That’salotoftea.Whatyoudon’tknow,though,isthatthatteashouldbeprotectiveagainststomachcancerexceptit’snotbecausestomachcancerratesarehigherthanitshouldbegiventhatamountofteaconsumptioninBritain.Thereisareasonforthis.ThereasonisbecauseoftheBritishhabitofputtingmilkintea.Itturnsoutthatmilkproteincalledcaseinstickstotheantioxidantsinteaandcoffeecalledpolyphenols,andwhenmilkinteractswithpolyphenolsitinactivatesthemsoyourbodycan'ttakeadvantageofit.EventhoughBritslovetheirtea,iftheywouldjustputbutterintheirtea,thewayTibetansdo,insteadofmilk,theywouldhavelessstomachcancer.Thatsaid,ifyoulikeyourtea,goaheadanddrinkit.Noone’sgoingtoholditagainstyou.

Areyoulookingtoeliminatethefeelingofbeingstuckinyourlife?You’llwanttocheckouttheUnmistakableCreativepodcast.Theyrecentlytalkedaboutthepowerofexperientiallearningandhowit’simportanttolearnthingsbydoingratherthanjustlearningaboutthetheory.Togetcreative,gotopodcastone.comordownloadthefreemobileappnow.

Today’spodcastisgoinginadifferentdirectionthanwhatyouusedtobecauseit’sactuallymebeinginterviewedliveinLondonbyTonyWrightonandfromZestology.Whatyouwillfindisareallycoolinterview.Therewasanaudienceofabout200peopleandwehadmorepeopleoutsidewhocouldn’tgetintothevenue.ItwasareallycoolchancetojustchataboutthingsthatyoumightnotoftenhereonBulletproofRadio.IfyouhaveachancetowatchthisoneonYouTube,definitelytakeit.Ifnot,that’sallright,listenupandyouwillhearanawesomeinterview.

Tony: Ladiesandgentlemen,thefounderofBulletproof,themanwhoisaNewYorkTimesbestseller,andmoreimportantlythanthat,he’sgotusallputtingdelicious,bigblobsofbutterinourcoffee.Ladiesandgentlemen,giveitupforDaveAsprey.

Cool,yougettomaketheentrancerightfromthebackandmakeitabitmoredramatic.

Dave: IfeellikeI’monatalkshow.Thisisawesome.

Tony: Didyourealizehowpopularbiohackingisinthiscountryandinthiscity?Weprobablycouldhavefilledthisthreeorfourtimesoverandwe’vebeenturningpeopleawayoverthelastfewdays.Didyouhaveanideaofhowbigyourmovementandthemovementofbiohackingisbecoming?

Dave: Iknowit’sgettingbiggerglobally,butIhaven’tseenthismuchinterestintheUKsofar,sothanksforshowingup.I’mhonored.It’scool.Thisisourmovement,anyone’sabiohackerwhenyoustartpayingattentiontostuff.Ipushedthebuttonontheword,butthere’salotofpersonalworkthatpeoplearedoing.


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Tony: Yeah,thewordandalso,Ithink,anygreatmovementhastohaveagoodgimmick.Let’sstartby

talkingaboutthecoffee.There’sbeen,Ithinkit’sfairtosaythatBritsareslightlymoreskepticalthanAmericansingeneral,andtherehasbeensomeskepticism.Isthatfairtosayingeneral?We’reslightlylesswillingtoadoptthings.Therehasbeensomeskepticisminthepress,TheGuardiansaidittastedbitterandoily,butthere’salotofpeopleherewholoveitaswell.Isthereasensethatthisisnowalmostbecomingmainstreamdoyouthink?

Dave: ItwasTheTelegraphwhosaidthattheBulletproofDietwas“everythingwrongwithAmericainadiet.”Ithoughtthatwasabetterquote.That’sbecausetheBritishpressisverytrustworthyandcredible,right?Whenyou’reaskeptic,it’sveryfunnywhatsomeofthelatestneuroscienceshows,about2%ofthecorpuscallosum,thatlittlenetworkofnervesthatconnectthetwohalvesofyourbrain,youhavethelogicalsideandtheemotional,intuitiveside,whenyou’reaskepticyou’vetakenthe2%ofthosethatarereallygoodforgoingbackandforthandyou’vetrainedthemasafirewalltoblockanyinteractionbetweenthetwohouseofyourbrain.Therestofuswhoareactuallygettingshitdone,we’veactuallypaidattentiontothosenervesanduptrainedthemsowehavebetterinterhemisphericconductivitysowecanactuallysensewhethersomethingisworkinginsteadofbeingafraidthatitmightnotwork.IloveskepticsbecausewhatyoudoisyoumakethemapropercupofBulletproofcoffee,whichmeansit’snotbitterandoilybecausetheymadeitright,andthentheydrinkitandyougo,“Howdoyoufeel?”Ahalf-hourlater,95%ofthetimetherelike,“OhmyGod,”and5%ofthetimelike,“I’vegottogotothebathroom.”I’mokaywitheitheroneforskeptics.

Tony: WhoherehastriedBulletproofcoffeebefore?Whoherehasn’t?Ha-ha.Weareservingit.Ifyou’reabitworriedaboutbeingtotallywired,thenweareservingdecafaswellalittlebitlateron,assoonasoururnsheatup.

WhataboutBulletproofcoffeeforathleticperformance?Isthatstartingtotakeoff?I'mthinking,obviously,weloveoursporthereintheUK,mightweseethelikesofChelseaandArsenalfootballclubfollowingaBulletproofDietorattheveryleastdrinkingBulletproofcoffeeinthemorning?

Dave: Idon’treallyfollowcelebritypeoplethatmuch,thislastweekendIgotapicturefromtheBulletproofCoffeeShopinSantaMonicafromthisguy,Ithinkheiswellknown,itwasDavidBeckham.Hecametheretwice.Hecamethereoneday,andcamebackthenextday,soIknowhe’strieditandhewascoolwithhavinghisphototaken.Unfortunately,Iwasn’ttheretomeethim.Also,wesponsortheLAGalaxywheremostoftheUKsoccerproswhen,Iguess,they’redonehere.

Tony: Yeah,whentheirpastitalittlebit.

Dave: Yeah,butit’sastart.It’sAmericansoccer,it’sgottohappen.

Tony: I'mthinkingintermsofhigh-performance,Iknowsomeoftheseenduranceathletesnowareswitching…Obviously,20yearsagothethinkingwas“You’vegottoloadupwithextracarbs.”Now,isthereasensethattheathleticcommunityfollowinghigh-fatdietsaswell?Doesthat


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workifyouaretryingtobreakrecords,forexample?

Dave: It’sstillcontroversial.Ithinkforcertaintypesofendurancesportsyouwanttostartoutinfatburningmode,youwanttobefatadapted,butyoumightwanttoswitchtocarbsatacertainpoint.Thereisawall,butBulletproofandthesekindoftechniques,itmovesthewallwayout,butyoucanstillhitit.Idon’thaveanyproblemwhensomeone’slike,“I’mon75milesofrunning,”Idon’tknowwhatthatisinkilometers,sorry,but,“I’verunalotalot,morethanamarathon.IthinkIwanttohavesomesugarnow.”I'mlike,“Good,goforit.There’snothingwrongwiththat.Youmightwanttoputsomethingsthataddexogenousketonesinsoyoucanhavebothenergypathwaysgoingatthesametime.”

I’mconvincedthat,rightnow,BrainOctane,orintheUK,thankstotheregulatorypeople,HighOctaneOil,isthenumberonesourceofexogenousketonesintheworld’sdietrightnowbecauseit’stheoilthatconvertsmostquicklytoketones.Ofcourse,athleticpeoplewanttodoitinabigway.Surfersarealloverthestufflike,“Icangetmoreenergypercycleoutofmymitochondria,”whichmightmatterwhenthereisawaveofholdingyouunderwaterforawhileandthingslikethat.I’mseeingitinstrengthathletics,I’mseeingitinenduranceathletics.

themistakesthatsomepeoplearemaking,inmyopinion,isthey’regoingintoketosisandstayingthereforever.ThecyclicalketosisapproachthatIoutlinedinthebookseemstoworkbetterformostpeople.Ifyouhavecancerandifyou’reoneofthosegeneticpeoplewhereyoujustloveitandyoufeelthatyou’renevergoodoncarbs,that’scool,butIthinkthatthat’stheexception,nottherule.

Tony: It’sobviouslygettingbigger,isn’tit?You’vegotalotofpeopleinherewhocometoseeyoutoday.AnyplanstoopenacoffeeshopinLondon?

Dave: AbsolutelyIhaveplanstoopenacoffeeshopinLondon.

Tony: Thatwouldbequitepopular.

Dave: Justone?

Tony: AcoupleofotherLondon-centricquestions.AmIrightinsayingyoudon’tliketakingthetube?

Dave: Doesanyoneliketakingthetube?

Tony: It’sveryquick,it’saneasygatewaytogetaround.Tellusaboutyourexperiencesgoing…

Dave: Ihaveauniqueradar.I’moneofthe28%oftheworldwhohavegenesthatmakeusmoresusceptibletotoxicmold.Infact,itcausesmitochondrialweaknessinme.WhenI’minaplacethat’smoldy,sometimeswithinsecondsandalwayswithinminutes,I’llfeelit,I’llfeelitinmybrain.

Iusedtocommuteoutherealot,likeonceeverymonthforabouttwoyears.IworkedinCambridgesoIwouldfly,I’dgetacoupleofextradaysinLondon.IrememberonedayItookthe


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tubetogoseetheBritishMuseum.Like,“Allright,thisisgoingtobereallyfun.”I’monthetubeandI’mstartingtofeelreally,reallyweird,likeseeingcolorskindofweird.Iwalkeddownthislong,tiled,dankhallway,theoneswithwhitetilesonthemthatarejustnasty.Bytheendofit,I'mlike,“Okay,I’mgettingtunnelvision,”soIwaslike,“I’lljustholdmybreath.”Itstartedtogoreallyfast.IwillsayIwasreallynothappy,andpeoplewho’vebeenexposedmanytimes,likeIhave,totoxicmoldtheyknowthisfeeling.You'relike,“Ihavetogetoutofhere.”I’mtakingtheescalatorstairstwoatatime,andthisverypolitegentlemancomesonoverheadspeakersandhe’slike,“Wouldthegentlemanchargingtheescalatorspleasestop.”I'mlike,“Charging?That’susingacreditcard.”Icouldn’tprocesswhathewassaying,andI’msureIscaredpeoplerunninguptheescalators.

Iwentoutsideandbreathedandittooklikeeightshotsofcoffeetoturnmymitochondriabackonbecausecaffeinechangesthisthingcalledcyclicalamp,whichisanenzymethathelpsyoumakeyourATPworkagain.Basically,Ifeltcrappyallday.Icantellyou,asamatteroffact,thattheairinthetubeisabsolutelyhorrible.You’vegotpollutants,you’vegotchemicals,andyougotthisenvironmentalthinggoingonbecauseit’salwayswetandit’salwaysdark.Iftheydidairqualitymonitoringinthetube,noonewouldtakethetube.It’sthatbadforyou.Mywife,Dr.Lana,whodoesfertilitycoachingforglobalclients,includingafewpeoplewholiveinLondon,flatout,ifyou’retryingtogetpregnantdon’ttakethetube.Itmakesadifference.

Tony: Who’sgettingUberonthewayhome?

Dave: Justholdyourbreath.

Tony: Let’stalkaboutsupplements,then,Dave.Iknowyou’renotalwayswillingtoexactlytalkaboutwhatsupplementsyou’vetaken,buttellmewhatyou’vetakentoday.

Dave: You’vejustremindedme,actually.Ineedsomewater,though.Ihavealittlebaggy.

Tony: We’vegotyourbottleofwaterhere.

Dave: Excellent.

Tony: This,presumably,isn'tallofyoursupplementsfortheday?

