verification of identity and counselling

8/14/2019 Verification of Identity and Counselling

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IIT JEE

VERIFICATION OF IDENTITY AND COUNSELLING

Qualified candidates will be informed by post of their All India Ranks (AIR), and

will be called for identity verification in the order of their AIR. A candidate can

also obtain this information on the website, IVRS, or by calling the JEE office fromwhere he/she received the admit card, on or after May 26, 2009. Individual zones

(IITs) will fix their counselling schedule. They will display the counselling scheduleon their websites and also inform the qualified candidates by speed

post/registered post. In case a qualified candidate does not receive thecounselling letter, he/she must still appear for identity verification on any one of

the dates specified in the counselling schedule, at the institute from where he/she had

received the admit card.

The main purpose of asking the qualified candidates to appear in person for the

counselling is to verify their identity. Hence the candidates must bring theiradmit cards, and various documents for verifying their identity, age, category

and mark sheet of qualifying examination, all in original with two photocopiesof each. On failing to establish the authenticity of any of the above documents,

the candidate will not be considered for admission. The candidate must also bringa physical fitness certificate from a Registered Medical Practitioner in a format that

will be made available to him/her at an appropriate time.

After checking their identity and documents, the candidates will be asked to

submit their choice sheets of courses and institutes. The counselling brochure willhelp the candidates to exercise this option judiciously. Some IIT faculty may also

be available for consultation. However, the faculty at any one IIT may not have

information about all the courses offered by all the institutes, and can onlyprovide whatever information is available with them.

After the qualified candidates have exercised their choices as per the counselling

schedule, seat allocation will be done centrally, at a later date on the basis of theAIR-cum-choices exercised by the candidates. There is no provision for instant

seat allocation at the time when the candidates submit their choice-sheets.However, the course closures will be announced, starting from the first day of

counselling of GE category candidates.

To take care of possible absentees, the number of qualified candidates is kept

more than the number of seats available in the IITs, IT-BHU, Varanasi, and ISMU,Dhanbad. The fact that an applicant has qualified in JEE-2009 and has been called

for identity verification and counselling, does not guarantee his/her admission.This will depend upon the applicant's All India Rank, his/her choice of

courses/institutesand the number of seats available.

A counselling brochure detailing various branches of study will be mailedalong with the counselling letter, and will also be made available on the

website.

Counselling dates for candidates of different categories, including those whoqualify for Preparatory Course are provided in the counselling schedule.
http://www.jee.iitb.ac.in/imp_dates.htmhttp://www.jee.iitb.ac.in/imp_dates.htmhttp://www.jee.iitb.ac.in/imp_dates.htmhttp://www.jee.iitb.ac.in/imp_dates.htm


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http://www.jee.iitb.ac.in/imp_dates.htm

EXTENDED MERIT LIST (EML)

Apart from the various Merit Lists [i.e., the Common Merit List (CML), the

category (SC, ST, OBC) and sub-category (PD) merit Lists, and Preparatory (for

SC, ST, and PD) Merit Lists], JEE also prepares Extended Merit Lists (EML) under

different categories, by making some relaxation in the aggregate cut-off. For JEE-

2009, the lengths of the Extended Merit Lists are six times the lengths of the

corresponding JEE Merit Lists.

The Candidates appearing in the EML are not eligible for admission into

IITs, IT-BHU, and ISMU, and will not be called for counselling of JEE-

2009.

The EML is provided to other institutions (see the Table below) for the purpose of

admission in these institutions.These Institutions have about two thousand seats

in total for various courses offered by them.

Candidates declared qualified in the EML, who are desirous of admission

to these institutions, must apply to these institutions directly for

admission. For all other details regarding the courses, application

procedure, fees, etc., the candidates are advised to contact /visit the

respective institutions/websites.

The list of institutions that will be using the EML of JEE-2009 is given below. The

list may be updated time to time.

S.

No.

Name of Institute Website Address

1. Indian Institute ofSpace Science and

Technology

http://www.iist.ac.in Indian Institute ofSpace Science and

TechnologyThiruvananthapuram

- 695 022

2. Indian Institute of

Science Educationand Research

(a) Mohali http://www.iisermohali.ac.in/ IISER MohaliMGSIPA Complex

Sector-26CHANDIGARH-
http://www.jee.iitb.ac.in/imp_dates.htmhttp://www.iist.ac.in/http://www.iisermohali.ac.in/http://www.jee.iitb.ac.in/imp_dates.htmhttp://www.iist.ac.in/http://www.iisermohali.ac.in/


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160019

(b) Pune http://www.iiserpune.ac.in/ IISER Pune

900 NCL InnovationPark

Dr. Homi Bhabha

RoadPUNE-411008

(c) Kolkata http://www.iiserkol.ac.in/ IISER Kolkata

HC-VII, Sector-IIISalt Lake

KOLKATA-700106

(d) Bhopal

http://www.iiserbhopal.ac.in/

IISER Bhopal

ITI (Gas Rahat)Building, Govindpura

Bhopal - 462 023

(e) Thiruvananthapuram http://www.iisertvm.ac.in/ IISER

Thiruvananthapuram

CET CampusThiruvananthapuram- 695016

3. Rajiv GandhiInstitute of

PetroleumTechnology Society

(RGIPT)

http://www.rgipt.in/ Rajiv GandhiInstitute of

PetroleumTechnology,

Ratapur Chowk, RaeBareli-229001 (U.P.)

NOIDA OFFICEADDRESS

C/o BPCL Office, A-5& 6, Sector-1,Noida201301, U.P.

