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IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF OHIO COUNTY WEST VIRGINIA
DAVID L. DELK,
Plaintiff,
vs. CIVIL ACTION NO.
15-C-196
OHIO COUNTY BOARD OF
EDUCATION, a Political
Subdivision,
Defendants.
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DEPOSITION of SUE ELLEN McGUIER
Monday, September 14, 21!
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The deposition of SUE ELLEN McGUIER, calledfor examination by the Plaintiff, taken pursuant to
Notice and the West Virginia Rules of Civil Procedure
pertaining to the taking of depositions, before me,
the undersigned, Victoria J. Bostic, Registered
Professional Reporter-Notary Public, in and for the
State of West Virginia, held at the offices of Grove
& Delk, 44 1/2 Fifteenth Street, Wheeling, West
Virginia 26003 at approximately 10:00 a.m. on the day
and above set forth.
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APPEARANCES:
On Behalf of the Plaintiff:
David L. Delk, Jr., Esquire
GROVE & DELK, PLLC44 1/2 Fifteenth Street
Wheeling, West Virginia 26003
On Behalf of the Defendant:
Patrick S. Casey, Esquire
CASEY & CHAPMAN, P.L.L.C.
1140 Chapline Street
Wheeling, West Virginia 26003
Also present: Dianna Vargo
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I-N-D-E-X
WITNESS EXAMINED BY PAGE
SUE ELLEN McGUIER Mr. Delk 3
E-X-H-I-B-I-T-S
Deposition Exhibit No.:
1. Plaintiff's Notice of Rule 30(b)(7)
Deposition of Defendant 5
2. 4-7-15 letter from Mr. Delk to Dr. Vargo 8
3. Individual Student Report, test scores 21
4. 5-1-15 letter from Mr. Casey to Mr. Delk 50
5. Excerpt - Online Test Administration Manual 59
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P R O C E E D I N G S
(10:00 a.m.)
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SUE ELLEN McGUIER
a witness herein, called for examination by the
plaintiff, having been first duly sworn, as
hereinafter certified, was deposed and said as
follows:
EXAMINATION
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Would you state your full name for the
record, please.
A. Sue Ellen McGuier.
Q. Where do you reside?
A. I reside at 108 Fernwood Avenue, in Wheeling,
West Virginia.
Q. And who is your employer?
A. Ohio County Schools.
Q. How long have you been with Ohio County
Schools?
A. Since 1986.
Q. What's your current position with Ohio County
Schools?
A. I'm am the director of assessment and federal
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programs.
Q. How long have you been in that position?
A. This is my eighth year in that position.
Q. When you started with Ohio County Schools, in
1986, what did you start out as?
A. I started as an English teacher at Bridge
Street then-junior high.
Q. How long were you at Bridge Street as a
teacher?
A. Five years.
Q. Until 1993; does that sound right?
A. Uh-huh.
Q. What was your next position?
A. English teacher at Wheeling Park High School.
Q. How long were you at Wheeling Park?
A. Until I came to the board office eight years
ago.
Q. Teacher at Wheeling Park the whole time?
A. Yes.
Q. Describe for me what your role is as the
director of assessment and federal programs for Ohio
County Schools?
A. My responsibilities include making sure that
Ohio County Schools follows the West Virginia
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management of academic performance plan.
Q. That's it?
A. Related to assessment. In addition, I have
responsibilities with federal programs.
Q. What responsibilities do you have with regard
to federal programs?
A. Overseeing the Title I and Title II programs
as they relate to schoolwide improvement efforts and
to improving teacher learning and teacher quality for
Title II.
(Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit No. 1
marked for purposes of identification.)
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Hand you what's been marked as Exhibit 1,
which is plaintiff's Notice of Rule 30(b)(7)
Deposition of Defendant.
Have you seen this document?
A. Yes, I have.
Q. And are you the designee of Ohio County
Schools today for the topics that are listed on this
notice of deposition?
A. Yes, I am.
Q. And you're prepared to address all 13 of
those topics?
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A. Yes, I am, to the best of my abilities and my
knowledge.
Q. Okay. What did you do to prepare for this
deposition?
A. Met with Mr. Casey and essentially reviewed
some of my documentation.
Q. What documents did you review?
A. Policy 2340 from the West Virginia Department
of Education.
Q. Do you have that with you now?
A. I do.
Q. May I see that?
A. Uh-huh.
MR. CASEY: Wait a second. Is that
marked? Are these your notations?