Dave: WhenItravelIdo,basically,threebagsaday.Ineedaspoon,alighter,andaneedle.Let’sseeifIcanfigureoutwhat’sinhere.

Tony: It’squitealotinthere.Itlookslikethere’sprobably20pillsinthereorsomethinglikethat.

Dave: Somethinglikethat.Thisisrelativelylight.

Tony: Thisisalivepill-takingonapodcast.Don’tknowwhetherthat’sbeentriedbefore,Idon’tknowwhetherweshouldevertryagain,butwe’llsee.

Dave: Let’ssee,Idon’tknowifIcantellyouwhatallthewhiteonesare,Iknowthere’ssome


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Aniracetaminhere,thatlookslikegamma-Linolenicacid…No,that’sactuallyvitaminE,mixedtocopherolsandtocotrienols.There’sanadrenalextract,astaxanthin,whichisreallyimportantwhenyoutravel,BrainOctanecapsule,whichhelpsabsorptionofeverythingelse,adaptogenicherbs,turmeric,there’sanupgradedaginginhere.That’sbilberry,I’mreallyworkingoneyehealthbecauseitrunsinmyfamilytogetmaculardegenerationandbecauseIhavelightsensitivity.

Tony: What’sthathalfapillthere?What’sthat?

Dave: Thehalfapillrighthere?Thatisoneoftwothings,let’sseeifIcantellyouwhichoneitis.Itiseitheranaromataseinhibitor,whichpreventstestosteronefromconvertingintoestrogen,whichtendstohappenalotinmyfamilyjusthistorically.Iusedtoweigh50%morethanIweigh,mybodywillalwaysconverttestosteronetoestrogenmoreaggressivelythannormalsoIcycleonandoffoftheseonoccasion.It’seither,thatoritcouldbecortisol.Ifyoudon’twanttobejetlaggedandyougetaprescriptionforcortisol,takemicrodosesofcortisolandyoudon’tgetjetlag.It’sawesome.

Tony: Wow.Asyoustarttotakeyourpills,Ijustwonder…

Dave: I’lljustdoitlikethis,watch.

Tony: Noway.

Dave: It’snotthathard.

Tony: Didyouthrowitinyourshirt?It’slikemagic.

Dave: Didn’tyoulearnhowtodrinkapint?

Tony: Iwasnevergoodatthat,downingapintatonce.

Dave: It’sthesametechniquejustdrinkingalotofbeer

Tony: Goodeffort.DidanyonehererecognizeeverythingthatDavecalledout?Anyone?Okay.Afew,shepitchedhalf-half.Comeon,putyourhandsupandgiveusaproper…Yeah,okay,afewofyou.That’sprettyimpressive.Quiteafewofyoursmartdrugsinthere.Whatwouldyousaytopeoplewhoarewellupfortakinganythingnatural,whichismostofwhatyourecommend,butobviously,smartdrugsarenotnecessarilynaturalinthesamewaythatchemicalcompounds?

Dave: Nootropicsareaninterestingcategorybecausetheyincludenaturalcompounds,buttheyalsoincludepharmaceuticals.IntheStates,toget[parasitin00:13:53],whenIfirststartedtakingit,whichistechnicallyapharmaceutical,eventhoughintheUSitisoneofthose“doesnotexist,”it’snotinthebookfordoctors.Ifyougotoanormaldoctorandsay,“Iamtakingthis,”andtheycan’tfindit.There’sablindspot.TheyconsideritanorphandrugintheUS,whichisfunnybecauseit’sbeenaroundfor60years,it’smadebySandozPharmaceuticalsandisanythingbutanorphan,it’saverywell-studieddrug.It’sjust…It’simpolite,andit’sactuallynotPuritan,


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goingbacktotheUSsortofthing,totakedrugsthatmakeyoubetter.Youhavetobesicktotakeadrugbutifyou’realreadywellandyoutakeadrug,clearlyyou’reabadpersonandyouprobablyalsohavesex.

Tony: Therearealsopeoplethatsay,“Idon’ttakedrugs,IjustgeteverythingIneedfrommydiet.Idon’tbelieveinallthisextrastuff,IjustbelieveingettingthenutrientsthatIcanfrommydietandIeatwell.”Ikindofknowthereplythatyou’regoingtosaybutIwantedtoaskyouthatanywaybecauseIfeelthatthat’sacommoncomplaintofpeoplewhotakealotofsupplementslikeyoujusthave.

Dave: Whensomeonesaysthat,theeasiestthingisIjustsay,“How’sthatworkingforyou?”Thereasonthey’reaskingmethesequestionsisbecauseit’snotworkingforthem,andsometimesyoucansay,“Yourpantsaretoobig,sorry.”Likeit’snotworkingforyou,youcanjustpointitoutforthem.“Youlooklikecrap,”isanotherwayyoucansaythatwithoutmeaningtoberudeoranything,butyou’relike,“Let’stalkaboutthis.”Therealpointhereis,look,ifyou’reonlygoingtogetyourfoodfrommothernatureandyourvitaminsfrommothernatureyou,shouldreceiveallofyourtoxinsfromonlymothernature.NoEMFs,nojunklighting...Let’ssee,youshouldnopetrochemicals,noplastic,noplasticizers,noendocrinedisruptingchemicals,nocoaldust,nomercuryatthelevelswehavetoday,andthelistgoesonandon.Nostress,likemodernstress.Basically,goputonatogaandliveinthehills.

Bytheway,youneedtogrowallofyourownfoodbecausethefoodyou’reeatingnowhasnothingtodowiththefoodthatwouldbecomingfromyourowngardenbecausealotofitwaspickedayearagoandit’snotfreshanditdoesn’thavethenutrientsinitandit’sbeenhybridized.Iwouldsaythatthey'relivinganabsolutefantasy.Thesearehardfacts.Youshouldcounteractallthiscrapthatcomesintoyourbodywithjustnaturalstuff.It’slikeIliketorunmarathonswearinghighheelsandmyhandsbehindmyback.Whywouldyoudothat?Youcouldifyouwantedto.

Tony: That’saprettycomprehensiveanswer.WhataboutintermsofpeoplelivinginthiscityandarekeentomakeitasLondon-centricandisBritish-centricaspossible?I,personally,feelthecoldalot,muchmorethanIeverdidinmyearly20s.Ifeelliketoday,themiddleofsummerprettymuchhere,andit’sprettycold,it’snotaparticularlywarmcountry.Arethereanysupplementsthatwecouldtake,firstly,toalleviatethat,andsecondly,I’msurealotofpeoplehavereallybeengivenpauseforthoughtbywhatyousaidaboutthetube.Arethereanysupplementsthattheycouldtakeintermsofoffsettingthosesymptoms?theanswermightbeno,butIguessit’sworthasking.

Dave: Tostaywarm,there’saninterestingaminoacidcalledL-Tyrosinethatup-regulatesyourthyroidfunctionalittlebit.Youcantake500mginthemorning,andifyoudon’tfeelsuperampyandjitteryit’sprobablygoingtohelpyouthat.Greenteaextractscouldmakeadifference,L-Theaninecouldpotentiallymakeadifference,andanythingthatupregulatesyourmitochondrialefficiencyormitochondrialfunctionisprobablygoingtohelpwiththat.Iwouldalsosay,ifyou’recoldallthetime,haveyouhadacomprehensivethyroidpanel?Itissocommonforpeopletohaveathyroidthatisn’tworkingverywell,evenintheirmid-20s.Ifyougotothenormalphysicianherethey’regoingtogiveyouatestforTSH,whichisoneofsevendifferent


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waysyourthyroidcanbreak.Ifthathormoneisokay,they’relike,“Youdon’thaveaproblem.”You’relike,“ButI’mcold,andmyskinisdry,andIamtiredallthetime.Thosemightbeproblems,Doc.”Thenyouhavetoarmwrestlethemuntiltheyagreetoorderacomprehensivepanel,andit’slike,“Oh,you’renotconvertingT4toT3thewayyoushould,it’snotahormoneissueit’saconversionissue.”Iwouldsay,ifyou’recoldallthetime,it’sworthreallydiggingonthyroidfirstandforemost.Youmaybeabletohelpwithjustiodine.It’sreallyhardtosayuntilyouhavethedata.

Tony: Okay,Iwill.Iguesstheremaybeanadrenalcomponentofthataswell.

Dave: TherecanbeanadrenalcomponentandinChinesemedicinethey’lljusttellyouthisamazingthing,drinkhottea,greenteanotblackinChina,andwearajacket.There’sactuallyabelieftherethatifyou’recoldallthetime,especiallywhenyoutravel,thatitdepletesyouandthatyouactuallyworkbetterwhenyou’realittlebitwarm.OneoftheChineseguysIworkwithwhoistrainedwith…Hecanactuallysitinthesnowandmeltacirclearoundhimkindofguy,hewaslike,“WhenItravelIalwayshaveajacketandalittlecapstaywarmespeciallyonairplanes.”Ilike,“Youcouldmeltglaciers,dude.”He’slike,“Yeah,butIdon’twanttowastemyenergyonthat.”Soyoumightjustdresswarmer.

Tony: Yeah,that’snotquitetheadviceIwaslookingfor,butifit’sallwarm.Whataboutmold?thatwasthesecondpartofthequestion.Isthereanythingthatwecouldtaketoalleviatethoseissues,bearinginmindsometimesit’stheonlywaythatyoucangetacrossLondonandthatistotakethetube.

Dave: Sure.WhatIwouldlookoutthereisglutathionewhichisoneofthemajordetoxthingsinyourbody,canbevery,verypowerful.Ifyoucan’tgetglutathione,justvitaminCcouldmakeadifference,alphalipoicacidcouldmakeadifference.Thoseareverylimitedastohowthey’llhelpyou,buttheycanhelpyou.Iprefer…Imakeglutathione,youcantellIgoingtobebiasedinthatdirection,butImakeitforareason.Thenactivatedcharcoal,whichisanotherthingthatImanufacture,isshown,infactit’sintheUSmilitaryprotocolsfordealingwithpeoplewho’vebeenexposedtomoldtoxins,isoneofthethingsthatcanbindthem.Sodoesbentoniteclay,andsodoesaprescriptiondrugcalledcholestyramine.Idon’tthinkyouneedtobefearfulbecausethat’salsonotsogoodforyourperformance.

Whatyouwanttodothoughisrecognize,IfIgetinthetubeandIcomeoutandahalfhourlaterIhavereallyweirdsugarcravingsthatI’mnotusedto,there’sareasonforthat.Thosesugarcravingsarehappeningbecauseyourbodyislike,“Ineedtooxidizealotofreallybadthingsthatjusthappenedtome,”andit’sbasicallycallingoutforenergy.Whenthathappens,andthisisgoingtosoundcrazy,havesomesugar.WhenIcameoutofthetubeandIhadmyeightshotsofespresso,Iwasputtingsugarintothem.Idon’tlikesugar,Idon’teventhinkittastesgoodincoffee,itruinscoffee,butIwantedthesugarasamedicalsubstancetogivemeashortburstofATP.Itmakesyoufeelbetter,andyouhavetodealwiththesideeffectsofthesugarlater,butit’salotbetterthanfeelingcrappywhenyoucomeout.

Youmayalsobelike,“IridebutyoubutIfeeljustfine.”What’shappeningthereisyou'reoneofthepeoplehasreallygoodgenesandyoudon’tgetaninflammatoryresponse.Here’sthe


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problem,thosetoxins,theycausedamagetoyourDNA,likeoxidativeDNAdamage.There’stwokindsofstressforthebodywhatiscalledhormeticstress,whatdoesn’tkillmemakesmestronger.RememberthePrincessBrideinthatmovie,alittlebitofpoisoneverydaysothatyou’llbeimmune?Molddoesn’tworklikethat.Unfortunately,itcausesdamage.