4. Indian Institute of

Maritime Studies

(Merchant Navi)

http://iims.dgshipping.com/

Indian Institute of

Maritime Studies

C/o Lal BahadurShastri College of

Advanced MaritimeStudies and Research

Hay Bunder RoadMUMBAI-400033
http://www.iiserpune.ac.in/http://www.iiserkol.ac.in/http://www.iiserbhopal.ac.in/http://www.iisertvm.ac.in/http://rgipt.in/http://iims.dgshipping.com/http://www.iiserpune.ac.in/http://www.iiserkol.ac.in/http://www.iiserbhopal.ac.in/http://www.iisertvm.ac.in/http://rgipt.in/http://iims.dgshipping.com/


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What to do after getting through JEE

Here I attempt to answer a few frequently asked questions by people who have passed

JEE. Please note that these are purely my personal views, and based on my discussionswith several of my friends and colleagues, I can confidently say that these are not even

unofficial views of IITK.

Official view of JEE, to put it simply, is that all IITs are equal, all programs are equal,

and all students are equal. That is quite absurd in my opinion, but the guys who manageadmissions, have to project an image of being unbiased.

So what do you do. First, you got to delve deep into your heart, and see if you have any

innate preference for any program. (And by the way, in my humble opinion, you should

follow your heart and not your mind in these matters.)

But if you are an average JEE qualifier who has spent the last two years in a coaching

center in Kota, Delhi, Hyderabad, or Kanpur, and who didn't have time to develop andexplore one's own interests, the result of this exercise is likely to be one of the twopossibilities:

I don't know enough about any program. (You are being honest.)

Well, if you want to follow the official words of wisdom, do the following. Since

all programs and all IITs are equal, and you do not have any specific interest, the

best way to choose is to draw lots. Write down codes for each program on aseparate piece of paper. Put all such small pieces in a box. Take one slip out at a

time, and write down the code in that slip on your preference sheet.

I love computers. My first toy as a baby was a computer. I am great at playing

computer games, and this would make me a perfect computer scientist.

Well, as I said, follow your heart. Fill up all CS and IT related programs as yourfirst few options. If you get Computer Science, spend the next 4 to 5 years

competing with other folks who too got a computer as their first toy. And when

you manage to stay afloat and get a degree, you will find it easier to quietly dumpcomputer science as a career, and move on to management, finance, and other

such careers. Anything, but computers.

For good or for bad, JEE qualifiers do not trust our official wisdom. They do not want todecide their careers by a draw of lots. So they ask us all sorts of questions. In most cases,they know the answers, and we don't. But we pretend to provide answers, and they

pretend to listen to those answers (which is good, one should respect one's potential

teachers).

So here are some Frequently Asked Questions and their unofficial answers. (Andanother disclaimer: I know more about IIT Kanpur than any other IIT. I did my BTech in


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CSE from here, and now I am teaching here for more than a decade. I love this place.

Also, I have been on faculty of IIT Bombay for a semester. So don't expect me to be fair

and impartial.)

1. Should I be selecting an IIT or a Program.

2. I have decided the Program. Which IIT should I chose.3. I have decided the IIT. Which Program should I chose.

4. Should I prefer a Dual-degree program or a BTech program.

5. If Dual-degree programs are so good, why is it that many people are not opting for it.

6. Which IIT has the most liberal branch change rules.

7. Which IIT is best for MBA entrance preparation.

8. How are programs on Mathematics and Computing.

9. How are programs on Engineering Physics.

10. For Bio-related courses, is it necessary to have done Biology in the 12th class.

11. I am interested in Electronics. IIT Kanpur offers only a program in Electrical but not in Electronics. Why.

12. I have got a 500+ rank in JEE. I want to study Computing in one of the original five IITs. Should I go forprograms on Maths and Computing.

13. I have got a 1000+ rank in JEE. Should I study Computer Science in BHU or opt for some discipline inan IIT.

14. I have got a 1500+ rank in JEE, and can get my preferred discipline in IIT Roorkee. Is IIT Roorkee asgood as original five IITs.

15. I have got a 2000+ rank in JEE, and can get my preferred discipline in IIT Guwahati. Is it safe to studyin Guwahati?

16. I have got a 2500+ rank in JEE. Can I get admission in one of the six new IITs. Are they going to be asgood.

17. I have got a 3000+ rank in JEE. Should I go for an MSc program in an IIT or a BTech program inanother institution.

18. I have got a 3500+ rank in JEE. I can get my preferred discipline in IT-BHU. I heard that it will becomean IIT soon. Will I get a degree from IIT Varanasi, if I join IT BHU.

19. I have got a 4000+ rank in JEE in my first attempt. Should I go for a second chance next year.

20. I have got a 4500+ rank in JEE. Should I study abroad. I have an offer from NTU, Singapore.

21. I have got a 5000+ rank in JEE. What discipline should I chose in ISM Dhanbad.

22. I have got a 5500+ rank in JEE. But I have a much better rank in AIEEE. Can you suggest a few goodcolleges.

23. I have got a 6000+ rank in JEE. Should I go for JEE Counseling. Can I get admission to any institute.Will I get my money back if I am not offered admission.

24. I have got a 6500+ rank in JEE. Why do IITs declare so many candidates as successful when the totalnumber of seats available is less.

25. I have got a 7000+ rank in JEE. What are the colleges that admit students based on JEE rank, but arenot part of JEE Counseling.

26. I am convinced about IIT Guwahati. But my parents are not agreeing to let me go so far. What do I do.

27. If I want to get additional information about a specific program, whom do I contact.

28. Can we contact you for more information

1. Should I be selecting an IIT or a Program.

Depends mostly on whether your inner voice has an opinion on this. If you arepassionate about a particular career (because, for example, your role model in

family or neighbourhood is in that career), then give the program a higher
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preference over an IIT. If you are not passionate about any program, then perhaps

selecting an IIT is alright.

