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Voices from The Past

Scouting Teton Peaks Council

By Vernon L. Strong

July 7, 1969

TAPE # 143

Oral History by Harold Forbush

Transcribed by Devon Robb January 2003

Brigham Young University – Idaho

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(The Historical Society is pleased to transfer the following taped interview onto a C-90 Cassette the 2nd day of August, 1984. The Historical Society is located at North Center in Rexburg, Idaho, and maybe addressed at Post Office Box 244, Rexburg, Idaho, 83440. Copies of tapes may be obtained by calling the Historical Society at 208-356-9101 or writing the forgoing address.) HF: Oral history of the Upper Snake River Valley concerning the early history and development of scouting in the Upper Snake River Valley and more particularly the Teton Peaks Council of the Boy Scouts of America. Today it is my real joy and privilege to have in my office here at Rexburg, 68 East 1st South, Vernon L. Strong, for many years the scout executive of the Teton Peaks Council of the Boy Scouts of America. He is with his good wife, Sister Strong, and a staff member presently working with the council, Mr. Tom Hatch. Again it is a real joy, Brother Strong, to have you and your group come here to the office that we might interview you pertaining to this important subject and get down on tape some history of how scouting did develop in the area that we refer commonly to as the Upper Snake River Valley. Now, as per usual, our format is to ask a few questions. By doing this the material can be brought out. First of all I would like you to present your full name, date, and place of birth. VS: Vernon Leroy Strong. I was born July 9, 1900, in Kaysville, Utah. HF: Now if you will present a brief sketch of your genealogy on your mother’s side and on your father’s side and any other incidental material you might wish and state also something about your own family, this is your mother and dad and brothers and sisters. VS: My mother’s family originally came from Ireland. Their name was Duncan. Colonel John Duncan, Captain William Duncan, and finally my grandfather, Homer Duncan. My mother was born in Salt Lake, in fact on 1st West and Temple Street in 1864. On my father’s side, he was, his ancestor, as far back as we can go, was apparently indentured by some man to get across the ocean from England. Course, he worked his way that way. His sons and grandsons settled in Pennsylvania. My grandfather, Jacob Strong, the story goes, as I went back to Pennsylvania see one of my 5th cousins with whom I had become acquainted a few years ago as a result of my writing an article for the Improvement Era. She said when Jacob and Sarah Hill, his wife, joined the Church and went west with the Mormons that was the last we ever heard of them. So this is quite interesting to know that. My father was born to Jacob Strong. My mother, his wife, Alice Frisch Wallace. He was born in 1863 in Salt Lake City on 4th South and 8th East. My father and mother, after they had been married for some time, moved out to the community of Kaysville, about twenty miles north of Salt Lake City where eight children were born to them. The oldest of which was Sybil. Sybil and her husband, Milton Phillips, were married about 1908. The Phillips family had come up into the Teton Valley where they had taken out homesteads on a piece of property about two miles north of the present Tetonia. In those days it was known as Hayden and even the name of Badger was the community which

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today is known as Felt. This today is 1969 and, of course, was back in the early 1908, ’09, and ’10, along in there. This couple is responsible for my having come to Idaho. As we go through the other members of the family, we will come back to my name and we’ll give you the information concerning this coming to Idaho. The second child was Clifford D. He became a member of the Stake Presidency of the Davis Stake, North Davis Stake, and Patriarch. Harry L. was the next son. He, likewise, was very active in the Church and Seventies Quorum and Sunday school Superintendent for the stake. Leon M. came to Idaho later and spent quite a lot of time in Teton Valley being superintendent of schools and taught in the seminary program later coming out to Rexburg and Sugar City. The last three are deceased at the present time. William A. was the next one. Of course, he, like Leon, came up to Teton Valley and has stayed. In fact he is the only one who came and is still there. Alice came to live with Sybil one season. She met her husband, Robert A. Egbert, in Tetonia. They are now living in Lincoln, Idaho. I’m the seventh child, the fifth son, and in 1910, after my oldest sister had lost her baby at birth, she was so lonesome and homesick that I overheard my mother say, “Well, there’s nobody that can go with you.” Course, I hurriedly said that I could go. Mother said that I would be homesick and would not last. To make a long story short I finally came into Teton Valley in 1910 where I lived with Milton and Sybil during the summer. Fortunately I didn’t get homesick. I had no companions to play with except for the Decker children who were over a half mile away from us. That was very seldom. But I did amuse myself with various and sundry things and stuck it out. My youngest sister, Mildred, was born in 1901. She married Russell Kapner and they live in Riverside, Utah. HF: Well let’s see, I want to keep calling you President Strong because, of course, over the years I was so closely associated with, I could say our beloved William A. Strong, President of the Teton Stake for so many years. In commencing on our interview I want to state an omission in not stating the date. Today is July 7, 1969, and these good people arrived here to commence this interview at 7:00 a.m. so we’ve gotten an early start. Let’s see, I wanted to bring out one more item. Your father passed away early in life? VS: Yes, my father took ill with what apparently was appendicitis. In fact he was operated on in Ogden on my Aunt’s kitchen table by the doctor. He lived from April until October off and on, mostly ill during that time. He suffered tremendously for all those six months. Father passed away on October 3, 1903. I was just three years and three months old when father left. Naturally I can say, as Abraham Lincoln, all that I am or ever hope to be I owe to my angel mother because my father wasn’t permitted to be with me as from the time I was three years old on.

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HF: Did your mother continue to live in Kaysville, pretty much on? VS: We were living on a farm, a little fruit farm, apple trees mostly. As soon as father died mother realized this was no place to rear the family that she could to better. She felt that we needed education and all they had in that neighborhood was a one room school house. She was against this. She worked hard to get education for Davis County in fact, Kaysville first and Davis County eventually. She wanted to consolidate schools so her children could have the benefits of good schools. We spent two winters in Kaysville proper three miles from the farm. There we later bought a home up town. HF: Now, just a little about your formal education in Kaysville area and leading into conditions as they were when the United States became involved in the First World War. VS: Naturally I attended the Kaysville public schools until I graduated from the eighth grade. Incidentally I had one honor that I never expected. That was to be the president of the eighth grade. In those days it meant quite a bit. When we graduated from the eighth grade they took us to Lagoon, which you know is between Salt Lake and Ogden, where we had our outing. That was a great thrill. Later I went to Davis High for four years. Then the war broke out, I should say broke out. We were given the privilege of enlisting in the army at the age of eighteen providing we had so many high school credits. So I was working on the ranch, Milton Phillip’s ranch in Tetonia. In those days it was called Hayden, I think. No it was Tetonia. At any rate I got on the train and left beautiful Teton Valley and went down to Salt Lake City where I enlisted in the army at University of Utah. I joined the students army training corp., commonly knows as the SATC. There we spent a few months, went through the full period. My buddy died while I was in the hospital at Fort Douglas. I was, of course, only eighteen years of age. This, of course, was the flu epidemic that wiped out so many healthy people, as well as, others. After the war was over I went back to Davis High and finished the fourth year there and graduated. But due to the fact I didn’t have any money, naturally mother with eight children and very little employment except day labor, we didn’t accumulate enough money for me to go to school. In fact our story was like the window O’Callaghan’s boys. If you ever read that story you will find it very interesting. One boy got the job and he would grow out of it. The next boy would take that job and the family went right through job after job. I being much younger than the others didn’t inherit any of their jobs but I did stay out of school this one year in order to work. I worked at Layton Sugar Factory day shift, swing shift, and night shift. Graveyard we called it. I got enough money so that the second year my sister, Mildred, I was able to go to school. At this time mother moved to Salt Lake City where she made it possible for us two to attend school. Then mother, of course, rented an apartment house and lived in Salt Lake the rest of her life.