IfI'mthecanary,I’moneoftheoneinfour,andyou’rethenon-canarywebothcomeoff,andImightbelike,“God,Ifeellikecrap.IwanttotakeanapandIwanttoeatacookie,”andyou’relike,“What’swrongwithyou?”Well,you’restillpayingthebiologicalcostforthosespecificmycotoxins.You’renotplayingtheinflammatorycostthathappensbecausemyimmunesystemrecognizesthingsthatyoursdoesn’t,soyouhaveanadvantageexceptthatyou’renotawareofit,soyoumightexposeyourselftoiteveryday,which…Ihave1200studiesonthewebsiteaboutOTAandstuffthat’sfoundincoffee,andanother1400aboutaflatoxin,andthere’sawholebunchofothermolds.Weknowthesethings,thatisatechnicalterm.Ialwayswanttosaybollockshere,butIdon’tknowhowtouseitsowouldmakenosense.Itbollocksesyouup.SeeImisuseditentirely,butbasically,it’sbad.

Tony: I’mgladyoumentionedcharcoaltabletsbecauseoneofthethingsthatisBritsreallylike,wereally,reallylikeitandoursociallifeisbasedaroundit,isgoingtothepub.Wedoliketheboozeup,mostofus.Whoheredrinksatleastveryoccasionally?Whoheredoesn’tdrinkatall?Okay,probably70or80%ofthepeopledodrink.

Dave: Thisisn’trepresentativeoftheUKatall

Tony: No,mostbars…Yeah,exactly.IfpeoplewanttogotothebarwithoutfeelingtooguiltywhatisthemostBulletproofdrinkthattheycouldhave?

Dave: Youwantgoodqualityvodka,andyoucanhavethatwithlimeorlemonandalittlebitofsparklingwaterorclubsodasortofthings,youdon’twantthesugar.Here’sthemagicthingaboutgoodvodkaanyway,it’sdistilledandcharcoalfilteredwhichmeansinsteadofhavingyourliverandkidneysdoallthework,yououtsourcetheworktotechnologyandthenyou’vegotthepuresubstancethatcameoutasaresultofthat.Unfortunately,it’snotallfoamyandamazinglookinginabigmug,Idon’tknowhowtomakethathappenwithvodka,butIsupposeyoucanputitinyourBulletproofcoffee.

Tony: Obviouslysomevodkasaredistilledfromwheat.Theysayalltheglutenisgoneoutofit,butsomeceliac’swon'thavewheatdistilledvodkasanyway.Whatwouldyousayaboutthat?

Dave: Irecommendpotatovodkaforthatdifference,buthere’sthething.20%ofpeoplearesensitivetonightshadevegetablesandpotatoesareanightshadevegetable.IfIeatpotatoesthemusclesallalongmyspinegetknottedupandmyjointshurtforaweek,soIgenerallydon’teatthembecausethenightshadefamilyhasthesethingscalledlectins.Manyfoodshavethem,buttheonesthatareparticularlyaggressive,andlectinsareproteinsthatsticktosugarsinyourbody.Thesugarsthatlinemyjointsarethekindthatpotatoesliketostickto.WhenIeatthoseI’mlike,“Wow,IfeellikeIdidwhenIwas22.Everythinginmybodyhurtsallthetime.”Forme,maybeapotatovodkaisn’tabigdeal,exceptIcandrinkeitherkindofvodkaandIjustgotalittledrunkfromthembecause,really,they’rehighlydistilled.Unlessyouareextremely


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sensitive,Idon’tthinkanyoneisgoingtofeelthedifferencethere.

Tony: Iwasundertheimpressionthattequilawasactuallypotentiallypurerthanvodka.Idon’tknowquitewhyIthoughtthat,butwhatwouldyousayabouttequila?

Dave: Tequilaismadefromagavewhichisthesexiestnewveganthing.Agavenectar,whichisbasicallyhighfructosecornsyrupforhippies.Here’stheproblem,thesearegiantcacti.IgrewupinNewMexico,theygrowrightsouthoftheborderthere,andthereissomethinglike200speciesandonlyoneofthemisreallyfitforhumanconsumption,buttheykeepovergrowingandoverharvestingthem.Theytakealltheotherspeciesthatweren’teventhatwellrecommendedforit,sowhenyou’regettingyouragavenectar,blah,tequila,bottomline,it’snotreallygoingtomatter.Whatreallymattersthoughwasthewormorganic.

Atacertainpoint,we’retalkingdistilledandfilteredbeverages,thereasonIsayvodkaisbetteristhey’veactuallytakenmoreoutinthedistillationprocessbecausethere’snocoloringleftsomeofthetracecompoundsaren’tthere,butfortheaveragepersonanyofthedistilledalcoholsthataredistilledandfiltered,pickoneyoulikeandyou’regoingtobesohighintheBulletproofspectrumcomparedto,say,drinkingbeer.Idon’tlikethatanswer,that’sjusthowthebiologyworksout.You’reluckyhere,redwinestillhasissueswithochratoxinA,thesamestuffthat’sincoffee,buttheEuropeanlimitsonthegoodstuffhereareprettydecent.IfyouweretodrinkadrywhiteFrenchwine,orevenaFrenchred,thelimitsare2partsperbillion,iftheyactuallytestthewinewhichalotofitisn't.Ifyou’redrinkingfromahigh-endvineyard,especiallyonethatusesoldworldtechniques,you’reprobablygoingtobeokayunlessyou’reallergictoyeast,whichtonsofpeopleareanddon’tknow.Ifyoudrinkwineandyounormallydon’tfeelquiteasgoodaswhenyoudrinkvodka,you’realwaysgoingtohavelessbiologicalworkwhenyoudrinkvodka.

Tony: Yeah,youcoveralcoholdrinksintheBulletproofDietRoadmapaswell,don’tyou?

Dave: Yeah.It’sactuallyawholeseparateroadmap,ithadtobethatbig.It’sallfreeonthewebsite.

Tony: Didyoutestitallyourself?

Dave: Idid.Iwenttouniversityin…Irememberatleasttwoorthreeclasses.

Tony: It’sactuallyreallyuseful,theBulletproofDietRoadmap.I,yesterday,wasfeelinggreat,andgenerallyconsidermyselftoeatquitehealthily,andstoppedonthewaytoworkatSkyandtreatedmyselftosomehummus.Withinabout15minutes,Ifelttheinflammation.Ithought,“I’llchecktheBulletproofDietRoadmap,”andyoutalkquitealotaboutchickpeasandhowinflammatorytheycanbe.Iknowit’squiterandom,butalotofpeoplewouldconsiderhummustoberelativelyhealthy,whyisitsoinflammatory?

Dave: Okay.There’stwoplatesinfrontofyouoneisfullofguacamoleandoneisfullofhummus,whywouldyouevereathummus?Iwouldsaygofortheguac.Thereasonisthesearelegumes,they'refulloftheselectins.Theyareactuallydifferentlectinsthanthenightshadeones,butforalotofpeople,waymorethanisacknowledged,theycauseproblems.Theotherissueisthat


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theyhavestorageandcontaminationissues.Whenyoutakesomethinglikearelativelyhighproteinbeanandyousoakit,likeyouwouldinordertomakehummus,whathappensduringthesoaktime?Normally,yougetmicrobiologicalactivity.Yougetbacteria,andyoucangetayeastorafungusgrowing.Oneofthethingsthatisawell…Isn'teventalkedaboutinthewineindustryorthecoffeeindustry,butitissomethingthatIdotestfor,iscalledbiogenicamines.

Thesearethingslikehistamine,isabiogenicamine,tyramineisone.You’veheardofcheesemigraines?thatcomesfromtyramine.Forsomepeoplegettingalittlebitofthat,becauseyou’vesoakedthesethingsforawhileandthenyoublendedthemup,andthenifyou'regettingthemfromacontainerinthegrocerystore,afteryou’vemadeaperfectPetridish,yougotsomebacteriaandallfromtheair,you’vegotsomemoisture,you’vegotsome…Youblenditupandthenyoujustletitsitthereforawhile.It’snotsurprisingyougetthateffect.

Samething,yougotooneoftheserawveganrestaurants…Here’swhatIalwaysdowhenIgothere.IfI’mgoingtoeatoneofthosedessertsthattastedeliciousbutprobablyhaveagaveandhoneyin,likeI’mnothavinganycardstodayorwhateverbutit’sgoingtotastegood,youjustsay,“Didyoumakeittoday?”Ifyoueatthatyou’regoingtofeelgreat.Iftheymadeittwodaysagoandyoueatit,youshouldexpecttofeelalittlebitzombifiedandtohavefoodcravingsafterwardsandit’sbecauseofwhathappenedbetweenwhenitwasmadeandwhenyouateit.Thiswholefoodsafetything,itactuallyreallymatters.

Tony: Justonemorequestiononfood.Ithinkforalotofpeopleitwouldseemtobeasmallleapbetweenputtingbutterincoffeeandeatingcheese,butcheeseis,ontheBulletproofDietRoadmap,prettymuchtheworstthing.Tellusalittlebitaboutcheese.Iatequitealotofitlastweek,andthenafterwardsIthought,“Maybethatdidn’tquiteagreewithmethewayIthoughtitdid.”

Dave: YoucouldeatAmericancheesewhichwouldbeevenworse.Processedcheesefood.“Cheesefoodproduct”it’scalledonthelabel.Truly.That’sjustweirdchemicalsandwhateverresidueisleftoverafterrealcheese.Here’sthemainingredientofcheese,it’scaseine,whichismilkprotein.Thatstuffishighlyinflammatory,anditdoescorrelatewithlevelsoflivercancer,andIgenerallyrecommendmostpeopleavoidcaseinasmuchisreasonable.Therearetraceamountsinbutter,somepeoplewhoaretrulysensitivehavetohavegheeinsteadofbuttertoremovecasein,butwhenyouminimizetheamountofcaseinyouget,youfeelmuchbetter.

There’salso…Thisiswhathappensincheese.Youhaveasetofnutrientshere,there’smilk,andyouhavesomeenzymes,andthenyouhavesomebacteria,andthensomeyeastorsomefungus,dependingonwhatkindofcheeseyouhave,thisniceblueveinything.Andthenwarfarestarts.Sinceneitheroneofthemhasknivesandgunsandthingslikethat,whattheydoistheystartmakingchemicalstobasicallykilltheotheroneandthenyoueatwhat’sleftwhenthere’ssmokingrubbleandonesideisleft.There’salotofweirdcompoundsintherethataren’twell-recognized.OneofmyfavoriteonesisRoquefortineC,Roquefort.There’sactuallyamycotoxincalledRoquefortineC,andweknowit’sbadforyou.It’slike,“Youcanhandleit,”andactually,youprobablycanhandleit.

Dependentonyourbiology,you’llhandleitbetterorworse,butIhavethiscrazyideawith


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Bulletproofthathandleasfewthingsasyoureallyneedtohandle,sowhydoyouwanttohandlethat?itcouldbebecauseIlikestinkycheeseonmysalad,atwhichpoint,great,acknowledgethatyou’renotonlydoingsomethinggoodwiththecheeseandsay,“Allright,fine,I’mgoingtodealwithit.Iwilltakesomecharcoal,orI’lljustbetired,ormaybeit’llhavenoeffectatallbecauseI’veidentifiedthatstuffisn’tasuspectfoodforme,I’mtotallyfinewithit.”MostpeopleIknowwhogiveupcheeseforacoupleofweeks,theythinkclearer,theyhavefewerfoodcravings,theyhavelessmuffintop,theirskinlooksmuchbetter,youcanseeitintheskinmostofall,andit’sasubtlething.It’slike,“Ihadthischeese,Ifeelfine,”andthencheckyourselfoneday,twodays,threedays,fourdayslaterasdifferentlayersofinflammationunveilthemselves.