Most programs in most IITs are good. I am already deviating from the officialline. But frankly, I don't see how a four year undergraduate program in one IIT be

run as effectively by a core faculty of five as is run in another IIT by a corefaculty of ten or more. A much larger faculty does not mean a much better

program, but a faculty size in single digits should ring an alarm bell.

So your first home work after qualifying JEE. Go to the website of each IIT. Visit

the websites of the departments that you are considering, and find the faculty

strength. If it is less than 10 for a program, then try to get more information. (Like

it may be a new program, and faculty is being hired now.) If in doubt, drop thepriority of this particular IIT-program pair. If a program has been around for at

least a couple of years, and the faculty strength is still in single digits, I wouldn't

go anywhere near that program, how so ever good it may appear in theory.

2. I have decided the Program. Which IIT should I chose.

I would chose IIT Bombay, and here is my reason for it. IIT Bombay had

introduced a very flexible system last year (2007). They have made it easier to get

a BTech, so if you decide sometime during your stay there that you will be goingfor an MBA or a non-technical career, you can take it a bit easy and get a BTech

degree, instead of a BTech (Hons.) degree. They allow you to have a minor in

another discipline too, along with your BTech in one discipline. I consider such a

flexibility as extremely important, since during the next 4-5 years, your interestswill change, and you will have better information to take decisions on your career.

But this need not be the only reason to chose an IIT. In fact, choosing an IIT for

non-academic reasons is perfectly fine. For example, some of you may select anIIT because it is closer to home (and you want to be able to meet family every

weekend). Some of you may select an IIT because you want to go far off from

your home so that your parents can't visit you frequently, and certainly not

without a warning. Both are valid ways of selecting an IIT.

Also, there is a trade-off between living in a metro (and enjoying whatever metros

offer) and being exposed to a very cosmopolitan environment. Metro IITs

(Bombay, Delhi, Madras) are slowly becoming regional IITs. There are so many

selections from their respective zones that most persons studying there wouldcome from their own respective zones. But non-metro IITs have fewer selections

in their resepctive zones, hence they attract students from all over the country. As

a result you find more cosmopolitan environment in IITs in smaller cities, andmore regional environment in IITs in bigger cities. This may be a reason to chose

IIT Kanpur over other IITs.


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IIT Kharagpur has an exciting dual-degree program, where you get a BTech and

an MBA in five years. Of course, the selection for MBA is not now. Right now,

you just choose BTech program, and if you perform well in their aptitude test,group discussion and personal interview, you might be given admission to this

dual-degree program at the end of 1st year. If you are thinking of doing an MBA

anyway, and you are confident of doing well in their admission process, thisprogram may be a reason to prefer Kharagpur over other IITs.

3. I have decided the IIT. Which Program should I chose.

A more direct question that I get asked every year is what are the job prospects of

various programs. And it is a sad question to answer, because it reflects complete

lack of self-confidence even amongst people who have qualified in one of thetoughest exams in the world. If they won't have jobs, then who else will.

If you look at those students who are in the top 75 percent of their class, there is

no problems at all in terms of finding a good job. Most graduates in the lowest 25percent will also find jobs, but there could be cases, where one does not get a job

in one's dream company, or does not get a salary in 7 digits, or one could not

manage a job through the campus placement, but had to apply on one's own. But,

really placement is hardly an issue in IITs. And if you didn't get a satisfactory firstjob, that it not the end of the world. Perform well in whatever you got, and then

you switch to something more to your liking.

Frankly speaking, there can only be two reasons to prefer one program over the

other: One, your own personal inclination and aptitude. If you knew that thenobviously there is no problem in ranking the programs. The second reason is

placement. But if placement is close to 100 percent for all programs, then whatdoes one do.

And on top of that, most IITians end up doing things completely different from

what they studied at IIT anyway. So why worry about placement of a particular

program. This year's favorite all over the country were jobs in financial analytics,

paying handsome salaries. And they just hired smart people from all thedepartments. The second most popular career path seems to be doing an MBA.

Again, there is no distinction between various programs. In fact, if you are a smart

cookie, and you chose a program which all other smarter cookies will avoid, thenyou can have an easy life in IIT, spend more time on extra-curricular, developing

your personality and soft skills, prepare for CAT, and have a better chance at

capturing financial analytics jobs or getting admission to IIMs.

Since placement is no different, and one does not have special personal preferencefor a particular program, the only ranking that makes sense for most people is

based on last years' closing rank. But what this means is that a new and exciting

program will be missed by a large number of bright students. Do pay a closeattention to programs that have been started in the last couple of years, or are


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being started this year. Most people will go by last years' closing ranks, and you

may have an easy time getting admission into that program, even if you do not

have a rank in 3 digits or less.

Since most people end up using last years' closing rank as a guide to fill up their

preferences this year, it puts a lot of pressure on others who may actually have apersonal preference for something else. The old illogic continues. For example,

why don't people select Civil Engineering. Many people still believe that the onlyjob that a civil engineer can have is that of supervising in hot summer afternoon

the road construction work in the hinterland. Nothing could be farther from truth.

While one should not demean the job of constructing a highway, there are somany exciting things happening in civil engineering, but people continue to join

civil only if they don't get any other engineering program. They are disinclined

towards civil engineering from day one, and they fail to notice the excitement init.