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My education, one year at University of Utah, took all the money I had so it was back the ranch in Idaho to get more money. In the summer of 1920 I was offered the contract to teach school in Tetonia, which I took. This was the beginning of my teaching profession. I taught a year in Tetonia, two years in Cache, and three years out here at Lincoln, where the sugar factory is. While I was there I became a scoutmaster and here is where my professional scouting program begins. HF: Now let’s see, did I understand you attended the University of Utah some? VS: One year. HF: Did you ever attend Ricks? VS: When I got this job teaching school in Tetonia I came out to Ricks College for the Summer School. The summers of 1921, ’22, ’23. In 1921 I came to the school and I didn’t know a soul in Rexburg or at Ricks College, neither professors nor students. When I went to register I said, where can I find a place to live. Well, they said, I don’t know. Well, there was a man standing over there that’s got a place and I think he needs somebody with him. I went over and made myself acquainted and who do you realize it was a young man from Victor, Idaho, by the name of Thomas E. Cheney, who now is a professor at Brigham Young University and has been for many years. Thomas and I boarded at Mrs. Fiksted’s just east of the college across the street. We both decided to learn to play tennis. He went down town and bought a tennis racket and a ball and came home with it. I said, well, I’d better do the same. So I came down and bought the mate to it and we went back and started to learn to play tennis. My biggest trouble was, since I had played baseball all my life, that when he know to ball to me, I would reach out with my left hand and grab the ball instead of returning it with the racket. But we had a lot of fun. Many times I would knock the ball clear over the back fence, not even staying anywhere near the tennis court. Fortunately for me I worked at it consistently and won the championship that year from the veteran who’d had it the year previously. HF: Who coached you that year, those years, in tennis and did you play a little baseball for the college? VS: Yes, I played baseball. Coach Parker was the coach. I was the pitcher for the baseball team and when I wasn’t pitching I played in the outfield. I enjoyed that a lot. Nobody coached us, I’d say Tom Cheney coached me in tennis and I coached me in tennis and I coached him because that’s all we knew. We just played the ball back and forth until we won or lost. Then the next year Thomas and I were the last two. Fortunately again I won the championship from him. That next year I married Vienna Meikle of Cache of Teton Valley. The next year when it came for the tournament, Thomas with all of the young woman who weren’t married were on his side and they said you’re and old man now. We can surely beat you

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this year. I was able to take the championship for three consecutive years. Finally, one day in Provo, Thomas said let’s go out and play tennis. Well, I hadn’t played at all and it was a hot day. But without excuses he had his time finally and won the game and I was happy and he was happier. HF: Well now, everyone up here in the Upper Snake River Valley over the years know you as the Teton Peaks Council Scout Executive. You just mentioned Vernon L. Strong and, sure, scouting. Well now, there must have been a beginning. Could you tell us when and where? VS: Yes, this is very interesting. When the church took scouting as a part of their program for the Church, they sent out feelers and the people in our community in Kaysville decided to have a scout troop. A brother from Mexico, who had been chased out of Mexico in the revolution down there in 1912, was living there. They appointed him as the scoutmaster. I won’t mention his name because he wasn’t able to fulfill his responsibilities. It wasn’t his fault but at any rate, we boys paid our money and we met about three times. The next year the same thing happened. Finally the third year the Church sent John H. Taylor, a member of the First Council of Seventies later, to come out and give us the tenderfoot tests. Brother Taylor gave us the tests. I shall always remember because William L. Foxley, who was the scoutmaster, was recording the things that we did. Brother Taylor would say, well give him a zero, give him a zero, give him a five, give him a six, and so on. I had such a string of zeroes that when we got next to the end I said, give me a zero. He said, that’s what you’re going to get. Well, zero met that it was perfect so I was happy. When they gave us our tenderfoot pins one of my friends who was a little more pugnacious than I wanted to be the first boy to get his tenderfoot pin. He wanted to be one of the important boys. We had a leader by the name of Neumann Reeves, larger and older than the rest of us who was a fine fellow. As Bill Foxley, as we fondly called him, lined us up. I stood next to Neumann Reeves. This young fellow, who was a year older than I, grabbed me and shoved me on the end and he took my place. It just so happened that Bill Foxley came to me first, thereby, and pinned the first tenderfoot badge on me in the whole of Kaysville and North Davis County. HF: What years was this? VS: This was 1916. The certificates then were much different than they are now. We had a three piece folder clamped together on the corner. It was very attractive. I have it here with me but, of course, we won’t be able to put that on tape. HF: Could you read what it states on there? VS: I’ll have to find it first . . . . It has four sections on it. The first section says,” Be Prepared” across the top. Then two boys, one with glasses, looking in the distance. The other boy is signaling. He’s signaling the only position of the semaphore that does not spell a letter. It is the opposite of the letter “L.” Under it is the number 1915 and below that is “Do a Good Turn Daily.” On the other side of that is the scout oath and the scout law printed. The next page says the National Council of the Boy Scouts of America, 200th

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Fifth Avenue, New York City. This is to certify that Vern L. Strong upon the recommendation of the local scout authorities is enrolled as a member of the Boy Scouts of America for the year ending, and then a big 1915 is put across it on the card, but the words June 30, 1916, are written in indicating that I joined June 30 or July 1, 1915. This was good till 1916. Further information under that with signatures of the President of the Boy Scout of America, William H. Taft, the honorary Vice-President, who was former President of the United States, Woodrow Wilson, who was honorary president, he being the President of the United States at that time. The back side of this card says, “This is to certify that the scout named on the front of this certificate is a member in good standing of the Kangaroo Patrol, Troop #1, City of Kaysville, State of Utah. His age 15, height 5’ 2’’, imagine that. Weight 92 pounds are given on this 10th day of July, 1915. W.L. Foxley, scoutmaster. John D. Taylor, scout commissioner. Scout history: qualified as a tenderfoot scout July 13, 1915 and 2nd Class Scout July 25, 1917.