Iwilltellyou,IhavekidsandIliveonanislandwhereliterallythecowsthatIeat,eatthegrassfromthefrontpartofmyfarm,soI’maslocalasyoucanget.Maybeonceamonth,I’llmakeBulletproofpizza.Iwillusegrassfed,localcheese,andI’mstillsomewhatsensitivetoit,butIcantoleratethatreasonablywell,buteverytimeIdoit,thedayaftermythinkingisn’tasgood.It’snotlikemythinkingisn'tprettygoodalmostallthetimenow,I’vedialedthatin.IusedtohavebrainfogallthetimeIcouldn’trememberwords,whatwasIgoingtosay,whydidIopenthefridge,wherearemycarkeys,allthatstuffhasbecomeeffortlessforme.Itjustdoesn’thappenevenifIonlygotthreehoursofsleeporsomething,actually,likeIdidlastnight,I’mtotallyfine.Icanbringit.IfIhavecheese,acoupleofdayslater,I'mjustnot…I'm80%there,butI’mnot100%there.

it’sthatnuance,whenyoustartpayingattentionto,“Waitaminute.WhydoIfeellikethisrightnow?”Thatreallycaninstructyoualot.Noonetoldme20yearsago,whenIstartedtakingnotesonthis,thatwhatIdidfourdaysagocouldhaveanimpactonme.Itdrovemenutsforyears.IthoughtIwasfineongluten,soIwouldeatglutenononedayandthenextdayIwasreallyfine,butthedayafterthat,Iwasreallynotfine.Toknowthere’salagtimewhenyoueatcheeseiskindofimportantknowledgethathasn’tbeenoutthere.

Tony: That’squitehardtotrackisn’tit?Ididwanttoaskabouttracking.Whoheretracksinsomewaysomeaspectoftheirlives?justputyourhandsup.Okay,somostofus.Whohereiswearingatracker?Notthatmany.It’squitehardtotrack,asfarasIhavefound,I'mabitofatrackinggeekandI’vegotafeelingmyobsessionwithtrackingisn’tnecessarilyhealthy.Intermsofbeingabletotracksomethinglike,“IatecheeseandatwodayslaterIfeltbad,”Ihaven’tfoundanythingthatdoesthejobparticularlywell.Haveyougotanyrecommendationsfortracking?

Dave: There’safreeappcalledFoodDetective,it’sonethatBulletproofdeveloped,andit’sfreebecauseit’sactuallyimportantstuff.Whatyoucandowiththatisshortcutalittlebit.Ifyou’retrulysensitivetoafood,youusethisappinthemorning,itgivesabaselineheartrate.Notheartratevariability,justheartrate.Thenyoutellitwhatyouate,andyougetyourheartratebeforeandafterameal.Ifthere’ssomethinginamealthatyou’resensitiveto,it’sgoingtoraiseyourheartratebyabout17beatsaminutewithin90minutesafteryoueat.Youcouldusethis,whichismaybelessofatrackingthing,butmaybemoreofadetectivething.

Iadvisepeopletotrackwhatyouhack.Thereissomethingcalledexposome,andthisisawordthatwasinventedmaybesevenyearsago.Thisisasetofalltheenvironmentalthingsaround


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youthatyou'reexposedtooverthecourseofyourlife.It’sthousandsoftimebiggerthanthehumangenome.BecauseIhavenoideaiftheplanetaryalignmentreallymakesanydifferenceornot,butit’ssomethingyou'reexposedto,andifyouwanttoeliminatethatvariable,youmightwanttopayattentiontothat.

Theideaoftrackingcouldbereallymisleading.Youknowwhycholesterolissofeared?becauseitwasoneofthefirstthingswecouldtrackandblood,soweobsessaboutcholesteroleventhoughitturnsoutitwasn’tthatterriblyusefulafterall.Igetthese,goingbacktotheskeptics,“Youcan’tchangemorethanonevariable.”I’mlike,“That’salaughablestatement.Everyoneischangingtensofthousandsofvariablesaday,youjustdon’tknowwhattheyare.Whatpathdidyoutaketoworktoday?doesthataffectyourdrugtrialoutcome?nooneknowsbecausenooneevertrackedit,butitwasn’tthesameeveryday.”Thisideaofonlychangingonevariableatatimeislaughable,anditdoesn’tworkwhenyou’retestingsupplements.Youwanttobeattentiontothatwhenyou'retracking.

It’sbettertopickagoalandsay,“WhatarethevariablesthatIcanthinkofthatmightaffecttheoutcome?”andjustfocusonthatoneoutcomeandchangeallofthevariablesthatmightdoituntilyougetwhatyou’relookingfor.Thenyoucanzoominandchangefiveortenthings.Ifyouweretotryeverysupplementonthemarketforonemonthtoseewhichoneworked,twothingswouldhappen.Oneisyouwoulddiebeforeyoutriedthemall.Thesecondthingthatwouldhappenisthatyouwouldprobablymissalotofthethingsthataremultifactorial.

Thebiohackingapproachis,“IwantedtochangeX.Whydon’tItakeeverysupplementthat,inthestudy,canchangeXandseeifIgetwhereIwanttogoandthenbackoff?”Myfirstseveralyearsoftryingtochangethingsbiologically,onlyonevariableatatime,andit’sahopeless,fool’serrand.Itdoesn’twork,andit’salietoyourselfbecauseyoualreadychangingeveryvariableeveryday.Youjustaren’tpayingattentiontothem.

Tony: ItendtothinkthatsomeofthetrackingdevicesthatarecomingoutnowactuallywouldalmosthaveadetrimentaleffectonyourlifebecauseofthelackoffocusthatcomesfromwearinganiWatchthattellsyoueverytimeyougetaWhatsappmessagewhenyoucouldbegoingmoreindepthintowhateveryou’redoingyouagreewiththat

Dave: Absolutely.IwasCTOofBasis,awristbandcompany,thefirstonetheygotheartrateoffthewristthewaythatApplewatchdoesnow,andIntelboughtthatcompanyfor$100million.Icantellyoucategoricallythatthetypeofinformationthatyou’regettingfromthosewatchesisverysuspect.It’ssuspectbecause,caloriesburned,Ireadapostnamingstudies.50%ofthecaloriesyouburnhavenothingtodowithhowmuchyoumove,sohowarethesewatchesdoingthat?WhatisusefulisdidImovemoreorlessthanyesterday?that’sausefuldatapoint,butthecaloriecountisjustpurefiction.Ithasnobasisinreality.Ifyoulookatthecostofinterruption,Ispent10weeksofmylifewithelectrodesgluedtomyheaddoingthe40YearsofZenprogramandthingslikethat,I’vehadmyownEEGathomesince1997.Whenthephoneringsyouabsolutelysee,yougostraightintofireorflight,yougointobetarightoutofalpha,rightoutoftheta,alltheplaceswhereintuition,andcreativity,andcalmfocuscomefrom.Everytimeanalertcomesthrough,itbasicallykicksthatpartofyourmeatoperatingsystem,whatIcalltheLabradorbraininthebook.Itsays,“Look,threat,rightnow,”andthistakesyououtof


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productivitymode,outoffocusmode.

IturnalertsoffonprettymucheverythingIthinkIgettextmessagealertsbutalmostnoonetextsmeandIwouldturnthoseoffifeveryonestartedtotextme.Idon’tgetanyemailalerts.Ifmyphonerings,IwillgetthatalertalthoughIprobablywon’tansweritbecauseI’mlikelyonacallalready.WhenI’mnotoncalls,IputmyphoneinairplanemodebecauseIreally…Ifyoudon’thaveanappointment,youprobablycan’treachmeunlessyou’remywife.

Tony: It’sjustgoodfortheimportantpartsofthebodytohaveitinanairportmodeisn’tit?

Dave: It’scertainlynotgoingtoharmthemtohaveitinairplanemode.

Tony: Let’sjustcheckhasanybodygottheirphoneinthepocketandit’snotanairportmodeatthemoment?justputyourhandup.It’sokaywewon’tjudge.

Dave: Here’sthething,lookwheremypocketis.Noticemypocketasfarawayfromtheimportantstuff.

Tony: Youbuytrousers,that’sgood.

Dave: Hashtagbiohackerpants.

Tony: OnethingI’veaskedeveryoneonthispodcastiswhatisonebookthatyouwouldrecommendthat’shadareallyprofoundimpactonyourlife,andonetipforlivingwithmoreenergy,vitality,andmotivation.Onebookandonetip.

Dave: Onebookandonetip.It’shardtopickjustonebookbecauseI’vereadthousands,andalotofthemareboringbiologicalbooks,butletmegobacktothebookthatIreadwhenIwas16calledThinkandGrowRichbyNapoleonHill,kindofaclassic.ThereasonI’llgobacktothatistheytellyoutosetgoalsandfocusonthemeveryday,realbasicbiohackingstuff.It’snotbiohackingatall,butIwrotethisgoaldownandIsaid,“BythetimeI’m23,Iwanttohave$1million.”Why?BecauseIthought$1millionwouldmakemehappy.Turnsoutthere’snotmuchcorrelationthere.Noonetoldmethat.Icantellyouitcategoricallydidn’tworkbecauseImade$6millionwhenIwas26,butIdidn’tmake$1millionwhenIwas23.Still,Ithoughtitwasagoodbook.Itactuallyreallyaffectedmycareer.

Iwouldjustsayifyou’rereadingthatbook,oranyoftheotherbookslikethat,thelatestbookthat’sworthreadingistheCodeoftheExtraordinaryMindwhichjustgotpublishedbyVishenLakhiani.Areallygoodbookthathassomeofthatkindofstuffandsomemoremodernstuffinit.Whatwillhappenisyoucangetwhatyouaskfor,andthesamethinggoeswhenyou’retrackingyourself.Ifyou’retrackingcalories,“I’mgoingtoeatlesscaloriestoday,”you’regoingtogetwhatyouaskfor.You'regoingtohavelessenergy.Justmakesurethatyou'revery,veryconsciousandawareinthelanguagethatyouusewhenyou’resettingagoalbecauseifyousetabiohackinggoal,oralifegoal,orasuccessgoal,orwhateveritis,yourbodyisstupidanditmightinterpretthosegoalsveryliterally.Makesureyourunitthroughthelogicfilteraswellasoh-that’s-what-I-thought-I-meantkindoffilter.


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Tony: Whataboutonetipforlivingwithmoreenergyandvitality?

Dave: Probablytheeasiestthingtodoistogethigherqualitysleep.Thisisgoingtosoundalittlebit

weird,buthealthypeopleneedlesssleep.Ifyouwanttogetgoodqualitysleep,doinganythingthatmakesyourbiologyworkbetteristherightapproach.Ifyouneed10hoursofsleepatnight,yourchancesofdyingofall-causemortalityaremuch,muchhigherthansomeonewhosleepssixhoursanight.Thatactuallyisasymptom.It’sokaythatyou'regetting10hoursofsleeptorecover,butyouneedtostartlookingatthatreallycarefully.Ifyoujusthavetohaveeighthoursofsleep,maybethat’sallright,butactually,aneedforlotsandlotsofsleep,unlessyou’redoingsomethinglikeheavyworkoutseveryday,you’reaprofessionalathleteorsomething,thereissomethingnotrightinyourbiology.Payattentiontothequality,notnecessarilythelengthofyoursleep.That’sprobablythebiggestthingyoucando.

Tony: I’msureI’veheardyousaybeforeyouonlysleepsixhoursanightorless?

Dave: Let’ssee,Idotrackthat,it’sprobablytheonetrackingthingthatIdothat’sprettystraightforward.

Tony: Whatdoyouusetotrackit?

Dave: IuseanappcalledSleepCycle.Inthelast1178nights,myaveragetimewassixhoursandoneminute.It’strendedupbyoneminuteinthelastyear.

Tony: Ifeellikethere’ssomesleepexpertswhowouldsayit’snotenough.

Dave: Dotheylooktired?