4. Should I prefer a Dual-degree program or a BTech program.

Well the answer depends on whether you are talking about the two programs in

the same department, or different departments. Let us take the two possibilities

seperately.

If you are comparing Dual and BTech in the same department, say Dual (CSE)

versus BTech (CSE), then the answer is very simple. Go for BTech. I think the

dual-degree programs are fantastic, but the way IIT Kanpur policies have been

designed, it is much easier to change one's program from BTech to Dual, and it ismuch more difficult to change the program from Dual to BTech. So why should

one decide on Dual now. Take up BTech program now, and if you get excitedabout the Dual degree program after you join IIT, you can move to Dual-degree atthat time. (Rules of IIT Kanpur permit a change of program from BTech to Dual-

degree till the beginning of 7th semester.)

What I am suggesting above may not hold for other IITs. Another view I have on

dual-degree program is that it is little too early to decide what your specializationshould be in the MTech program. Hence I personally prefer only those dual-

degree programs where MTech is in a broad discipline (allowing you to choose

your specialisation in the fourth year typically), and not like those dual-degreeprograms where you have to decide now a narrow area of specialization, for

which you know even less at this time.

Now coming to the more interesting question. I have a JEE rank of 200. I want to

follow last years' closing ranks for choosing major departments, and hence Iprefer CSE over EE. But I am not likely to get admission in BTech (CSE). Should

I prefer Dual (CSE) or BTech (EE).


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You could replace EE and CSE with any two departments, and the answer will be

same. It depends on how strongly you prefer one department over the other (CSE

over EE in this example). And to test how strongly you prefer one departmentover the other, I will ask a theoretical question. Be honest in answering it.

Your BTech (EE) program will finish in May 2012. Suppose I were to offer youadmission in BTech (CSE) on the condition that your program will be delayed by

three months, and you will actually graduate in August 2012. Would you thenprefer BTech (CSE) or would you still prefer BTech (EE).

Basically, if you prefer EE in this hypothetical scenario, then it is clear that your

preference for CSE is very minor, and you are not willing to pay even a small cost

of three extra months to undertake a CSE program. Then you should prefer BTech(EE) over Dual (CSE).

But if you preferred CSE in this hypothetical situation, then we can continue this

game a bit further. Now, I further suggest that you invest 9 more months in thediscipline for which you have indicated a reasonably strong preference. In these

nine months, we will most probably give you about one lakh rupees in cash, we

will give you a degree that normally takes two years to complete, and a degree

that opens a lot more doors for you in industry. At least in CSE, severalmultinationals have setup advanced R&D labs in India, and they hire MTechs and

PhDs only, giving a very good work environment as well as an excellent financial

package. I am sure there are such labs in other disciplines as well.

To me the decision is a no-brainer (though your mileage may vary). The futurecertainly belongs to more specialisation, and having an MTech degree will be an

asset for everyone. Spending a few extra months now in the same environmentwhere you have spent four years is the easiest way to get an MTech degree.(Talking about CSE at IITK, for getting a BTech degree, you will need to do 40

courses and a project. For Dual-degree the requirement is only 42 courses and a

thesis. So it is really very small incremental work that gives you an additionaldegree.)

The financial assistance in the final year is based on your good performance in the

first four years, and is based on current Institute assistantship rates. These may be

enhanced in the next four years. You could also be working on sponsored projectsfor your thesis, and get much higher assistanship. (For example, some MTech

students working with me have received Rs. 15,000 per month.)

And, if you are one of those who always want to look at placement figures before

taking a decision, well, the third batch of dual-degree students in IIT Kanpurgraduated this year. And the salary package offered to them was better than the

corresponding package offered to the BTech students in the same branch, by the

same company. So you do get compensation for that one extra year (besides, as Isaid, opening more doors in research labs, and other such places, where BTechs


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are not even considered). And future growth is likely to be faster for people with

two degrees from IITs.

5. If Dual-degree programs are so good, why is it that many people are not

opting for it.

Nothing is perfact in life, and there are shortcomings with Dual-degree programs

as well. But more importantly it does not fit into the career plans of many

students.

First, many students think that they might like to get a US degree after IIT. (Thisused to be the only ticket to US a decade or more ago. Most people who go to US

today, go with business visa, but still old thinking die hard.) And the easiest US

degree to get is a Masters degree. People feel shy of joining another master'sdegree after completing one.

I can only say to such students that the number of people going to US for MSdegree is reducing rapidly as other avenues to go abroad have opened, and also

opportunities within India have become enormous. So the chances are that youwon't find yourself in a situation where you would have to do another Master's

degree after a Master's degree from IITs.

Second, if the student has already decided that one is not going to be in the area of

undergraduate discipline. For example, one may be interested in MBA afterBTech. Then spending an extra year is wasteful.

My response is that unless you are absolutely sure of your career plans, a few

extra months in an IIT are not going to hurt you too much, and in all likelihood itwill help your career significantly.

One piece of advice. IIT Kanpur implements Dual-degree program in a very

unique (and may I add, strange) way. The student gets two different roll numbers,

they get two different CPIs, they are governed by two separate set of rules

depending on whether they have done enough UG courses or not. It is all veryconfusing, and problematic, particularly if you happen to perform not so well. I

believe that other IITs have a more streamlined implementation of dual-degree

programs. So you may weigh this too while deciding on the dual-degree program.

6. Which IIT has the most liberal branch change rules.

Frankly, I do not know all the nuances of the branch change rules of all IITs. Also,

there are some traditions, which are not codified as rules. My information is

primarily from the JEE brochure. You could read yourself, but anyway, let mesummarize. (But before I do that, a statutory warning. Do not count on branch

change. In any IIT, it is given to very few students, and you must assume that

everyone else in the IIT will be at least as smart as you are.)