Then there were places for merit badges and other qualifications that I hadn’t completed. The third section is merely a blank sheet of paper, the type that you can write on and erase quite easily. I see a few numbers on here which I didn’t erase. This sort of like a slate where you can write and erase and write and erase and keep it with you. The last section, on one side has the international Morse code listed from “A” to numerals and how to use it. The back side is the picture of the American Flag with printing the Boy Scout plan, not military, teaching however, loyalty, patriotism, chivalry, advocating universal peace.

That’s the first type of cards issued to the boy scouts in the entire program. This

lasted about two years and then they changed them. Incidentally I have the form here, one that says I was a scoutmaster.

After the war we came home, as I said, and went back to school. They didn’t have

a scoutmaster. Mr. Foxley had, something had happened so he was unable to be it anymore. The bishop of the ward asked me if I would act as the scoutmaster. I told him sure. I was in love with the boys and the scouting program. So they made me the scoutmaster even though I was not supposed to be. I wasn’t old enough.

When I was a scoutmaster, I often think of how little I knew about the Boy Scout program. We never had any information give to us in scouting, leadership or otherwise. All I knew was how to drill. So the boys in Kaysville got a real fine drilling. We drilled up and down that street night after night. One night my older brother, Harry, who’d been in the army for more than two years, most of it over in France, came down and stopped me. He said you’re going to have these kids hate you like sixty. Nobody likes to drill. I said you ask them what they like to do. He asked them if they wanted to drill. And with a shout they said, “Sure we like to drill.” So drilling we did. We played games, scout games of course. The scout pace, we were quite proficient at that. They don’t have that in the program now. This was a mile in twelve minutes. We ran around that one block

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twice, there in Kaysville, to make the mile. Those people knew us every scouting meeting night because we ran around the street. HF: Actually, did you get scouting, were you involved in scouting when you came up to Idaho to visit your relatives? If not, just when did you get involved in scouting again? VS: One interesting thing before we get by, I meant to say. When I tried to take my Second Class tests, Mr. Foxley was the speed cop; we called him in those days. He had a motorcycle. He had a motorcycle South of Kaysville there was not cement highway. It was just plain dirt and sandy out south of town. He said you meet me out to a certain place and I’ll give you your scout pace training, your test to see if you can pass it. I went out there. Now he said, I’ll measure out the mile. He went on down the highway a ways and then came back. He said, now you go down to that tree a way down there and back and I’ll meet you here. I’ll be here and see if you can do it right. I started out and while I was running and walking, fifty steps of each, a car came from Salt Lake towards Ogden going about twenty-five miles an hour. Next thing I knew my scoutmaster disappeared. It was his responsibility to pick up anyone going more than twenty miles an hour through Davis County because that was speeding in those days. I thought you would be interested in that little sidelight. It took me three times running it that day in order to pass the test because of the speeders, twenty-five, thirty, and thirty-five miles per hour. I don’t think the cars would go much more than thirty miles and hour in those days. At any rate he had to chase them down. The third time he showed up and said you passed it. Now coming to Idaho, of course, we didn’t have any scouting in Teton Valley, in the communities that I was living in. So I didn’t get actively involved as a leader there. Coming out to Lincoln, however, one of the first things I remember was a knock at the door. I was teaching school, I had the sixth grade, as I remember. A knock came to the door. I went to the door and here was this man standing at the door. He said, is you name Vernon Strong. I said it is. He said, could I talk to you for a minute. I said yes. Of course, I kept my eye on the room. My students were excellent students and well disciplined. I loved them and apparently they respected me enough that I didn’t have to go back in the room for about ten minutes. The man was Harold S. Alford, who at that time was the scout executive of the Teton Peaks Council. He asked me if I would be the scoutmaster of the Lincoln troop. Eventually I became the scoutmaster of the Lincoln troop, which I served for the three years that I was there. At one time, most of the time I had all of the boys registered. The last year I had every boy in Lincoln from the age of twelve to eighteen registered but one boy who belonged to the Lutheran Church. His family felt that since we met in the LDS Church building, they would rather he didn’t join. He was the most unhappy boy in the whole community. I have always said to myself, why didn’t I go to his folks and talk with them. Because I should have done. I am sure that if I had talked with them he could have been a boy scout too. He now lives in Idaho Falls and isn’t a boy scout, of course, and hasn’t been. About the time I was there as the scoutmaster, James W. West, who was the scout commissioner of the Teton Peaks Council, and Reed Scott, and Harold Alford came out one evening and said come on we want to talk with you out in the car. They got me

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out in the car and talked with me and said how would you like to go into scouting professionally. I said I don’t know anything about it. Well, they said, we think you would make good. Well, I didn’t know. So we thought about it for some time. Eventually they persuaded me that I could go into scouting which I did. Of course, you had to attend the national training school for scout executives. In June, 1926, I left Lincoln and went back to New York City and there met James E. West and others and went to the national training school. This was the fourth national training school the Boy Scouts of America ever put on. Today they are up into the three hundreds, aren’t they Tom? Hatch: They have changed the numbering system. VS: They have changed the numbering system but it would be about three hundred groups that are presently in the training program. So you see, I was really what you would call one of the old timers. HF: Well then, did you become the executive of the council upon the completions of this training period? VS: Incidentally, while I was there, two or three things happened that were interesting. Then I’ll comment on your question, if that is alright with you. On the way back east I met a man on the train who was headed for the same place but we didn’t know it. He got on in Nebraska. No, I beg your pardon. He got on at Albany, New York, coming down the Hudson. We rode down the Hudson, he in one part of the car and I in the other. A couple of card sharks came by and wanted to involve us in cards cause they could see that we were green horns from the West, he being from the Mid-west and me from the far West. Eventually they discovered that we were both going to the same place because we talked and told them. So they got us together and when we got off in New York City, they helped us find a hotel. We went to the old Park Avenue Hotel and spent the night together. The next day we went to the home office and started out. It just so happened that when we graduated from high school in Davis County, I was in company with a young lady on a tour we took out to Bird Island out on the Great Salt Lake. That’s as far as my activities went mostly, just as a friendly gesture. It just so happened that this man had dated the same girl back in Nebraska after they had moved from Kaysville. It is such a small world when you realize that two men with no interest at all together had been brought together and that we both dated this one girl. I thought it was quite interesting. Then this national training school was held at Briar Fifth Manor new Austinae, New York. This was before they had the national training school buildings or anything like that. This was a swanky, rich mans country club. It still is. We lived in great style. We paid a meager amount of money to attend there and were fed at the same tables that the people were paying twenty-five times as much for the meals that we were. We had the very finest of service and being the first Mormon, the director and all the national people, I could see them looking out of the corner of their eyes at me all the time I was there. I was on trial for the Mormon Church. Fortunately I was rated one of the, I was