Tony: Ladiesandgentlemen,we’regoingtotakealittlebreakthere.ThinkofyourquestionsthatyouwouldlovetoaskDave.Obviously,thebarisopenforvodkaandtequila,butnotbeer.Youcanalsomingleattheback,we’vethestallsyoucanobviouslygoandcollectyourBulletproofgoodypackwheneveryoulike,they'reallattheback.We’llcomebackin15minutestimewiththeQ&A.GiveitupforDaveAsprey,ladiesandgentlemen.

Tony: Wearereadywithoursecondpartofourpodcast.WhohasaquestionforDave?Ifeelthatthismanwitharedshirthasbeensoenthusiasticallystickinguphishand.Shoutoutyourquestionandwe’llgoforit.

Ocant: Iwillstandupandshoutitout.Dave,youtalkedabouthigh-performancecouldyousay…

Tony: Okayit’saquestionaboutlowperformanceandhowtoreactwhenyoudon’tfeellikeyou’reactingoptimallyathigh-performance,andwhat’syourname?

Ocant: [Ocant00:42:58].

Tony: Ocant.


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Yani: MynameisYani.

Tony: Johnny?

Yani: Yes,closeenough.

Tony: Verypoliteaswell.Dave?

Dave: Recoveryisoneofthehighestperformanceactivitiesyoucando.Ifyou’repostsurgical,oryou

havesomethingyou’reworkingonandyouhavemassiveadrenalfatigue,thestateofhighperformanceyou’regoingafterishigh-performancerest.Sleepqualityishigh-performancesleepversuslow-performancesleep.Ifyouareinaplacewhereyouhurtyourselfinanathleticeventorsomethinglikethat,theexerciserecommendationsaregoingtochange,andthisisgoingtosoundalittlebitweird,butworkingoutreallyhardwhenyou’resickorwhenyoushouldberecoveringprobablyisn’tgoingtohelp,sonumberonebackoff.Numbertwo,thatwholethingaboutcyclicalketosisisreallyimportant.Youprobablyaregoingtobenefitfromhavingmoderate,non-sugarcarbsatleastsomeofthetime,andthere’sgoodevidenceforthat.Therearepeoplewhorecoverjustfineonpureketosis,however,Ithinkifyoutestthembothyoufigureoutwhichoneworksprettywell.

Someofthesupplementthingsareverydifferentifyou’redealingwithinjuriesorpostsurgicalstuff,dependsonwherethesurgeryis.AlotofthestuffthatIliketurmeric,vitaminE,fishoillikeDHAorEPAorkrilloil,theymakeyoubleed.That’sagoodthingifyou’refourdaysafterasurgeryorsixdaysafter,dependingonhowdeepandwhattheydid,butifit’srightbeforesurgeryIdon’tthinkyoursurgeon’sgoingtobethathappywhentheypokeyouandyouleakeverywhere.WhatIthinkyouwanttodothereislookatrecoveryandrestassomeofthemostimportantthingswhereyoucanmodifyyourperformance.Thosearenotlow-performancestatesatall.Performancedoesn’tmeanyou’removing,itmeansyou’redoingwhateveryou’redoingbetter.Atthatpoint,allyou’redoingisgettingunsickorrecoveringfromamajortrauma,whichissurgeryorsomethingelse.

Tony: Superstuff.We’vegotthreeorfourseatshereandtwothereifanyoneismillingaroundandwantstocomeandsitinthefront,you’reverywelcometocomedownhere.ThechapwhoisperchedonthetablethingovertherewithablackT-shirt.What’syournameandwhat’syourquestion?

Francis: Thankyou,I’mFrancis.Howmanytimeshaveyoubeenasked…

Tony: That’sFrancisaskingthetopthreethingsforhigh-performance.

Dave: I’veneverheardthatquestion.Thetopthreethingstokickthemostass.Iactuallygivedifferentanswerseachtimebecauseyou’vegottomixitupalittlebit.Thiswillbeafunnyanswer,I’veneveranswereditthisway,butthere’sthreevoicesinyourheadandthere’soneanswerforeachofthose.Thethreevoicesinyourheadaretheretokeepthespeciesaliveforever,andifyouweretodesignananimalthatwasn’tverysmart,you’djusthavetohavethesethreethings


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inthereandyouwouldhaveaspeciesthatwouldgoonuntilthemeterstrikesorsomething.

Thefirstbehaviorisrunawayfromscarythingsthatmighteatyou,andthat’sprettygood.Thesecondoneiseateverythingsoyouwon’tstarvetodeath.Thethirdthingishavesexwitheverythingpossibletomakesurethespeciesreproduces.Now,thisistheLabradorbrain,ifyou’vereadthebook,andthesearethecoreoperatingprinciplesofyourmeat.Theveryfiberofyourbeing,that’swhatyou’rewiredtodobecauseyoudon’tneedyourmonkeymindinthereatalltosurviveasaspecies.Wecanhaveallsortsofbadthingshappen,andwe’dstillprobablyhavereallystupidhumansawhilefromnowifwecouldjustdothosethingsright.

Thatmeansthatthetopthreethingsyoucanperformbetteristoowneachofthosevoicesinyourheadsothatinsteadofhavingthedogthatjumpsonyouandhumpsyourlegandslobbersonyou,youhavewhat’smoreofwasaservicedoginsideofyourheadwhereitsitsanditbehavesandyouputapieceofpopcornonitsnoseanditwon'teatthepieceofpopcornuntilyoutellittoeatthepopcorn,anditdoesn’thumpanyone’slegunlessyoutellitit’sokayandit’sgoingtobefun,andthingslikethat.Itcomesdowntounderstandingthatthosethreeurgesareactuallynotyou,thoseareyourmeat.Havingthatperspectivereallygivesyouthatabilitytosay,“Allright,that’sabehavior,itisn'taweakness.It’sactuallyabuilt-inbehaviorthatautomatic.NowthatIhaveawarenessthatit’sautomatic,IthencantakecontrolofthatbehaviorandIcantrainmynervoussystemthewayyouwouldtrainadog.”Whenyoudothat,you’llfindthatyoucanperformbetterateverysinglethingyouwanttodoandyoudon’tevenhavetodrinkcoffeetodoit.

Tony: Iknowyoumentionedheartratevariability,youdidthattoday,isthatsomethingthatcanhelpwiththat?

Dave: Yeah,fortherunawayfromscarythingsheartratevariabilitytrainingisoneofthewaystodoit.Forthefoodthing,allyouneedtodoisgetyourbloodketonelevelsupto0.5andyour…There’stwohormonesthatchange.Oneiscalledghrelin,whichisI’mhungryallthetimehormone,andtheotheroneiscalledCCK,whichisactuallybyCalvinKlein.CCKisthefullnesshormone.0.5isbelownutritionalketosis.CanBrainOctaneoil,inmostpeople,bringyourlevelsupthathighbeforeitcausesdisasterpanics?Yeah,becauseBrainOctaneactuallydoesn’tcausedisasterpanicsveryeasily.NCToildoescausedisasterpanicquiteeasily,butBrainOctanehasaverydifferenteffectandit’smuchmoreketogenic.Ifyoucangetyourketonesupjustenough,there,thedogstopstryingtoeateverythingbecauseit’slike,“I’mtoofulltoeateverything.”Itstopsrunningawayfromeverythingbecauseyou’vetrainedittosit.Allyouhavetodoisdealwiththatthirdone.That’salongerdiscussion.

Tony: Whatquestionshavewegothere?Ladyinthefrontrow.What’syournameandwhat’syourquestion?

Kate: MynameisKateandIdon’ttoleratecaffeineverywell…

Tony: ThequestionisKatedoesn’ttoleratecaffeineverywell.SheiswonderingifshecangetthesamebenefitsfromdecafasfromthenormalBulletproofcoffee.


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Dave: Iwouldhavephrasedthatas,“Kateisweak.”Justkidding.Inmostofthestudiesaboutthebenefitsofcoffee,theyarebasedonpolyphenols,decafworksjustfine.Infact,whatI’vebeendoingforaboutthelastyear,Iwasgoingtotalkaboutthisattheconference,butI'veintentionallyuppedmycoffeedose.Bulletproofcoffeehasdifferentit’scalledpharmacokinetics,whichisthedeliverysystemfortrimethylxanthinecaffeine.WhenyoumixitinwithBrainOctane,withbutter,whenyoublend,ityou’redoingallsortsofthingsthataffecthowthatisabsorbedbythebody.Itturnsoutthatifyoudothatwithjustanormalcoffeethat’scaffeinated,you’regoingtowantlesscoffeethanifyoudrinknormalcoffeewhereyoudrinkitandyoucrash,thenyoudrinkitandyoucrashallday.

Icoulddrink5cupsofregularcoffeebecauseIhadto,butIdon’treallywanttodrink5cupsofBulletproofcoffeeevenifI’mdrinkingablackbecauseit’sjusttoomuchforme.Iusuallyhavetwogoodsizecupsofcoffee.I’llhaveoneinthemorningandacoupleofshotsofespresso.Atlunch,IjustpourBrainOctaneonmyfoodifI’mgoingtohavelunch.OnadaylikethiswhereI’mtravelingalot,ImighthavetwoBulletproofcoffees,butathome,Ihavethreemoredecafcoffeesbecausethebenefitsstackupinstudiesfromdecaf.

Theproblemwiththedecafisthat,evenherewheretherearesomestandards,they’renotthattight,buttherearesomestandardsaroundoneofthe25moldsincoffeethatItestfor.They’retwiceashighfordecafcoffee,andbecausedecafcoffeeisalwaysmoldierbecausetheywouldneverusegoodcoffeetodecaffeinateitbecauseitruinstheflavor.WhenImakedecaf,weuselabtestedcoffeeandthenweuseaSwisswaterprocessandcarefullycontrolhumidity.TheSwisswaterplantisveryneartowhereIroastsowecandothishighquality,lowtoxindecaf.

Iactuallyreactreallypoorlytodecafcoffee,muchmoresothancaffeinatedcoffeewhenit’sjustrun-of-the-mill.Evenifit’sreallygoodtasting,high-endcoffeeIgetalotofanxietyfromit,physicalanxiety,fromthemycotoxinsinit.Iwouldjustsaybecarefulwiththedecafyoudrink,butyougetmorebenefitsandmorepolyphenols.

thereisemergingevidenceyouneedtwogramsofpolyphenolsaday,whichisquitealot,andIactuallycan’ttellyouoffthetopofmyheadhowmanygramsofpolyphenolsareinacupofcoffeebutit’sontheorderof100mgorsomethinglikethatprobablydependingonbrewingtechnique.

Tony: Good?Great.Right,who’vewegot?Ladytherewithherhandup.

Natalia: Hi,mynameisNataliaandIwouldliketoknowhowto…

Tony: Nataliawantstoknowhowtomaintainpositivityorandyousaidapositivecharge.

Dave: Ihadtodeterminewhetheryouaretalkingaboutelectricallygrabbingmyself,Iwanttokeepanegativechargebymyside,Idon’twanttokeepapositiveenergytogetyouthere.There’ssomethingIdowithmykidseverynight,andit’sreally,reallyimportant.WhatIdoisIsitdown,they’resixandnine,andIsay,“Tellmesomethingyoudidtodaythatwasawin.”AwinissomethingthatyouactuallyworkedonthathappensandthenIgo,“That’sawesome.Youdidit.”Thenextstepis,“Tellmesomethingthat’safail.”Afailissomethingyouworkedonthatyou


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didn’tget,andwecelebratethatevenmorebecausethatmeansthatyoulearnedsomethingbecauseyouwerepushingyourselfbecauseifallyouhaveiswins,you’renottryingveryhard.Thatcompletelyremovesthefearfailurefrommykidsbecausetheyactuallygetpraiseforfailure.Idothesamethingwithmyemployees,notquiteatthatlevel,buteveninmyowninternaldialogueit’slike,“Thisdidn’twork,won’tdothatagain.”