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Many IITs allow top one percent students to choose their branch without any

restrictions. IIT Kanpur does not have such a rule, but traditionally it has allowed

anyone with a CPI of 10.0 to choose their branch. (And the number of studentswith a CPI of 10.0 at the end of 2nd semester is more than one percent of the

batch.)

All IITs have a lower limit of strength in a branch, and the number of students in

that particular branch cannot go below that level. IIT Bombay says 85 percent ofexisting strength. IIT Delhi, IIT Roorkee and IIT Guwahati have set the limit at 90

percent of existing strength. IIT Kanpur has set the limit at 60 percent of the

sanctioned strength. So, IITs at Delhi, Roorkee, and Guwahati allow very fewpeople to get out of an unpopular branch, while IIT Bombay allows a few more.

IIT Kanpur allows lots of people to get out of any branch, except a few

exceptionally unpopular branches. (Traditionally, Chemistry has had problemswith lower limits, and some students despite good performance have been denied

change of program.)

All IITs put an upper limit on the batch size after the branch change. IIT Bombay,

IIT Delhi, and IIT Kanpur set the upper limit as the sanctioned strength. So youcan get into that branch only if there is a vacancy. IITs at Kharagpur and Roorkee

allow the batch size to go up by 10 percent of existing strength. IIT Guwahati

allows extra seats upto 10 percent of sanctioned strength. Now, normally, the mostpopular courses do not have any vacancies. So it will be impossible to get

Computer Science in Kanpur and Bombay by way of branch change (unless you

are one of the top few), while at other IITs they always create at least a few seats

for branch change.

One thing you may note in these rules is that every IIT either controls exit from abranch or controls entry into a branch. IITs which are liberal in entry into a branch

(by allowing student strength to go up beyond the existing or even sanctioned

strength) are strict in terms of how many students can get out of a particularbranch. Overall, you may not find any significant difference in the number of

students getting branch changes in different IITs.

IIT Kharagpur and IIT Madras don't seem to allow branch change for dual-degreestudents.

Many IITs have a special provision for allowing BTech students to join the dual-

degree program in the same department till later part of their program. IIT

Bombay allows a BTech student to migrate to Dual-degree till 4th semester, andin some exceptional cases, even later. IIT Kanpur allows a BTech student to

migrate to Dual-degree till the middle of 7th semester.

Another point to note is that some IITs allow a general category student to change

to another branch where the vacancy is due to non-availability of a suitablereserved category student, while other IITs will not do so. And this will make a


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significant difference in terms of number of students who can get a change in their

branch. (And I have no idea which IIT does what.) IIT Kanpur used to permit

changes for a general category student to fill up a reserved seat after one year.Now, it has become more strict, and this year, will not allow such changes. So the

number of branch changes are likely to reduce.

IIT Kanpur is unique in the sense that it allows branch changes even after 3rd and

4th semester (only those vacancies which somehow could not be filled after 2ndsemester, so this does not help you get very popular programs, since they were

full after 2nd semester anyway).

7. Which IIT is best for CAT preparation.

Sorry, we do not provide coaching for CAT or any other MBA entrance test. Thereis private coaching available in every city and town. At IIT Kanpur, there are

coaching centers just outside its boundary wall, and I am sure the same is true for

other IITs as well.

If you are sure that you will like to go for MBA after your under-graduateprogram, select the program with the largest closing rank. Statistically speaking, it

is likely to be least competitive. Since you are not interested in any program, and

only want to be associated with IIT brand, chose a program with least number ofyears (4-years) and a program where very few top rankers are likely to be present.

8. How are programs on Mathematics and Computing.

In many IITs, there are programs on Mathematics and Computing. Please note

that in all cases that I know of (but please check individual website), the programis offered by the Department of Mathematics and not the Department of ComputerScience. It means that the major component of the program will be Mathematics,

and the Computing component will be significantly less than what a pure

Computer Science program would offer. But if you are very keen on anythingrelated to computers, and you can't get the full-fledged program on Computer

Science, then these programs are the next best things in life. You, of course can

get into software industry, though you will find it difficult to get a job in researchlabs of IT companies. Also, these programs are getting popular wih financial

firms. You know your mathematics, you hone your analytical skills, and you know

the basics of Computer Science. These are enough to earn a 7-digit salary.

And while they may be poor cousins of Computer Science programs within theIIT system, I would tend to favor them over a CS program outside IIT system,

even for those who are sure that they really want to be in Computing as a career.

First, in some IITs, a few courses in the program may even be taught by ComputerScience faculty. Please check their website, or ask a faculty member in the

Mathematics department. Second, most IITs give you opportunities to do elective

courses from outside the department, and hence you may be able to do a few


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courses from Computer Science Department (other than those which are

compulsory in the curriculum).

Also, if you are serious about a career in computing, then you should be planningto do an MTech later on, irrespective of whether you do a CS degree from a non-

IIT, or a Maths and Computing degree from an IIT. And both will stand an equalchance for admission to most MTech programs. And of course, as I have

repeatedly said here, don't forget the value of Brand IIT. (I am a totally biasedperson, strongly in favor of IIT system. Take everything I say with a pinch of

salt.)

And, if you have something inherently against a five-year degree, or if you have

something against an MSc degree, you can consider IIT Guwahati's offering,which is a BTech program in Mathematics and Computing, and is a regular 4-year

program.

9. How are programs on Engineering Physics.

The programs on Engineering Physics differ significantly from one IIT to another.These programs invariably include several Physics courses, but what

differentiates them from MSc (Physics) courses are the courses from other

disciplines. Some IIT may have substantial amount of Electronics in thecurriculum, while another one may have material science, and yet another one

may have courses from a diverse set of disciplines.