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second in the class. It made me feel very happy to represent the Church and be there first official representative. HF: Now, in going back to the question, after the completion of this training period, were you made the executive of the Teton Peaks Council? VS: No. Mr. Allred was the executive at that time. I came back and taught school until 1927. It just so happened that the regional executive of Region 11, of which we now are a part, didn’t have one particular feature on my application. That is that I was a member of the American Legion. One day he said I can’t seem to get you placed anywhere. I could have put you in Klammath, Oregon, but they wanted a member of the American Legion. I said I am a member of the American Legion. Why didn’t I get a chance? Oh, he said I didn’t know that. You are too young. I said, no, I was not too young. Well, he said that’s too bad. So in the spring of 1927 I got an invitation to go to Spokane to interview for a field executive job out of Spokane. I went to Spokane and was interviewed. They painted the picture as being kinda rough but I’d have to have a little stamina in order to take it. Especially weather wise, they said it gets down to twenty below zero around here. I said, well, if you haven’t been in Teton Basin when it’s fifty below, well, I have. So I got the job. The Boy Scouts of America decided that they were going to have all of the councils, all of the territory in America, under a first class council. You see, in the early days you could have a second class council. A second class council meant you could have a commissioner, a not salaried man, running the council. They came into Regions 11 and 12 and started organizing all of the territory into an area. For instance, the Teton Peaks Council was organized in Idaho Falls and it included the territory that it now has. Would you like me to describe that now? Back in 1924 they came to Idaho Falls and got them to organize. The Leaders of the Rotary Club in Idaho Falls was the group they worked with to organize from. They hired a man by the name of Harold S. Alford of Logan to come and be their scout executive. During the summer of 1924 and that fall he worked diligently trying to get things going. Our records, which we have returned from the national council through Tom Hatch shows that they had twenty troops registered at that time. The territories included Custer, Butte, and Lemhi Counties on the Northwest. Fremont, Madison, Jefferson, Bonneville, the north part of Bingham County that included the Shelley Stake of the LDS Church, Teton County, and later Teton County in Wyoming. This is the same territory that we have today. It will undoubtedly stay the same as it is natural that we should work as a group. This was organized and as I said, Harold Alford was hired. The charter was officially, according to the national publication called the “Scout Executive,” on the date of April 1925 reports that new councils and it lists Teton Peaks Council of Idaho Falls, Idaho. The charter was granted March 1925. Dr. James W. West had served as commissioner of the second council prior to this time. He

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also was the commissioner until his death October 11, 1946. Harold S. Alford was the first scout executive followed in February 1946 by myself. HF: Now the Teton Peaks Council as it was organized was in 1925, officially dated, was a first class council, was it? VS: That’s right. It had been a second class council prior to that. There was some, a scattering of scouting going on. Troops were in the LDS Church and Methodist Church had a troop before the council was officially organized. Each community had Troop 1, for instance, my certificate said Kaysville, Troop 1 and Lincoln, Troop 1. But when the council was organized here, all of these charters were changed, all of the communities were changed and their numbers were given to them. Apparently they took 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, to give to LDS troops even though they didn’t have that many wards. I don’t know just what they did. However, troop six was given to the Methodist Church, which they have. They are one of the oldest of the council. Troop 9 was given to the Presbyterian Church. Troop 11 to the Baptist Church. Troop 12 was given to Ammon. Troop 13, I forget just where that one went. 14 to Annis, 15 to Rigby, 16 to Ucon, 17 was Lincoln, of which I was the Scoutmaster, and 18 Lewisville, 19 Menan, and 20 was Osgood. Later 21 was Milo and 22 was Ririe. These were the first troops that were registered in the Teton Peaks Council and consequently have the oldest charters. HF: And those troops today still maintain that original number for that given area, I guess? VS: I think all of these do that I have just mentioned. I don’t know of any of them that don’t Troop 1, of course, disappointed because the ward dissolved and it was given to Troop 6. We held the others inviolate except Troop 11. They allowed their charter to collapse. In fact when I came here as the scout executive, there was only one non-LDS troop in existence, duly organized and registered. That was Troop 6 of the Methodist Church. Now other troops, one at Sugar City, well there was five of them that received special note. I have the material here but maybe we should not take the time to go through it. HF: That’s very interesting. By the way, do you know who and by what means the name of Teton Peak Council of the Boy Scouts of America was chosen? How did they determine that? VS: They, I read in the paper one day where any boy scout could submit a name to the committee that was going to select the name for this council, this new council. They were anxious to have all the names they could get from anybody. So, being a scout master, I thought, why don’t I put my name in along with the rest. I wrote a half dozen names on a post card and mailed it to the committee. The next day the announcement came out that a boy from Lincoln had nominated the name for the council. It turned out to be the scoutmaster. So I have the rare record of selecting the name for the council, Teton Peaks Council.

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I just discovered the names of theses troops who have the oldest charters in this council. I have before me a sheet of paper that says: April 17, 1946 Scout Troops win veteran charters. These scoutmasters representing troops in Teton Peaks council qualifying for the twenty-five year veteran troop charter received the awards from scout officials as follows. This, you see, was charters good back to 1921 or before. That’s before the council was organized so you see some of these maintained their memberships from then on. Scoutmaster Truman Chapman- Troop 15 Rigby 2nd Ward Rulon L. Simmons, Scoutmaster Troop 16 Ucon Ward Ray Jardine, Scoutmaster Troop 1 Idaho Falls 1st Ward Jack Taylor, Scoutmaster Troop 33 Shelley 1st Ward

Skip L. Eastberg, Scoutmaster Troop 6 Idaho Falls Methodist Church These were the oldest and still are the oldest in the council. Lincoln had one until they dropped it till I came there as scoutmaster in ’24. We have a young man in Ucon by the name of Alan L. Peterson, who told Mr. Alford that he was going to be the first Eagle Scout in the council. He worked hard at it. We had a life saving course given at the Idaho Falls High School swimming pool. This disappeared many years ago. In those days we had the swimming pool right inside the Idaho Falls High School. This course was put on. Unfortunately Alan wasn’t able to pass his life saving test. I was able to. The first Eagle Scout in the Council, therefore, was myself. HF: [this is the end of side one of the taped interview] VS: The 6th day of May 1925, hereby awards this certificate of an Eagle Scout to Vernon L. Strong of Lincoln, Stake of Idaho. This therefore is the first Eagle Scout and Alan Peterson became the second.

Now perhaps we’d better go back to Spokane and finish our story there. I went there on May 15, 1927, as the field scout executive out of Spokane. They had organized the territory around that city, about seven counties. I was hired as the field executive to take care of all the scouting outside of the city of Spokane. Unfortunately while they were organizing this territory out in the country they would get groups of men together and sell them on the idea of raising money. For instance, this city of Harrington was to raise $2500. They raised half of that amount of money and had it on the line and said it’s all ready, get your man. But by the time they had found someone to take the job, who was myself, these men had cooled off. When I went out there to see them the first time they said don’t come back. We don’t want you. We have decided that we don’t need to pay that much money for scouting and were not intending to pay any money to the Spokane Council for it. Course, the only thing I could do was to tell them that I was not there to collect money. I was there to serve them in scouting, which I did. Eventually they had a change of heart and before long they were some of my strongest supporters. It was very interesting to work with these people. I had lots of fine experiences. Every once in a

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while I see someone that has been a boy scout in the Spokane Council who remember that I was the field executive at that time.