FromthereIgoonto,“What’syouractofkindnessfortoday?”Youfindonethingthatyoudidthatdaywhereyouwereactuallykindtosomeone.ImetsomehomelesspersoninFranceyesterday.Shewasoutat11o’clockatnightwiththebaby.Shecould’vebeenoutwithababyjustbecausesheknowsshe’llgetthemasympathy,Idon’treallycare,itstillsucked.Igaveherwhatever,Idon’trememberwhatcurrencywasinmypocket,butitwasalotmorethanshewasexpecting.Itdidn’tchangemylife,butitmight’vechangedhers.There,Igotmyactofkindness.IalsotipheavybecauseI’minaplaceinmylifewheredoesn’tmatterifIthrowinanextracoupleofwhateverthelocalcurrencyis,butitactuallymatterstothepersonservingthefood.Oryouholdthedoor,oryouputsomeone’sluggageout,itdoesn’treallymatter.Justrecognizethatyoudidsomethingkindeveryday.

thenwedothreegratefulsandthesearethreethingsthathappenedthatdaythatyouaregratefulforthatjusthappenedthatyoudidn’tplan,youdidn’tstrivefor,youdidn’ttryfor.Idon’tbelieveit’spossibletohaveanegativeattitudeonlifeifyoufocusongratitudeeverynight,andmaybeeverymorningifyou'refeelingreallycrappy.Ifthatdoesn’twork,heartratevariabilitytraining.Forme,10weeksofhavingelectrodesonmyheadduring40yearsofZenstyletraininglearningwhenI’mlyingtomyself,prettymuchanytimeit’sanegativethoughtI'mlike,“There’smyegoagain.Gopumpthatlegoverthatego,I’vegotshittodo.”Youjustrecognizewhat’syouandwhat’snotyou.Thenegativestuffthatyou’rerecognizingas,“I’mnotfeelingpositive,”that’sactuallyyourmeatoperatingsystembetrayingyou.That’smyperspective.

Tony: Awesome.Whonext?Thismanhere.

David: Davidagain.Youpushahigherfatdietandasthere’salotofdebate…

Tony: It’sDavidaskingabouthigh-fatandrecentdebateover…

David: APOE4.

Tony: Yeah,thatone.

Dave: Iwouldsaythatthescienceisn’tinonAPOE4butthere’ssomereallyinterestingdiscussions.Whenpeopletalkabouthigh-proteinorhigh-fat,itdoesn’tmeananything.Thesamethingasplant-basedandvegetable-based.Forinstance,myfavoriteanimal-basedproteinissnakevenom,soclearlyallproteinisdeadlyandyoushouldnevereatat.Myfavoritevegetableproteinissarinnervegas,whichisactuallyalectin,soyoushouldnevereatthoseeither.Whensomeonesayshigh-fatdiet,“that’sahigh-fatdietfad,”theyalmostnevertalkaboutspecificfats,andwhentalkingabouthigh-proteintheydon’ttalkaboutspecificaminoacidratiosordiandtripeptides,butthat’sactuallywherethemetalhitstheroad.


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Iwouldsayifyou’redealingwiththat,lookatyourinflammationmarkerswhicharereally,really

important.Lookattheothermarkersthatyou’repayingattentionto.Experiment,butoneofthosetypesoffatsthatgivesyouthemostketosismorethananyotherfatisBrainOctane.Thatstuffisn’tgoingtohavethesameeffectoncholesterol,infact,ithasalmostnoeffectoncholesterolinthestudiesthatI’veseen.Youcanpushonesortoffat,maybeyouwanttopusholiveoil,maybeyouwanttopushonlyDHA,butuntilsomeonelooksintothosethings,Ithinkit’sdangeroustosayyoushouldbeonahigh-fatoralow-fatdiet.Because,actually,highamountsoftherightkindoffatiswhatIrecommendforpeople,andeventhenit’saprettybigrangefrom50to85%dependingonwhatyourgoalsare.Withoutlabtestsforyou,Ithinkit’sgoingtobeaverylongtimebeforewecansay,“Thisisonegeneticmarker,”ignoringtheothermillionofthemthatareoutthere,that“everyoneshoulddothis.”Well,thisisadirectionalthingforyouwithAPOE4butwhatdothelabstheywithyourownthing.

Andspeakingofallthegeneticthings,inaboutamonthI’mdoingthisthingcalledHLIwhereI’mhavingmyentiregenomesequencedanddoingIBMBigBluekindofdataanalysisstuffonit,soI’mhopingtolearnalotmoreveryinterestingthingsyoudon’tgetfrom23andMe.Eventually,wewilldothatforeveryone.

Tony: 23andMeisthesequenceoffindingoutmuchmoreaboutyourDNAthenyou’veeverbeenabletobeforeifyou’rejustanormalperson.

Dave: It’sapartialsequencingfor99bucks,thanksforpointingthatout.Thefullhumangenomewas$100millionthatCraigVenterspenttodohisandnowIdon’tknowhowmuchitcostsbecauseIworkedadeal,butit’sstillpricey.

Tony: Hasanyonedone23andMe?Useful,justI’mwaitingfortheresults.Ittakesagestowaitfortheresults.Good.Anyoneatthebackwanttoaskaquestion?Iamawarethat…Ladyinblack.

Actia: MynameisActia.Iwantedtoknowifyoucouldcommentontheeffect…

Tony: Great.ActiaaskingaboutBulletproofcoffeespecificallyforwomenandhormonal.

Dave: ThereisagreatblogpostonthiscalledsomethinglikeBulletproofFastingandWomenandIgointoalotofdetailonthis.Myfirstbook,theBetterBabyBook,hadanenormousamountaboutfemalehormones,infertility,andthingslikethat.Thepeoplewhoaresaying,“Youshouldn’thavecoffeebecauseofhormones,”areconcernedaboutcortisolfromcoffeewhereasmanyofthestudies,infact,almosteverystudyofcoffeeandcortisolisusinginstantcoffeebecausescientistsdon’tknowthere’sadifference.InEurope,wherethereisastandard,it’smuch,muchhigherforwhattheycallsolublecoffeeorinstantcoffee.They'reactuallytestingthingstheydon’tknowthetesting,andit’susuallynotstoredveryeffectively.It’sinalab,there’shumidity,andit’snotverywell-controlledbuttheydon’tquantifywhat’sintheinstantcoffeebeforetheytestitbecause,intheirmind,coffeeiscoffee.Ifindthatthere’sadifferenceandthatthereisalikelydifferenceincortisol,dependingonwhethertherearecompoundsthatdirectlyattacktheadrenalmedulla,whichmycotoxinsthatarefoundincoffeedoactuallydo.


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Iwouldsaypurityofcoffeematters,andtimingofcoffeematters.Forwomen,Isuggestproteininthemorning,especiallyifyou’rehavingahardtimewithyourhormones,andyoumightactuallyneedtonotdrinkcoffeeoronlydrinkdecafcoffee.Ithappens.Ithappenswithguys,too.There’snothingwrongwithdoing,say,greentea,butIknowwomenwhocan’ttolerategreenteaeitherforvariousreasons.Therearealsoweirdthingsthathappenedwhenyourcortisolcanconvert…What’stheone…There’sanEasternEuropeanonewhereyourcortisolconvertstooneofthe…Totestosterone,Ithink,ifI’mrememberingwhatthispathwaywas.Itwascompletelybizarre.Itwas1in400,globally,whohaveitbut1in40EasternEuropeanwomenhaveit.Youranintothingslikethatwhereit’svery,veryindividualized.

ifyou’rehavingissueswithhormones,ahigh-fatdietisaverylikelyagoodthingtodo,BrainOctaneisverylikelyagoodthingtodo,andifyou’relikemostpeople,coffee,onecupinthemorning,maybewhenyoufirstwakeupifyouwakeuplikeazombie,oranhourortwoafteryouwakeupifyouwakeuphappyandbrightearlyinthemorninglikethosepeopleweallhate.Thetimingcouldmatter,andyoumightneedtohaveitwithfood.Therearesomepeoplewhere,eveniftheyputproteininthecoffee,it’snotenough.Yourmileagereallycanvaryandthere’snothingwrongwithsaying,“Idon’twanttodocoffee,”butIstillwouldencourageyoutoplaywithBrainOctane,andyoucanalwaysusechocolate.

Tony: Goodstuff.Right,whohavewegot?Thechapinthepinkshirt.

Henry: Hi,Dave.MynameisHenry.Whatisthemost…

Tony: Henryisaskingwhatistheoptimalamountofexerciseforsomeonetodowhojustwantstobehealthyandwantsplentyoftimetorestaswell?

Dave: TheNewYorkTimescalledme“almostmuscular,”whichisthebestquoteeverbecauseifyouwanttolivealongtime,that’showyouwanttolook.Youdon’twanttolooklikeaballoonanimal,nooffensebecauseifyouwanttogetswole,that’scool,that’sbiohackingandthat’swhereyouwanttotakeyourbody,butyour[altodine01:00:43]goupsubstantiallyifyou’recarryingtoomuchmusclemass.That’saninterestingthing.Ifyou’retoolean,that’sanotherissue.Goingdownbelow10%bodyfatformenorwomen,itmightlookhotaccordingtothecurrentstandard,butitisnotthelookofahealthyanimalthat’sgoingtoliveto180thewayI’mplanningon.Youactuallyneedtobealittlebitheavierthanthat,I’dsayprobablylike14%aslongasthefatiscomposedofgoodstuff,it’sgotadequateamountsofDHAandEPAandnotlotsofOmega-6andthingslikethat.

italsoisgoingtodependonyourownbiology.Somepeoplerespondverydifferentlytoexercise.Icanputonmuscleveryeasily,it’sinmygenes.AndyHnilo,whoisafriend,herunsAlitura,IhadhimuptothelabonVancouverIsland.He’slikehalfmyage,he’s30butyoungerthanme,andheisacovermodelforOakley,drippinginveinsandjustabsolutelyripped,butIoutperformedhimontheARXmachinedoingchestpresses.Hewaspissed,youcouldtell.It’sageneticthingthere,he’sclearlyinbettershapethanIam.Youhaveyourowngeneticdifferences.Irespondverywelltoweight-bearingexerciseslikethat.

ifyoulookatwhatyourbodydoes,lookatwhereyouwanttobefromafatperspectiveanddo,


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Iwouldsay,theminimumamountofexerciseyourequiretodothat,andthen,andhere’swhereitgetsreallyweird,movealot.Thismeansgoforawalk,IliketheBulletproofVibebecauseit’skindoflikeawalkbutinalotlesstime.Sometimesyoujustdon’thavetimeforawalk.Doyoga,dostretching,butjustdon’tcountthatasexercise.Taketheextratimeyouhaveandapplyittomovement,whichisneurologicallybeneficial.ItraisessomethingcalledBDNF,brainderivednootropicfactor,whichcausesyoutoactuallygrownewneuronsandyou’regoingtogetthemostbenefitfromthat.Youcouldprobably,ifyou’reyounger,pushyourselfharder,“I’mgoingtoworkoutfourtimesaweek,Ihaveextratimetosleep.”Youcould.Youcouldalsomeditateinhalfthattimeandprobablygetmorebenefits.

Tony: Great.Let’scomedownfromthechapinthestripyshirt.

Mike: Iwanttoaskaboutproteinfasting.Ihaven’tbeenabletofindmuchinformationotherthanwhatyou’vewrittenonit…

Tony: Mikeaskingaboutproteinfasting,howyoumanagedtofindthatmuchinformationaboutitoutandabout,andisitagoodthingifyou'retrainingalot.