So, please read the JEE brochure, or visit the website for more details before

deciding which program matches your interests.

10. For Bio-related courses, is it necessary to have done Biology in the 12th class.

To the best of my knowledge, there is no requirement of passing Biology in the

12th class for courses on Bio-technology, Bio-chemistry, Bio-sciences, Bio-

medical, and so on. I did not see any such requirement mentioned in the JEE

Brochure.

11. I am interested in Electronics. IIT Kanpur offers only a program in

Electrical but not in Electronics. Why.

IIT Kanpur does not believe in proliferation of degrees. As a result it offersminimum number of distinct programs (except IIT Delhi, and the new IITs). So,while the name of the program remains BTech (Electrical), it offers electives in all

sub-disciplines - be it communications, micro-electronics, power, and so on. It has

an extremely flexible curriculum in Electrical Engineering, which allows you totake courses in stream of your choice.


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12. I have got a 500+ rank in JEE. I want to study Computing in one of the

original five IITs. Should I go for programs on Maths and Computing.

As I have discussed above, these are good programs. However, please do checkthe specific details of each program from respective IITs. The content on

Computing vary from one program to another. Whether the Computing coursesare being taught by Maths faculty or Computer Science faculty is important. And

the flexibility in taking electives from Computer Science department is alsoimportant. In IIT Kanpur, only the first course on programming, and the course on

Data Structures is taught by CS faculty, and generally, it is very difficult for a

Maths and Computing student to do courses in the CSE department.

13. I have got a 1000+ rank in JEE. Should I study Computer Science in BHU or

opt for some discipline in an IIT.

If you have strong preference/aptitude/inclination towards a any particular

discipline, and you are getting admission into a good quality college for thatdiscipline, then go for it. But if your preference for the discipline is not very

strong, stay within the IIT system.

As I have said above, everyone in an IIT will get a job, and most persons would

not be in their discipline soon after their graduation. So in a sense the disciplinedoes not matter. What IITs give you is not just learning in a particular discipline,

but train you for life-long learning. The kind of learning environment you will

find in IITs is difficult to replicate elsewhere, including BHU.

You will progress in your career primarily based on your capabilities, but you will

require help from others at times. IITs have a HUGE brand equity, and anywhereyou go, doors will open for you on the basis of this brand-equity. There is a very

concious program running in US (and to a smaller extent in India), called Pan-IITmovement, to promote IIT as a common brand of all IITs. And the old boys'

network of IITs is very strong, and has a lot of attachment for other fellow

IITians. These things help a lot in career.

Of course, my guess is that the new IITs will cause a dilution in the name brand ofIIT as a whole, and my prediction is that in future, individual IITs will have their

own branding. So peoople will no longer be impressed by the statement, "I have a

degree from an IIT." They will want to know, which IIT. (It is like NITs. They

have not been successful in building a brand NIT, because there is far too muchdifference in the quality of various NITs. So, a few NITs have been successful in

projecting themselves as centers of excellence, but there is no common perception

of all NITs being good.)

14. I have got a 1500+ rank in JEE, and can get a good branch in IIT Roorkee. Is

IIT Roorkee as good as original five IITs.


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Obviously, IIT Roorkee, by its very name, is an IIT. And thanks to the Pan-IIT

movement, the brand equity of IIT Roorkee is going to be equally good in the

years to come. Some would argue that the brand equity of University of Roorkeewas comparable to that of IITs, and currently a re-branding exercise is going on,

and in the interim their brand value has taken a hit. (I should be teaching

management students. What am I doing in Computer Science.)

They do have some weak spots. In Computer Science, for example, I woulddefinitely rank IIIT Hyderabad higher than IIT Roorkee. In general, look at the

website. Do they have enough faculty members in that discipline. IIT Roorkee has

its strengths. And the original five IITs have their weaknesses.

15. I have got a 2000+ rank in JEE, and can get a good branch in IIT Guwahati.

Is it safe to study in Guwahati? Why do many people not prefer IIT

Guwahati.

To the best of my knowledge, it is absolutely safe to be in IIT Guwahati. Yes, itdoes have an image problem. There was a time when the geography knowledge of

many a students in North India was such any person from south of Vindhyas was

a Madrasi. I don't come across such species any more. But a lot of geography-

challenged parents cannot differentiate between Guwahati and the rest of Assam.Even an occasional law and order problem in Assam is immediately linked to

Guwahati in their mind. Please don't worry. It is a beautiful campus, right next to

the mighty Brahmaputra. You will enjoy your stay there.

The problem with Guwahati is really its connectivity. The number of trains fromGuwahati to the rest of the country is rather small, and you need reservations

much in advance. Of course, thanks to Lalu, you can get seats in a hurry underTatkal quota, if you are willing to pay a higher price. And, thanks to Capt.Gopinath, a common man can fly to/from Guwahati. As the air connectivity is

improving over the years, you would notice that the closing ranks in Guwahati are

also improving every year.

Of course, they do have less faculty in some disciplines than what they wouldlike. But as I said elsewhere, look at their website to get exact data, and then make

up your mind. In terms of infrastructure, I don't think they are anyway less

endowed than others. It is cheap to build infrastructure.

16. I have got a 2500+ rank in JEE. Can I get admission in one of the six newIITs. Are they going to be as good.

It is difficult to predict what the closing ranks will be in the new IITs. However, if

you don't get into new IITs then it means that some of the programs in the existingIITs will have closed much later.