I stayed there two years, a little better than two years. Then it looked like I was getting nowhere so I accepted a position as a teacher again in the Davis County School System. My old friend the superintendent of schools, Hubert Burton, invited me to come back and be the principal of the West Point Grade School. I ran it from the winter of 1929-1930.

C.J. Carlson, the regional executive of Region 12, and Oscar Kirkham got their heads together and decided that I should go back into scouting. Later they offered me the opportunity of going to Eureka, California, to be the scout executive there. When they offered me the position by wire, I immediately went to a geography book to see what part of the state of California Eureka was in. I located it up on the north end of the state, clear, as I began to wonder.

Well, I refused it two or three times and they still insisted so I said I’ll come down and look it over and if I like it I’ll stay and if I don’t I don’t want to stay. When I arrived in Eureka, California, June 1, 1930, I reported to Tom Hyne, T. W. Hyne, the council president of the Home Eureka Lumber Company. He was the manager of that, president. We had a very interesting conversation. Would you like to hear…? HF: Yes. I think this would be very interesting to our listeners, our readers. VS: Tom Hyne was an old salt, shall I say. He was a wonderful man, strong and sturdy as they come. This, of course, was the Redwood Area Council, the home of these huge giants of North America. Some of them tower as high as three hundred feet high and they’re thirty feet through. They’re tremendous. They’re much bigger than this room. You could have two rooms this size inside one of them and they’d still live. Of course, you who have been in the redwoods know that.

Tom Hyne was a real genuine man. He looked down at me, being just twenty-nine years of age, and he said, Mr. Strong, I like your looks. Course, that made me feel good. I kind of relaxed then. Apparently I was about a tense as you could be. He said, we have a problem here. The scout program is in ill repute. We need somebody who can make friends with the people. He says, I don’t, then he used the kind of language that a lumber man could use, which wasn’t too bad. He said I don’t care if you don’t know a tenderfoot scout from an Eagle Scout. We need somebody to make friends for scouting. Now he said, I know you’re a Mormon and I don’t want anybody else to know it. Because, he said, a few years ago they took two Mormon Missionaries out to the city limits and they said you fellows get going and don’t ever come back or we’ll do to you like we did to the Chinaman.

The story behind the Chinaman was, one day down on Front Street, and you know what a seaport town could be. On Front Street, one night there was some fighting went on and one of the loggers was killed. They blamed it on the Chinaman. So they went around

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town that night and said if there are any Chinamen left in town in the morning we’ll do you like we did to the Indians.

Well, the story of the Indians was that a good many years ago the Indians resented the white man coming in and actually they were pushed around a bit by these loggers and others. The white people didn’t like that and they said, all right, we’ll have a smoking of peace pipe. You Indians leave your war paraphernalia at home and we leave our guns on the main lands. We’ll go over to Gunther’s Island, which is an island out on Humboldt Bay just off Eureka a few miles, well about a mile or a mile and a half over to it. It isn’t very far. We’ll talk this out and have a final decision what we’ll do. Well, the Indians came out without their weapons and the white men came out and after they figured they had them all rounded up they pulled out their guns and started murdering, massacring these Indians. They shot a good many of them. A few of them jumped into the ocean, the bay.

Some of them drowned and some of them got to the shore. When they got to shore they told what had happened. Then there was trouble. Well, of course, to finish the story out. The white men sent back to Washington D. C. for help. They sent Captain Ulysses S. Grant out there to establish a fort, which was called Fort Humboldt. Later Ulysses S. Grant became the President of the United States. He was sent out there at the time, so you know how far back that would be.

Well this meant that I wouldn’t be very welcome if they found out that I was a Mormon. Now he said you go ahead. I said I am not ashamed of my religion. He said I am not either. That’s fine with me but these people won’t accept you if they know that you are a member of that church. So you make plans first and by the time they find out that you are a Mormon, they won’t care.

Well that’s about what happened. We went about our work and made friends with the people there. We stayed for six years until I received an invitation to come here as scout executive. HF: Well, now that invitation was what we’d like to have Tom read from some of the material there that you have gathered. So Tom Hatch will read this invitation. Tom Hatch: This is not necessarily an invitation but it does tell quite a little story here. In a letter dated February 11, 1936, from a Mr. Clifford Rasmussen, who indicates he is the chairman of the cubing of the Redwood Area Council in Eureka, written to the regional scout executive, C. J. Carlson in Los Angeles. It indicates that on February 5th, 1936, “A special meeting of the cub leaders association of the Redwood Area Council was held in the Marshal School for the express purpose of bidding farewell to our beloved scout executive, Vernon L. Strong, who has resigned to take a position as scout executive at Idaho Falls. Nineteen leaders were at the meeting and all expressed their regret on account of Mr. Strong’s leaving and many added words of praise to the wonderful work that he had done in this community. One leader expressed himself this way, ‘I have traveled in many states, Canada, and Mexico and I want to say that I have never met a

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better man than Vernon L. Strong.’ Another leader said, “A rock as strong as the Rock of Gibraltar is the strength of the character of Mr. Strong.’ Again it was said, ‘No man can fill the vacancy that Mr. Strong leaves. Not only as a scout executive but as a leader of men. One in whom all placed their utmost confidence. A man who has the best personality of any person who can hold this responsible position, whose good example of leadership, citizenship, sportsmanship, fellowship, and reverence has been a shining light for scouting in this community. He was a shining inspiration of scouting to all of us. For his personal understanding, in many cases, will never be forgotten by those who have been so counseled by his words of comfort and friendliness. We of this community will surely miss this great leader will surely miss this great leader and feel that Teton Peaks Council is to be congratulated on being so fortunate as getting so good a leader an such a wonderful man.’

“Mr. Strong was presented with a gift from the cub leaders from the president of the association in appreciation for his fine work in this council and was congratulated on being promoted to so large a council. This may be out of order, Mr. Carlson, but we feel that you should know what this group of leaders feel about Mr. Strong. We hate to lose this fine man. You should be proud to know that this man was a man to all of us. In regard to the cubing program would it be possible for me as chairman of cubing to write Mr. Strong in regard to the problems we will have here or any questions that may arise until we get another executive. I don’t like to take all the responsibility of cubing without taking up the matter with someone in authority. Respectfully yours, Clifford Rasmussen, Chairman of Cubing, Redwood Areas Council.” HF: Isn’t that marvelous. Wonderful. Hatch: There is another article here which was an editorial by the editor of the paper in Eureka. It says the following editorial was taken from a recent issue of the Humboldt Times published in Eureka, California. “In our opinion men like Mr. Strong are doing the greatest missionary work of all.” The article also makes a plea for tolerance as well worth considering. Then it quotes the article. “When I was a small boy in Kansas, Bill Hirsch was baiting the Mormons. Winifred Black, now the editor of the Examiner in San Francisco was writing the Mormons up as something terrible. It sold papers, I reckon. I heard tales about the Mormons and how they had a dozen wives all living in one big house and so many children you could not count them. I also heard how a Gentile could not make a living in a Mormon community as he would be boycotted. I heard what a terrible thing the Mormon religion was and so on and so on. Since those dear damn distracted days I have come in contact with a great number of Mormons. I want to say to you that I do not know of a more law abiding and generally moral people anywhere. They are kind and friendly and decent in every way. A fine example of the Mormons is to be found in Vernon Strong, the popular Boy Scout executive in Eureka. I have never known a finer chap anywhere. It is too bad we get such ideas about people of other faiths and races other than our own. Tolerance is a wonderful thing. It invariably follows understanding if original bias is not too great to be overcome.” I think that pretty much explains their feelings of Vernon Strong and the work he did there.