Dave: Ifyou’replanningtoputonalotofmuscle,andyou'retrainingalottojustputonmass,youmightwanttoskipitforawhile.It’sreallyimportanttoallowthecellsinyourbodytocleanthemselvesout.Thereisgoodstudies,Icitedseveraloftheminthedietbook,thisisnotsomethingthatiscommonlyunderstood.Howmanyofyouherehavetriedonedayaweekproteinfasting?Nowleaveyourhandupifyounoticeadifferencefromit.Almostallofthehandsstayedup.Itiskindofamazingwhatitdoes.You’relike,“WhywouldthatmakesensethatIamthinnerrighthereafterIdidthat?Igotthesameamountofcalories,IactuallyatemorecarbsthanIdidwhichmeansI’mputtinginglycogen.Somethingishappeninghere.”Asanantiaging,high-performance,Iwanttolivealongtime,IwanttofeelgoodwhileI’mlivingalongtime,Ithinkthere’sreallyaroleforit,butifyou’rereallyworkingonaproteinbulkingphase,don’tdoitforsixweeks.Attheendofsixweeks,youmightreallywanttodothatbecauseyourcellsaregoingtobenefitfromthat.

It’sreallytoughlikefortheHollywoodpeoplewiththey'reexpectedtolookchiseledmusclewithnofat,butthey’realsosupposedtolookgoodwhenthey’re60.Thosetwothingsactuallyareoppositeendsoftheteeter-totter.Becarefulwhereyou’regoingbecauseyou’relookingforsomethingnow,butyouwanttolookatthelong-termeffectsonthatdependingonwhatyourgoalsare.

Tony: TimFerriswroteabouttheFour-HourBody,whichisobviouslysuchafamousbookinthedietspace,andhetalkedaboutacheatdate,didn’the,wherehewouldjustgooutandeatabsolutelyanything.IsitfairtosaythatevenTimFerrishimselfmightofferslightlydifferentadvicenow?

Dave: Timcanspeakforhimself.HeisputtingBrainOctaneoilinhisteaandcoffeewhenhewasonthepodcasthewastalkingabouthe’sputtingbetterinhiscoffeeandhe’sdoingmorecyclicalketogenicstuff,whichhe’swrittenabout.Thatwasoneofthedietshetalkedabout,itwasoneofthemoreextremedietsinhisbook,theFour-HourBody.I'veemailedhimprettyregularly,


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andIhavegreatrespectforhim.IalsothinkhejusthadLymedisease,whichhewasprettypublicabout,andthatalsocanaffectyourmitochondrialfunction,anditaffectsyourbody’sdesireforfatandtheamountofneurotoxinsthatarestillcirculating.Iimaginethathewillmodulateandchangehisprogramovertimeforhim.

Iknowlotsofpeoplewhoreallybenefitonthelow-carbdiet.There’snothingwrongwithitifitworksforyou,andthat’sthebiggestthingaboutbiohacking.WhenIsawthatIwaslike,“Beans?whywouldyouchoosebeansforcoredensity?that’swhywhitericeistherebecausewhitericehaslesscrapinit.”TheBulletproofperspectiveisavoidthethingsthatcostyouanddon’tprovideanybenefit,andthat’swhyonacheatday…Iusedtodocheatdaysbackin1997,‘98whenIwasreallytryingtoloseweight.Iwaslike,“I’lldothisAtkinsthing.”Theproblemwithcheatdaysistheycausecravingsforfourdaysafterwards.Idon’twanttodealwithcravings.Ihavestufftodo,cravingstakeenergyawayfromyouandIhavenodesiretoeverfeelacravingagain,andifIdoit’smyfault.IdidsomethingtocausethecravingeitherIknowwhatitisordidn’t.Icantellyou,ifIwentoutanddidacheatdaylikethat,myperformanceisgoingtosufferandI’mgonnahavelotsofcravings.Ithinkthat’strueformostpeopleunlessthey’reyoung,exercisingallthetime,gettinglotsofsleep,andsuperhealthy.Whentheyhit30,andwhentheyhit40,thecheatdaysbecomemoreandmoreexpensive,andtherecoveryfromthecheatdayisanexpensivething.

Irecommendsomethingkindofsimilar.Youhaveahighketosisbutyoudon’tintentionallyingestmargarine,gluten,andallsortsofotherMSG,whateverfakecoloredcandysprinklesinyouricecreamthosethingsactuallyhavenobenefit,there’snoreasontoputthisinyourbody.Theopposingargumentthereis,“Yeah,butpeoplelikethis,sonothavingtobestrictthismakesiteasiersopeoplewillhavemorewillpower.”Mywillpowerequationisit’salimitedthing,andcravingssucklepowermorethananythingelsesoIwilldoeverythinginmylifetoeliminatecraving.

IwouldsayreadTim’sbook,it’sareallygoodbook.I’vereaditandthere’sallkindsofgoodinformationinthereespeciallybodybuilding,puttingonweight,high-intensitykettlebells,youwanttoswimalot,totalimmersion.There’sallkindsofgoodstuffinthere,it’sjustdifferentapproachesandhedoeswriteaboutcyclicalketosis,whichisthebasis.It’slikealowtoxincyclicalketogenicdietiswhattheBulletproofdietis.

Tony: Good.Whohavegot?

Abby: Hi.MynameisAbby.Ihave…

Tony: Okay.AbbyhasbeenontheBulletproofDietforayearandfindsattimesyouplateaualittlebit.WhatwouldDaverecommendforpushingthroughtheplateau?

Dave: IfyouareplateauingoneofthethingsthatIdidn’twriteaboutinthebookthat’sreallyhelpful,isanactualrealfastwhere…

Tony: Pleasedon’tholdthespeakerlikethat.


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Dave: No,itwasn’tthat.Itwasstartingtodothereverbthingwhereitwasresonatingwithpower,andwasgoingtobebad.

Afullfastof24or36hours.Youtakeiteasy,youwanttodoitonaSaturdaywhenyou’renotworkingandthingslikethat,thatcansometimesbereallyamazing.It’shardatfirstifyou’veneverdoneit,butthatcanhelp.Ifyou’reinrecoveryfromsomethingoryou'resupertiredandgettingoverbeingsick,don’tdoit.Forwomen,itmatterswhereyouareinyourcyclewhenyoudothat.Youdon’twanttobesuperbloated,andswollen,andcrankybecausethat’snotagoodtimetofast.

Tony: Greatwhoelse?Hello,what’syourname?

Monica: Hi.MynameisMonica.I’vewatchedyourdocumentaryMoldy.Doyouhaveanytips…

Tony: MonicahaswatchedthedocumentsMoldyandislookingfortipsonhowshecanclearherhouseofmoldherselfwithoutcallinginthepros.

Dave: Ifyoucanfigureouthowtoremovemoldfromyourhousewithoutcallingtheprosyouwillbeaveryverywealthyperson.Itisdifficult.Youcanbuycommercialgradeozonegeneratorsthatcanbreakdownsomeofthetoxins,butyouneedtoknowwhat’sinyourhouseandyouneedtodoabeforeandaftertest.IuseHomebiotic,thenaturalbacteriathatcomesfromsoilthatcompeteswithmold,andIspreadthataroundmyhouseasmoreofapreventativething.Ijusthadabigleak,uponVancouverIslandmyicebathoverflowed.Happenstoallofus,right?Itwentunderthefloor,itwasreallybad.Ipulledoutsomeofthefloortiles,putinbigfansandmistedagallonofHomebiotic,whichiswaymorethananysanepersonneededtouse.Idrieditout,though,veryquicklysoIdidn’tgetanymold.IfIdidhavemold,Iwouldwanttophysicallyremovethemold.WhatIwoulddoisyoubringincontractors,youscrapeit,andyoudon’twanttobetheonedoingthatifyouhavingsymptoms.

WhenwefilmedMoldy,thedocumentary,thewholecameracrewandIputonthesespacesuits,tiebackeverything,ducttapeforwrists,respirators,andgoggles,andKennyhoods,andallthatkindofstuff.Eventhecameracrewwhoweren’tparticularlysensitivewerecompletelyzombified.Theywerelike,“Wedidn’tbelieveyouuntiltoday.”

Wewentintothisreallybadlywaterdamagedhouse,andyouseethefootagewhereI’mpullingoffperfectlynormallookingdrywallandonthebackofitisblackslime.Youcan’tseeit,istheproblem,butyoucanmeasureitintheair.Thefirstthingtodoisactuallydeterminedthatitreallyisaproblembymeasuringtheairandworkwithaninspectortotellyouhowbigofaproblemyouhave.Ifit’sasmallthingyoumightbeabletodoit,butit’shardtodo.

Iwouldlookatthingslikeozoneandnaturalculturestoapproachit.Idon’tthinkyou’relikelytogetallthewaywell.Oneoftheguysinthedocumentary,hishousehadbeenhitbyoneofthehurricanes.Hewasinthemedicalprofession,andhehadn’ttakenoutthedrywallinhisbasement.Hewaslike,“Wehadthehouseremediated,”andI’mlike,“I’mnotwalkingintothathouse,sorry.Iwillfeellikeabsolutecrap,”butmyproducer,Kiki,shedidn’tknowshewasmoldsensitivewhenwestartedfilmingthemovie,Iwaskindofguessingthat.Shewalkedintothe


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basementtolookatit,andshecameoutandshehadafull-blownpanicattack.Asincurledintoaballlike,“Idon’tknowwhat’shappeningbutIfeellikeI'mdying,”and,literally,Ijustholdherwhileshetwitched.That’snotanuncommonresponsewhensomeonewho’sbeenexposedbeforegoesintoamoldybuildingbecauseyourbiologyislike,“OhmyGod,there’ssomethinginherethat’sgoingtokillme.Idon’tknowwhatitis,”butyoufeelit.Thatguywasnotwell.Hewasnotwellbecausehedidn’tremediateitright.Thisisoneofthosethingswhereoftentimesthebestwaytoremediatesomethingisarson.

Tony: We’vegottimeforacoupleofmorequestions.ChapintheblackT-shirt,andthenwillcometotheguyinthefrontwitharedshirt.

Tim: HiDave.MynameisTimandIwantedtoaskwhatisyouropiniononhacking…

Tony: Timwantstoknowabouthackingyourgutbacteria.

Dave: Ihavespentprobably$100,000ongutbacteria.Itookpigwhipwormeggsabout10yearsago,whichisoneofthemoreaggressivewaysofhackingthebacteria.InfacttwoweeksagoItooksomerattapewormlarva.I’vebeendoingthoseforthepastsixweeksorso.IjustdidapodcastwithDr.SidBakeraboutthat,they'redelicious,alittlecrunchy.Justkidding.They'reinvisible,justtasteslikesaltwater.

Therearethingsyoucando,thevastmajorityofthemdon’tstickistheproblem.You’llgetsomebenefitsfromsaccharomycesboulardii,whichisakindofyeastthateatscandidaasafuelsource,thatworksformostpeople.Someofthesoil-basedorganismscanwork,PrimalDefense,cryptococcus,therearesomespeciesofclostridiathatactuallyfightclostridiumdifficile,thatcanmakeadifference.Theproblemisthatsomuchofthetime,especiallywhenyouhaveanovergrowthinpartsofthegutcalledSIBO,you’rejustnotgoingtogetwhatyouwant.Mostofthethingsthatarecommonlyrecommendedlike,“Oh,eatyogurt,”lactobacillicanactuallycauseahistamineresponse.Iwroteablogpost,ifyou’reinterestedinthegutyouhavetoreadit,it’scalledWhyYogurtMakesYouFatandFoggy.I'mlike,“Here’sthespeciesinyogurt,here’sthestudiesthatshowwhatthosespeciesdo.”

Theproblemisyouhavenotalotofknowledgeofwhat’sinyourgut,andyouhave,within24hoursoftakingatestofwhat’sinyourgut,itwillshiftdependingonwhatyoueat.Ifyoudon’thaveanovergrowthinyoursmallintestine,youwouldwanttoeatmoreprebiotic’s.Ifyoudohaveanovergrowth,youdon’teatzerofermentablecarbohydrateswhatsoever,andmaybeeventakeanantibioticthat’snotmetabolizedtokillthingsandthenrebuildthem.It’sverycustomized,buttheonethingthatIdoknowisveryimportantisthatthefamily,youcan’tsupplementthosebuttheygrowwhenyoufeedthempolyphenols.It’soneofthereasonsthatbrightlycoloredvegetables,anddarkleafygreens,andblueberries…Whataretheothertwobigpolyphenolsources?