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Will they be as good. As I said elsewhere, building infrastructure is cheap. So

there is no reason for not having as good facilities. Initially the new IITs will be

mentored by existing IITs. IIT Hyderabad will be mentored by IIT Madras. IITPatna will be mentored by IIT Guwahati. IIT Rajasthan will be mentored by IIT

Kanpur. IIT Punjab will be mentored by IIT Delhi. IIT Bhubaneshwar will be

mentored by IIT Kharagpur. And finally, IIT Gujarat will be mentored by IITBombay. Out of these, classes for IIT Gujarat, IIT Hyderabad, and IIT Patna will

be held in temporary locations in the same city where IIT is eventually going to

come. The other three IITs will be hosted by their respective mentors, that is theclasses will be held on the existing campuses.

In three IITs which will have classes on existing campuses, at least there will be a

campus life, and all the facilities. The teaching may not be done by faculty of

existing IITs, but I am sure there will be some quality control.

But IIT education is not about quality of instruction and facilities alone. It is

essentially about being a part of the brand. The new IITs will take at least adecade, if not more, to build that brand. So studying in new IITs will be less

advantageous to you in the early part of the career, but eventually you will catchup. So I am ambivalent about whether you should join new IITs or not.

By the way, the hosting of one IIT by another will put some load on the existing

resources. I don't know how IITs at Delhi/Kanpur/Kharagpur will handle this

without affecting quality for their own students. Everyone and everything will bestretched a lot in the next couple of years.

For my views on the process of setting up new IITs, you may go through thisanother article

of mine.

17. I have got a 3000+ rank in JEE. Should I go for an MSc program in an IIT or

a BTech program in another institution.

Once again, I will re-iterate my bias. A degree from an existing IIT is likely to be

more valuable than a degree from another institution, particularly when you do

not have any innate preference for what you want to study and where. (If you hadthat desire, you wouldn't be reading this page.) Most people will take up careers

in areas different from what they studied in IITs, including those high rankers who

get their first option. And, of course, there are enough good jobs and career

options in the area of your expertise after MSc degrees as well.

But before you put down MSc on the choice sheet, please do visit the website of

the department, and look at the faculty pages. Are their enough faculty members.

Do you feel inspired by their achievements. If you don't find a webpage, drop thatprogram. They are not interested in you. You shouldn't be interested in them.
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18. I have got a 3500+ rank in JEE. I can get my preferred discipline in IT-BHU.

I heard that it will become an IIT soon. Will I get a degree from IIT

Varanasi, if I join IT BHU.

This is a question that has been on everyone's mind for many years. One keep

seeing conflicting reports in the media. Some reports that it will be an "IIT" in thesense that the name will change to "IIT Varanasi" or something like that. Some

reports, on the other hand, say that it will become autonomous (currently BHUcontrols many decisions of IT, as IT is a constituent of BHU), and it will have

administrative structure similar to IITs, and that it will have funding similar to

IITs, but it will not be given the name of "IIT".

What will happen in future, only God and Ministry of HRD know. There is nodoubt that the IIT name will help the institute and its alumni. If you study in IT-

BHU in the hope of name change, and it does not happen, you would have lost the

opportunity to study in another IIT, may be a discipline less preferred by you. On

the other hand, if you chose another IIT, and IT-BHU does get a name change,you would be cursing yourself for not chosing "IIT Varanasi."

My suggestion is that unless the discipline is strongly preferred, stay within the

existing IIT system. But do what you think is right. Don't blame me for yourdecisions later on.

19. I have got a 4000+ rank in JEE in my first attempt. Should I go for a second

chance next year, or should I join whatever I am getting this year.

It is a very personal decision, based on your own confidence level. (Aren't all

decisions personal.) I am, by and large, a risk averse person, and I believe thatsuccess in JEE (and similarly other admission tests) requires that God be with you

on that day. A slight headache, and a couple of questions wrong can set you backby a large number of ranks. Given that chance plays a significant role in JEE

selection, I wouldn't advice anyone to take that chance again, if you can find

anything remotely of your interest in an IIT. (And remember, if you join an IIT,

you are not allowed to give JEE again.)

There are some science programs that based on last year's closing ranks and

increased seats are likely to close after 4000 this year. Then there is Design

program in IIT Guwahati, which is very good. You should study the counselling

brochure carefully to find out the likelihood of getting a branch by looking at thelast year's closing ranks, and considering that there is an increase of more than 15

percent seats. Please note that last year's closing ranks are just guidelines, and in

some cases, the closing ranks can vary substantially from one year to the other.

On the other hand, if you are getting nothing in IIT, then trying for an improved

rank makes some sense. If you were ranked 5000 in JEE, the chances are that with

one year of exclusive preparing for the engineering admission tests, you will get a


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decent rank in at least one of the many such tests, and you won't be worse off next

year, and you might just have better luck next time.

20. I have got a 4500+ rank in JEE. Should I study abroad. I have an offer from

NTU, Singapore.

If you have decided that your passion lies in Computer Science, then you have to

look at your options and decide the best place to do Computer Science. How does

it matter whether that place is in India or abroad. (Of course, you should be ableto afford it.)

On the other hand, if this was a trick question (like the kind we ask in JEE), and

you really intended to ask me to compare Computer Science in a foreign

university with an unpopular discipline at an IIT, then it is complicated. IITs'brand value (and that helps in career, as I have said before) is much higher than

most academic institutes in Asia for under-graduate studies. And the other is the

cost issue. Can you afford to study abroad, and even if you can, is it worth thatmuch investment. On the other hand, the advantages of studying abroad are that

you are getting international exposure at an early age, which has some value.