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HF: Well, Mr. Strong, Mr. Scouter, that’s wonderful, I think. Now if we might just continue the history of scouting as it developed under your leadership in the Teton Peaks Council of the Boy Scouts of America located with the headquarters at Idaho Falls, Idaho. VS: May I make one or two statements of things that were happening Eureka that I just happened to think of. As you recall, scouting was in ill repute when I went there. When I went to charge gasoline at one of the stations out by our scout camp, the man that ran the station said I can’t afford to lose any more money. He said, I’m not trusting you. I said, but I’m the scout executive. He said, yes, I know. That’s why I won’t trust you. Well, after a while I said ok, I’ll pay you for it. Finally he said, no, I want you to charge it. I said, no, I insist that I pay for this but I’ll be back. He said, no, I want you to keep coming. You charge it. Well, I don’t remember whether I paid for it at the time but I did pay for it later. This man wouldn’t even let his boy come across the river, just a quarter of a mile from where his station was, to the scout camp to be in camp because he didn’t like scouting. He was the man who hand carved an eagle size eagle out of wood, redwood wood, and gave it to me for the Knights of . . . chapter there because they are the Eagle Scouts of the Boy Scouts of America now. In those days we didn’t have the full support of the national council which we do have now for that.

Also you would be interested to know that the American Legion elected me as their Chaplain over a minister of one of the churches there who belonged to the American Legion. As the Chaplain, of course, I attended a many of the funerals of the veterans who died and their wives and I had a chance to make friends with lots of people. The YMCA director, who was very popular when I went there, the last year, about a year and two or three months before I left there, resigned his position. He said there was no use trying to run a YMCA program in this town when you have a boy scout program taking care of things as well as it is. The ministers, when I went there, were very much against me scouting. Finally, one of the ministers, Reverent Hudson, who had taken his training in England under Baden Powell, the founder of the boy scouts, was loyal to the scouting because of that. He had a troop. One day I said to Reverend Hudson, why is it the ministers are against me and scouting the way there are. He said I don’t know. I’ll find out. I said, all right I wish you would. We need to know what’s the trouble. Eventually I asked him, now what did you find out. He said, oh, I had an awful time. Those men are sore at you and everything. Why they don’t like scouting and you are a part of it. I said what’s the trouble? They said everything you do is on Sunday. I said, well, now wait a minute. Do you realize that while I have been here there is only one thing that I have done in scouting on Sunday. That was set up by the camping committee. He said they don’t mind that. But every weekend they read in the paper where the scouts meet Sunday morning at the wharf and we take them on a scout trip. I reminded him that the sponsoring institution had the scoutmaster. If the sponsoring institution didn’t want the scouts to go camping on Sunday, they were the ones to stop it with their own scoutmaster. He said that’s wonderful. When I left there, the ministers of Eureka had a unified service in which they gave me my final send off.

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Another interesting thing that happened when there I think you’d be interested in was the fact that since Mr. Hyne, the president of the council, belonged to the Rotary Club, he recommended my for membership. I joined the Rotary Club. The first meeting I went to I asked for a glass of milk. Out of the eighty or some odd men that were present it was the only glass of milk that was in the room. All the rest was coffee. For several weeks this happened. Eventually one of the men I was sitting by one day, one of the big magnates there, said, well, Vern I don’t know why I shouldn’t take a glass of milk when I was as bad as I do. This coffee that I drink every time that I come is not good for me and my ulcer, I need milk. I’m going to order milk today. So there were two glasses of milk that day. Incidentally, when I’d come to the door I’d see in the far distance the waitress holding a glass of milk. When I’d go and sit down she would come and put it by my plate. This was in the early days and later by the time I left there at least a third of the club was drinking milk. I thought you’d be interested in that.

Well, so we come back to Idaho, Falls. Here, we arrived in a terrific snowstorm on February 14, 1936, to take over the office of the scout executive, which Harold Alford had vacated in favor of going to Omaha, Nebraska, as their executive. They had a program for him at the tabernacle in Idaho Falls and I was introduced that evening.

About six years later Karl Mason, one the original group, confided in me one day as I went into his store. He said, Vernon, when you came here we gave you six months and we figured we’d need another scout executive. So he said, you’ve been here all this time and you’re good for a long time yet. Well, it took twenty-five years before they decided that they didn’t want me anymore. HF: What were some of the things you commenced doing upon your arrival, in other words, did you have a kind of a plan, a set of rules or policies that you wanted to introduce here in the council? Did you put those into effect? VS: I played it very carefully because I realized that you can’t come in and start throwing your weight around and change things too fast. Harold Alford was a good man and they liked him very much and my job was to find out what was going on and what I felt I could do to help promote scouting. The leaders at the time, leaders of the community, most of them members of the Rotary Club at that time. You’d be interested to know that Raymond H. Snyder, the superintendent of schools in Idaho Falls, was the president, the first president of the council in fact. Dr. J.W. West was the first commissioner, which I think we have already stated. Other members that were friends of mine when I first came that I met soon and were stalwarts in the program were D.F. Richards, the treasurer, R. McCutcheon, George M. Scott, and David Smith. Now David Smith became the president before I came there. Perhaps I made a mistake there. Raymond Snyder was the first president and David Smith was the president when they hired me as the scout executive.

One of the first things I remember Harold Alford telling me when he left, he said, Vernon the first thing I need to do for camping is to select a camp site and keep it. We’ve camped in Teton Canyon, we’ve camped in Palisades, we’ve camped up on the Forest

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Service in Island Park, and we’ve gone everywhere and nowhere. Now that’s the first thing you need to know.

So a committee was selected to find a suitable campsite for the council. We scoured the territory around about to select a camp. I think I have written down here some information that will help us on this. The council decided to select a permanent campsite. A special committee composed of D.W. Stowell, Rexburg, David Smith, Idaho Falls, E.M. Jorgensen, St. Anthony, B.L. Waldrom, Sugar City, W.L. Kilpack, Driggs, Frank Moss, Driggs, and the scout executive, myself were authorized to select a site.