Tony: Chocolateandcoffee.

Dave: Thosefeedasprobiotics,thosekindsofbacteria.Solublefiberisimportant.Turnsoutcoffeehasaboutagram,youwanttohave2gofsolublefiberinanormalsizedcupofcoffeeandthat’s


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actuallyameaningfulamountofit,especiallywhenitcomesdozedwithpolyphenols.Peopledon’tgenerallyrecognizethat.Whenyoucombineitwithfat,likebutterandBrainOctane,thosearesuppressiveofbacteriainthegut,butiftheysuppresseverythingandthenyoufeedityou’llshifttheratio.I’veseenafewresultsandthingslikethatthatshowthateffecthappening,butnotenoughthatIcanguaranteeit.ThesearemousestudiesresultsthatI’mtalkingabout.SomeoneactuallytestedbutterandcoffeeinmiceinChina.Cool.

Luca: Dave,youtalkabouttechnologyhacks,Ithinkyousaid40YearsofZenisprobably…

Tony: Lucaaskingabouttechnologyhacks.Whatarethebestones,apartfrom40YearsofZen,andwhat’scomingupinthefuture?whatcanweexpect?Technologyandhealthinnovationismovingsofast,isn'tit?

Dave: It’samazing.Bothinnovationishappening,andourabilitytochangeourenvironmentisremarkable.Inabout‘96IwasfollowingallofthesecrazybrainhackinggroupsonYahooGroups,iftheyevenstillexist,Idon’tknow.ThisguyfiguredoutthatifyoushineininfraredLED,thisisoneofthefirstinfraredLEDsevermade,it’llgointothebrainandit’llturnonmitochondriainaverymeaningfulway.Iboughtthisdevice,itwashandmadeinapillbottle,andhewaslike,“Don’tuseitformorethantwominutesbecauseyoumightcookyourbrain.”Hehadhadsuchprofoundeffectsthatoverthesixmonthswhenhewasmarketingthisasahomebrewthing,heactuallyturnedhisbrainontothingslike,“I’mdone.I’mgoingtomedschoolnow.”Completelychangedhislife.

Foryearsthiswasoneofmymostpreciousbiohackingtoolsbecauseitmademybrainturnedbackon.Letmejusttellyoureallyquick,thisisafrickinginfraredLEDfor20cents.Iputitoverthelanguageprocessingpartofmybrainbecause,unlikeTimFerrisandspeakslike15,000languagesandlearnstheminfiveminutes,Iactuallydon’tprocesssoundthewaymostpeopledo.Thisisprobablysomethingthat’sfromjustthewaymybrainformedinthewomb,somethingwiththebrainstem.IprocesssoundsonelevelupinmybraincomparedtomostofyousoyoufiltersoundsoutbetterthanIdo,ittakesyoulesseffortthanitdoesforme.WhenmywifespeaksSwedishorFrench,Ihear,“blahblahblah,”andItryandpronouncethewordsbackandIdon’tsaythesamewordstheysaytome.Igenuinelydon’thearitsoit’sreallyhard.I’mlike,“Allright,I’mgoingtohackthat,”soIputthethinghereandshineitfortwominutes.Forthenextsixhours,Ispokeingarblish.Icouldn’tputmywordstogether.Itriedtospeakandotherstrangesoundswouldcomeoutofmymouth.It’sa20centpieceoftechnology,maybetwobuckswithaheatsinkandapowersupply.That’sinteresting.

there’sawholenewwaveoflightbasedtechnologiescomingout.There’sstuffaroundultravioletB,whichhasbeenfilteredoutoflikethesewindowsfilteroutUVB.Infact,noneofusreceiveultravioletB,butifyoulistentomypodcastwithStephanieSeneff,weneedultravioletBtoactivatevitaminDtogetvitaminDsulfate,andUVBhasadirecteffectonourmitochondria,it’spartofourhormonesignalingsystem.Infraredlightisalsoimportantforthat.You’regoingtoseehugeinnovationsinspecificfrequenciesoflightandwhattheydotothebody.Infact,whenIintroducethenewstuff,I'vegotsomenewthingscomingoutaroundthatthatarereallycool,butthere’sawaveofinnovationthatnoone’severevenimaginedbecausewecouldn’tdoitevenfiveyearsago.It’sallLEDandlaser-based.


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Tony: Iusedoneofthosedevicesthatshineslightintoyourearstogetoverjetlag.Haveyouusethat?

Dave: Thehumancharger?

Tony: Thehumancharger.Notreally.IstayedupslightlylaterbutIstillwokeupearlythenext

morning.

Dave: It’sacoolidea.Thereisanervethere,andthenervesarelight-sensitive.I’veusedalaseronanerveintheearandonthetrigeminalnervethatseemedtowork,butIknowpeoplewholovethehumancharger.

theonethatIfoundwasmoreeffectiveformeforjustactivatingthebrainwasactuallyanasallight.Thehumanchargerwasdorkyenoughonanairplane,trystickingaflashlightupyournose.Actually,they'redesignedforit,theyhavealittlecliphere,andthere’sinfraredandRubyone,andthoseshinejustonthebaseofthebraingoingupthroughtheverythinpartoftheskullbackthere,soIthinktherearewaystogetlightintothebrainandthatcouldbeagoodwaytodoit.There’sdebateinthecommunity.Wheneveryouinnovate,there’salwaysgoingtobetheseprofessionalskepticsandhaterswhomakeupabunchofcrap,andsometimesthey'reright,butiftheirgutresponseisimmediateskepticism,they'rejustlikefundamentalistpeople.They'renotgoingtothink,they’rethepeoplewhoalwayssayno,andItendtorespondtothemthewayIrespondtomytwo-year-old,whoalsoalwayshasno,you’relike,“Goodforyou,”andthenyougoaboutyourbusiness.

Tony: Wehavetimeforonemorequestion.Who’sgotareallygoodquestion?Nopressure.Youseemconfident.

Christian: It’sagoodscienceykindof…

Tony: Science.Wemighthaveoneafterward.

Christian: Myname’sChristianandIwaswonderingtogetbacktotheAPOE4issue….

Tony: ThisisareallygoodquestionfromChristian,bytheway,guys.It’sgoingin-depthwithfatagaincomingbacktothatandhowwedealwithitandprocessit.

Dave: There’sasuppositionthatifyouhaveAPOE4andyouhaveanykindofsaturatedfat,theLDLparticleswillgoout.Thatisnotatruestatement.SaturatedfatincludesC8andC10oilswhichare,technically,saturatedbutdonotbehavelikesaturatedfatsunliketheotherMCToilsthataresaturatedanddobehavelikelongchainfats.That’soneofthereasonsIrecommendthestuffthatIdoversusMCTwhichincludessomethingsthatbehavelikelongchainfats.WhatIthinkyoumeanisifyoueatalongchainsaturatedfat,theLDLparticlecountwillgoup.Ifthosegoup,butyourHDLalsogoesup,yourtriglyceridesdrop,yourhomocysteinedrops,yourLPPLAdrops,andyourC-Reactiveproteindrops,doesthatnotplayintotheoverallriskyequationthatwegetfromlookingatLDL-C?itdoesbecauseiftheLDL-Cisdamagingarteries,bydefinition,you’llhaveanenzyme,Lp-PLA2,istheenzymethatwillbeexpressedfromthedamagingofyour


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arteries.

Ifyou’reworriedaboutthat,andIknowsomepeoplewhoareveryfocusedonthat,lookforLp-PLA2.Ifyouhavedamage,youhavedamage.IfyouhavehighLDLandyoudon’thavedamage…DidyouknowhighLDLmakesiteasiertoputonmuscles?Itmakesyoumoreresilienttocertainkindsofpoisoning,thereareactuallybenefitstoLDL.It’snotabadthingaslongasthereisaninflammationanddamage,soshowmetheevidence.IfyouhavetheAPOE4,youhavehighLDL,showmethatit’scausingdamagethenyouneedtochange.

Tony: Goodstuff.Thankyou,Christian.Onemore.Whohavewegot?Hello.

Jenny: Ihaveanine-month-oldbaby…

Tony: Jenny.Justtorepeatthequestionforeverybodylisteningandeveryonehere,you’vegottwokidsundertheageofthreeandyou’rewonderingwhattofeedthemforbreakfastandwhatthelevelsofproteinandfatandcarbsandeverythingelseshouldbe.

Dave: Kidsbenefitfromafewmorecarbsthanadults.Idon’tgivemykidscarbs,Idon’tgivethemanycarbsinthemorningespeciallyfruitbecauseitturnsthemintowhiny,crankypants.Theygetproteinandfatinthemorning,andcucumberiftheywantsomeveggies.Atlunch,theymayormaynothaveBulletproofstylecarbs,notsugarythings.Thanatdinner,thereisusuallycarbs.Timingseemstomatter,andthisreallyaffectstheirbehavior.TheyeachtogetanespressocupfullofBulletproofcoffeemadewithlotsofBrainOctaneandsomecollagen,andthatreallyhelpsthemstaycalmandfocusedbecausetheirlittlemeatoperatingsystemswhichsay,“Eateverything,especiallyifit’ssugar,”theyshutthehellupandthenthekidscanfocusonbeingkidsandplayingandnothittingeachotherandthingslikethat.That’sabigbenefit.

forvariety,avocadoscanbereallygood,andthere’satonofthingsyoucandowithvegetablesandyoureallywanttoworkvegetablesin.Ifit’sfats,goodbuttheprototypemealfortheBulletproofDietiscoveraplateandvegetables,addamoderateamountofhigh-qualityproteinfromanimals,andthencoveritinfat.Ifyouskiptheveggies,itdoesn’tworkaswell.Ifyourkids…Themagicissteamtheveggies,takeathirdoftheveggies,tossthemintheblender,butter,BrainOctane,collagenifyouwant,alittlebitofvinegarandsomespices,whateveryouwantwanttoteachthemtolikelaterinlife,andsomesalt.Blendthecrapoutofituntilit’screamyandreallygood,andthenspoonitbackovertheveggies.Evenkidswhodon’teatvegetablesthatcometovisitourhouse,theytakeonebiteofthatandthey’relike,“Givememore.”Thatbecomesoneoftheprimarythingsontheirplate,andthenyoucanaddinwhatevertheproteinis.You’llfindthatkidsthriveonthatbecausetheygetwaymorefatinthatway,anditgetsthemtogettheirveggiesineveryday.

Jenny: Youwoulddothatforbreakfasttoo,then?

Dave: Absolutely.Especiallyifyou’rerunningoutavariety.

Jenny: Youwouldn’tfeedporridge?WhatI'vedonesometimeswhenIhavethat


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Dave: Ifyou’redoingporridge,Iwoulddefinitelyincludefat.Kidsdon’tdotoowellonstraightcarbs.I’mafanofthericeporridgeisversustheoatmealones.Therearelotsofproblemswithoatmeal,butifitreallyworksforyouandforyourkids,oatmealisfinejustgetorganic.It’sreallyimportant,especiallyit’snotgrownhere.Americanoatsareterrible.

Jenny: IdeallyIshouldmoveawayfromthat?

Dave: Yeah.Bytheway,mykidseatmochi,whitepuffedrice,youbakeit.It’sinterestingifyoumadeporridgeorrice,andyourefrigerateit,itformsalotofresistantstarch.It’soneofthereasonssushiisgood,yougetalotofresistantstarchincookedandcooledrice.Thesamealsowithporridge,ifyoucookandcoolit,ittotallychangestheamountofbeneficialprobioticstarchinthere,prebioticstarch,sothat’saneattrick.

Tony: Awesome.Dave,thishasbeenfantasticthankyousomuch.It’sbeenbrilliant.Thankyouallforcoming.Thepodcastwillbepublishedthisweekend.GiveitupforDaveAsprey.Thankyouverymuch.

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