Also, you are getting to study that you prefer. These are the positives and

negatives. Now you decide for yourself which factors you are going to give moreweight.

Let me also add that compared to the best institutions in the world, IITs' quality of

education is suspect. Our graduates do well because we take the best, and a small

amount of value addition can turn them into gold. But if you consider the valueaddition that many good US universities provide to an average student, no Indian

college can come anywhere close. You study in IIT because they provide the besteducation in India (and to a large extent in Asia), and they have the best brandname, but purely in terms of quality of education, lots of universities in US will

be better. For almost a decade, we had kept open a channel of admission for NRIs

through SAT scores. None of our illustrious alumni settled in USA thought aboutsending their sons and daughters to IITs. (I did my MS and PhD from University

of Maryland, College Park. Quality of under-graduate education there was

certainly better than at IITs.)

21. I have got a 5000+ rank in JEE. What discipline should I chose in ISM

Dhanbad.

I don't suggets what to do and what not do. That should be your personal decision.

If you think you only want a degree from a good enough place to pursue a non-

technical career, and degree is only a line in the resume, then you need not joinISM Dhanbad. If you are getting something in IIT system, just fill those choices.

But if you are genuinely interested in Mining related programs, then ISM is a

good place to study. And remember that mining is getting hot these days, so there


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is really no shortage of good jobs in mining. I wouldn't be able to suggest which

of the programs have better job prospects in the current times, and I certainly can't

predict what will happen 4 years from now.

22. I have got a 5500+ rank in JEE. But I have a much better rank in AIEEE.

Can you name a few good colleges, in case I don't get admission to anyprogram in an IIT.

Please read my article on how to choose a college.

23. I have got a 6000+ rank in JEE. Should I go for JEE Counseling. Can I get

admission to any institute. Will I get my money back if I am not offered

admission.

Last year, the last closing rank was 6196 for Architecture at IIT Roorkee. This

time, considering the OBC reservations, and the opening of new IITs, the last

closing rank should be after 7000.

There is no harm in going for counseling and filling up all the choices you are

interested in. One never knows how the preferences of candidates may change

this year, and what will be the impact of new programs and the reservation. Youshould not regret later, if the closing rank is after your JEE rank.

And yes, if you are not awarded admission to any of the programs that you fill up

in your choice sheet, then your money will be refunded (after deducting a smallcounseling fee).

24. I have got a 6500+ rank in JEE. Why do IITs declare so many candidates assuccessful when the total number of seats available is less.

There are many candidates who prefer to join other colleges if they can't get a

discipline of their choice through JEE. Because of this, JEE declares many morecandidates successful than the number of seats. The total number of successful

candidates is about 1.15 times the total number of seats available (including

reserved seats). It means that depending on how many candidates chose to nottake admission through JEE, some of the successful candidates may not be offered

admission to any program.

25. I have got a 7000+ rank in JEE. What are the colleges that admit studentsbased on JEE rank, but are not part of JEE Counseling.

There are 8 institutes that JEE website lists which use JEE rank for admission. Tofacilitate admission to these institutions, JEE also declares an extended merit list.

That is, it declares ranks for students beyond the 1.15 times the seats number.

Those who appear in extended merit list are not called for JEE Counseling, but
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can apply for admission to these 8 institutions. (Those who are selected in JEE

main merit list are obviously eligible for admission to these institutions.)

These institutions include five Indian Institutes of Science, Education andResearch (IISERs) at Mohali, Pune, Kolkata, Bhopal, and Thiruvananthapuram,

respectively. The other three are: Indian Institute of Space Science andTechnology (IIST) at Thiruvananthapuram, Rajiv Gandhi Institute of Petroleum

Technology (RGIPT) at Rai Bareli (UP), and Indian Institute of Maritime Studies(Merchan Navy). The IIMS actually consists of three different programs at three

different locations. Check their website for more details.

26. I am convinced about IIT Guwahati. But my parents are not agreeing to let

me go so far. What do I do.

Argue with them. Convince them. Put them in touch with some faculty member in

IIT Guwahati. Tell them that for your job, you might have to go abroad, even

farther than Guwahati, and for people in North India, Guwahati may not be fartherthan Chennai.

27. If I want to get additional information about a specific program, whom do I

contact.

Certainly, not me. I know somethings about Computer Science and IT. I have

some general knowledge about various other fields, but no detailed knowledge. Ifyou want to know what do they teach in that program, or which companies came

last year to hire, I would not know any of that stuff.

Please visit the website of the department who is offering that program. Find outemail addresses of some faculty members or even students. Send your query toone or two persons only. DO NOT SPAM.

28. Can we contact you for more information

I will be glad to answer your further questions, if time permits. But I do not wish

to discuss JEE Counselling on phone. Please do not call me. Please contact meonly on email. You can send me email at: dheeraj[AT]iitk.ac.in.

(Remove [AT] and replace it by @.)

Even on email, I will not be able to answer all the queries. I get far too manyemails, and I prefer to respond to those emails, which are easily readable, andwhere the question is very clear, and not something that I have already answered

in this page. Please don't ask me what can be available at what rank. Please first

the JEE Counseling Brochure for 2008, which you should be getting this week.Also, there are websites on the Internet where people have put up the closing

ranks of last year. My guess at how closing ranks will change this year will be as

good as yours.


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Further, please note the following:

o Emails with SMS like language are not readable.

o Emails with all capital letters are not readable. (It amounts to shouting.)

o Use of Roman script for Hindi words is discouraged.

o Use proper puntuation marks, and capitalize the first letter of everysentence.

Best wishes.

verification of identity and counselling

Documents