Would you like me to go into this now? This is one of the highlights; at least I think it is. We went all over the council, especially the Tetons, and north and west. Smead’s Mill was looked at. The proposed Palisades Dam, no, what was the reservoir up here? Island Park reservoir. The cabin owned by . . . isn’t it strange when things will leave you like that. I know his name just as well as not. At any rate we went to these various places one day. The mosquitoes at Smead’s Mill were so thick that I even had to get in the car to keep from being ill. We went over to this Trude’s Ranch and then west over to Hagenbath Ranch was the name I was trying to think of. He had a very lonely cabin there it was situated on a cold spring and a hot spring within six inches of each other. There was a little pond and the men said this was the place that we want.

I couldn’t see it. I said gentlemen, this is not big enough. Why they said you can camp as many as you can get out to a scout camp. I said no, if you are thinking in terms of twenty-five and thirty boys which we’ve been getting, we have to look to the future. We’ve got to have a camp that will take care of hundreds of boys. Of course, some of them laughed at me but they didn’t select this site. Later on I said the thing we should do is decide what we want before we look for it. They agreed. They said well, you write up some specifications.

I wrote up the specifications. Frank Moss, the forest ranger on the Targhee Forest up east of Driggs in Teton Canyon and elsewhere had been trying to get them to go back to Teton Canyon. They had a bad experience there because some of the men had cut some green trees one time and the forest ranger had to get after them which he did. I persuaded these men to go up there. Frank said I’ll get the horses and we’ll cross the creek, which is high in June, and we’ll go up there and see what they got.

This committee decided they would go back again to Teton Canyon to look it over once more. This happened. We went across the stream in June when Teton Stake was having their outing. Perhaps you remember those good old days. We went across and saw this lake filled with silt and muck and mud up to within six inches of the top. It just looked like a terrible place. In fact it was. But this stuff was in solution so that you could put your hand in it and just go right through it easily. Then we went up on the hill where the Chief’s rock is now and it was hot that day. One of the men said let’s get out of here, there is nothing here. This is no place. I said, wait a minute. Let’s go back here and take another look at it. Reverend Hendrickson, I think of the Baptist Church, was with us. He came back to the rock with me. We climbed up on top of the rock and he said, gentlemen

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come on over here and see this. I said now this is an ideal place for a campfire program. You’ve got your podium up high enough that the person telling stories or leading anything can be heard or seen. You can have a thousand people here and they could all hear. Look at the backdrop. The Tetons standing behind the rock and one by one they broke down. Finally they all said well this is the place. So Teton Canyon was selected.

We first camped that season at the forks of the canyon, 1936. We went up to the forks of the canyon where the Federal Government campsite is now. We went up to the forks of the canyon where the Federal Government campsite is now. The next year was the Jamboree. We went back to the Jamboree and while there I was taken with a disease that plagued the Saints as they came across the Plains, cholera. I picked up a dose of cholera that started showing up just after we left Independence, Missouri. I was in very bad shape when I returned home. So the camping committee said we will not go up to Teton Canyon this year cause you are not there with them. If it’s going to fail it is going to fail under your leadership not somebody else. So they got Willard Adams and Rue Chandler of Rigby to run the camp that year up on the Madison in Yellowstone Park.

The third year we went back to Teton Canyon and camped on Papoose Campsite. It is a big opening there as you go up the canyon. The next year we started in real on the Treasure Mountain camp in the Tetons. Incidentally this was another case of where people were asked to submit names. Randall Anderson submitted Treasure Mountain. Jack Strong submitted Camp of the Tetons. The camping committee decided on Treasure Mountain, Camp of the Tetons as the official name.

The camp the year we were on the Papoose Creek, I had a program lined up that I thought would be helpful to the leaders. I suggested it to them. They said you’re not telling us what we can do in this camp. We’re up here to camp the way we want to. We’re not telling us what we ca do in this camp. We’re up here to camp the way we want to. We’re not going to be told by any scout executive what we can do or what we can’t do. I said well gentlemen, that’s alright with me. We don’t have anything to work with but I’ll use my car as my headquarters and if you need anything come and see me. I said you’ll be sorry though. Boys don’t go to camp without a program.

Well, at three o’clock in the afternoon, the very man that was the most anti-program led a delegation. They came to me and said, Mr. Strong, we are on our knees. We’ve got to have some help. The kids are fighting and they’re in trouble and we’re not getting anywhere. So I suggested what we could do as a group. We finished the year.

This led me to realize that you have to have a real program in order to entertain and have boys happy in scout camp or any other camp for that matter. So drawing back on my experience in Eureka again, Humboldt County, and the Redwood Area Council where I had organized an Indian lore program and the kids were really thrilled with it. I brought casts of their camp into a program where they really loved it.

I worked out a program of advancement in the Indian lore program. The first year a boy would come to camp he would be initiated as a purpose. On his own account,

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nobody would throw him in the water; he would go in the water and go under entirely in that cold stream. That would show that he had courage and obedience and willingness to want to do and become a man. He did certain things during that year to become a brave. This, of course, included scouting. He must become a second class scout which encouraged the scout program. He was given the privilege of hiking to Lightning Mountain and the Warrior Ridge, which is the place the boys all like to go sooner or later. Under leadership they could all have a good experience. They had to know fifteen different trees or willows of the type big enough to be called a tree possibly. And incidentally when I suggested this the scoutmaster when I presented it to them the first time, they said, you can’t find fifteen different trees, willows, brush, or anything else in this canyon. We made a challenge to the group and said, let’s get out and see how may we can find. It was surprising that the trees that they thought were all pine trees and quaken aspen trees turned out to be many other trees. In fact we had better than twenty-five different trees and shrubs that we could count on this fifteen requirement. We also felt that the boys aught to know something about the stars. So we insisted, suggested, that we have five different constellations that the boys should learn. Know where they were and could see them. It’s interesting that the ancients back thousands of years ago used to study the stars and know more about them that they average person does today by far. We picked out constellations which they could understand and see very readily. The Big Dipper, of course, the Little Dipper, Cassiopeia, the northern Crown, and two or three other different constellations. We added a few other things. I don’t recall them offhand which the boys became a Brave.

The second year when they came back to camp, if they had become a Brave the first year, then the worked on their Warrior. The Warrior was just an extension of the other. Instead of the trees, we put in the birds and the animals that crept into the camp. It is surprisingly how many different birds and animals we saw there. For instance, the Harlequin Duck, which is never found in this part of the country only very, very rarely was found there. The Canadian Goose, the Cross beaks that come into the Spokane area so much. You never see them here. One evening a flock of them came into camp just as we were taking the flag down in an evening. So we held up the flag ceremony long enough to show them what these birds were and the boys were thrilled to death. They had to become First Class Scout to become a Warrior. They hiked to the top of the altar or table rock as it is commonly known. Other things, five hours of service, building things.

Incidentally when we built that log cabin, the administration building, we didn’t have to hire a single log cut until we came to the putting on of the roof. We did hire a carpenter and his son to cut out the poles and put on the roof. The boys did the shingling. One day one of the boys was up on the roof shingling. He said, Mr. Strong, can I get my three years work done shingling here today. I said, no you can’t, somebody else has to have that privilege. Now your parents can’t imagine boys wanting to work that badly. But this boy wanted to put in all of his time right there. We had to get him off so that others could have the same privilege. Now this is the way the building was built from the digging of the trench, the cement, and the whole works. The chimney we had hired. I helped put the chimney in with the help of this man. We went out east of Victor and quarried the rock and brought it in and put the chimney up for the fireplace.

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The third year, of course, was when they qualified to become a Chief. This was

the ambition of every boy in camp and they came back year after year after year. Many six, seven, eight, and even up to twelve year campers because they wanted to come back and get their Chief and be a Chief in camp. This time they had to learn fifty different wild flowers. Well, nobody had even seen fifty wild flowers in the canyon until we started this program. But we have identified over two hundred species of flowers in the camp from the time we hike from where we are up to the alter and back. It is most interesting. Boys have bought bird books and flower books of this part of the country just so they could learn the flowers. They were therefore interested in the program. The hike that year is to the Golden Eagle Pass, and overnight hike where they take their pack and cook their meals and come back more or less as men instead of just boys.

Then at the ceremonies Saturday morning the head chief presents them with their signs, the flaming arrow for the Brave, the tomahawks for the Warrior, and the chief’s council fire for the Chief. We’ve had very many people come in who have been very interested in the program. We’ve provided Church dignitaries, Reverend Ulrich in camp, Father Labelle of the Catholic Church spent a week in camp with us.

Harold B. Lee, incidentally, one day I met him on the street in Salt Lake City just in front of the Church Office Building. He said, Brother Strong, do you remember what my Chief’s name is? I said, Brother Lee I gave thousands of chief’s names out and it would be very difficult for me to remember any one particular one unless there was some specific reason. He said but I want to know his name. I want to pass it on to my grandson. They were up to the camp that day. I said, well, it had to do with the stars. He said, yes it was a star. That strikes home. I said, it seems to me like it was a shooting star. He said, that’s what it was. Thank you very much for telling me what my chief’s name was. I won’t forget it now. Well, this is just one of the interesting experiences of how important this name has been to a Church leader, scoutmasters, and boys. Everywhere I go this same statement, do you remember when I got my chief, and so on.

Well, so we selected this campsite and we got the program in there which was bringing boys back, as I said, many years at a time. Those same now are anxious to have their boys go up to Boy Scout camp and have the thrills they had as boys. HF: Now the time is moving along on us and I want to ask you two or three more questions at least before we do finish. Do you recall some of the names that should be mentioned in connection with scouting in the council during the years that you have been involved as the executive of the council? VS: Do you mean people’s names? HF: People’s names and the parts somewhat they played in scouting in the various districts within the council?

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VS: This would be dangerous for me to single out people because if I mention your name and I don’t mention someone else’s name he’ll say why didn’t he remember me. I hope no one will be upset if I do mention a few names. One of them, of course, was Dr. J.W. West. He was a big brother to me all the way through. Naturally as long as he lived, I leaned on him a great deal for leadership.

E.M Jorgenson of St. Anthony was a very strong man whom I admired very much. He was the district chairman of the Fremont District and later the president of the Council.

Clarence Murdock was a strong leader in Teton Valley. Incidentally, when I say that it reminds me of the fact that when I came here as the executive there were only fifteen hundred and seventeen scouts. The reason I remember that so well was the fact that the Flying Squadron of the Church came from Salt Lake City to give us a pep talk here in Rexburg and it just so happened there were the same number present that night at the meeting, 1517, as they had when I started the council here. Fifteen hundred and seventeen boys and sixty-seven troops. Of course, it grew from that to thousands and more than three hundred troops, packs, and posts, under my leadership or while I was the scout executive shall I say. HF: What percentage would that be of all the available boys of that age did you have participating in scouting? VS: It’s interesting here, I have a statement here. The LDS Church adopted Cub Scouting in 1953. The National Council in 1960, I had this written up in the 1960, is endeavoring to reach twenty-five percent of the available boys. In 1960 they were reaching twenty-three and two tenths percent. The Mormon Church now reaches more than sixty percent of its boys. That year the Teton Peaks Council, according to the annual report of the Boy Scouts of America, was reaching seventy-two and seven tenths percent of all the boys in this council area. We led the nation for several years. There was no Council in the Nation that had more boys available registered than the Teton Peaks Council. We’ve always been, since I came here, in the top six in the nation. This is one of the things that the National Council is very conscious of is the percentage of boys that are enrolled.

I might state that since we are here in Rexburg, that Ricks College honored me back in 1967 as one of the honored alumni of Ricks College. Incidentally, I graduated from here in 1924, summer of ’24, and came through with the Class of 1925 as one of the graduates. Incidentally, the last year I was here in summer school I was elected student body president. So I had a lot of fun here. HF: Well that is wonderful. Well, now pursuing names and impressions just a little bit further, would you like to comment on some other names maybe in Rexburg, Rigby, Idaho Falls, any other names come to mind? I agree with you that it is inappropriate to mention names because invariably one leaves out a name that should have been mentioned.

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VS: These are not the most important men necessarily because I just on the spur of the moment, I don’t have this written down and I am hesitant to even say. D.W. Stowell was a very fine friend here. Earnest Blaser, I just daren’t say. Steve Meikle became the president of the Council. Of course, I leaned on him a good deal while he was president.

In Rigby, Rue Chandler and Willard Adams seemed to be prominent. (?) Johnson went with me to the National Jamboree in ’37. When I sold him on the scout camp he bought the Rigby group along and they were good supporters of the camp from then on. HF: Let’s see then, how many years did you serve as the executive of the Council? VS: I served as the Scout Executive until 1961 and then Larry Barrett, who had been former assistant executive of mine was brought in as the scout executive and I was given the title of Scout Executive Emeritus. On June 19th, 1965, I retired from the scout program after serving twenty-nine years in this council, six years in California, and two in Spokane. HF: Do you recall some outstanding Jamboree’s that you were involved, in which you were involved? VS: Yes, the first one, of course, was from Eureka, California. We went on the trip even though it was canceled. We were ready to leave so the National Council let us go. I took the boys from there along the California train. The reason I mention this was the fact that James (the tape fades here and can’t be heard) they were all just like they came out of the band box. Just perfect in decorum and appearance. They were just dressed alike and everything was just perfect. They selected us to go down to the wharf to meet the president of the Boy Scouts of American, Walter Head, who was just returning from Sweden where they had, had a big meeting. We went down there met the boat and took some pictures of us. Some of my prize possessions now were the pictures that were taken.

Incidentally, the photographer who came to write up the story said, we don’t want pictures of the boys. It would take too long to get them together. I whistled and put my hand up parallel and the boys formed a line before this fellow realized what was happening. He said, well anybody that can do that, I will take their picture. So he got President Head and J. W. West.