A. Those are my notations.
MR. CASEY: Do you have a copy, or do
you need to see hers, or do you --
MR. DELK: Yeah, I want to see, just
make sure we're on the same page.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. These highlighted portions are stuff that you
highlighted?
A. Yes.
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Q. Highlighted in preparation for the
deposition?
A. To some degree. Some highlighting is there
because they are points of emphasis when I did
training.
Q. This was your copy that you also used for
training purposes?
A. Yeah.
Q. I understand.
I think I asked you this, but you reviewed
this in preparation for the deposition?
A. Yes.
Q. Any other documents that you reviewed?
A. The other document that I brought was the
current document, the parents' guide and so forth
that were presented to parents in the schools.
MR. CASEY: His question was: What else
did you review, and you told him what you brought.
Does that answer the question? Don't know if
that addressed the question.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Did you review that in preparation for the
deposition?
A. Yes, sir.
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Q. Can I see that document?
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. I think I've seen it before, but --
A. Thank you.
Q. Did you review any other documents in
preparation for the deposition?
A. I did not.
Q. Other than Mr. Casey, did you meet or have
any communications with anyone to prepare for the
deposition?
A. I did not.
Q. When you met with Mr. Casey, was there anyone
there other than attorneys?
A. Dr. Vargo was present.
Q. Okay.
(Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit No. 2
marked for purposes of identification.)
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Handed you the April 7, 2015 Freedom of
Information Act request that I sent to Ohio County
Schools.
Have you see that before?
A. I did see it in Dr. Vargo's office.
Q. When? At the time -- around --
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A. At the time we received it.
Q. Did you review that document in preparation
for the deposition?
A. Yes.
Q. Okay. When did you review it in preparation
for the deposition?
A. Oh, I did not. I'm sorry. Did not review
this in preparation for the deposition.
Q. Okay. Going back to the notice of
deposition, the first topic, I asked for, "The
position of the Ohio County Board of Education/Ohio
County Schools as to whether the West Virginia
General Summative Assessment administered to third
graders constitutes a licensing examination,
examination for employment or academic examination
pursuant to Section 29B-1-4(a)(3)," and I have some
questions about that.
Now, you're aware, in the FOIA request I
made, I requested a copy of the assessment tests
given to third graders in Ohio County Schools?
You're you aware of that, correct?
A. Yes, I am aware of that.
Q. And are you aware that the response of Ohio
County Schools to this litigation was that the
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assessment was subject to an exemption under the West
Virginia Freedom of Information Act?
Were you aware that?
A. Yes.
Q. And my question to you is: Is the position
of Ohio County Schools that the assessment is a
licensing examination?
A. I would ask you to clarify your question,
please.
Q. What part of my question did you not
understand?
A. In regards to the licensing examination.
Q. Okay. What about licensing examination do
you not understand?
A. Is your question that Ohio County holds the
license for the examination?
Q. No. That helps me.
A. Okay.
Q. One of the exemptions under the Freedom of
Information Act is that a public body does not have
to produce a licensing examination.
And is it the position of Ohio County Schools
that the assessment provided to its students
constitutes a licensing examination?
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A. Then I would say yes. I -- I'm really very
unclear of what you're asking here.
MR. CASEY: Let me object to the extent
that this may call for legal conclusions as the
terms may be defined.
It's not Ohio County School's position it's a
license examination.
MR. DELK: Okay.
MR. CASEY: Is an academic examination.
MR. DELK: That's what I thought. I
just wanted to nail it down.
THE WITNESS: Okay.
MR. DELK: I don't have to ask her any
more questions if that's what it is.
THE WITNESS: Okay.
MR. CASEY: Okay.
THE WITNESS: Thank you.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. With respect, Ms. McGuier, to academic
examination, what is the position of Ohio County
Schools as to what constitutes an academic
examination?
MR. CASEY: I'm going to object only to
the extent it may call for a legal conclusion,
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assuming interpretation of statute.
But you can answer as a witness.
A. An academic examination -- and I'm going to
refer to West Virginia Department of Ed Policy 2340,
where they clearly defined those measures, provided
through the West Virginia Department of Education,
that each county in the state would then implement.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. What portion of Title 126 are you referring
to?
A. They spell out the West Virginia General
Summative Assessment, NAEP, ACT PLAN and EXPLORE.
Q. What page are you referring to?
A. Actually, just kind of --
Q. Okay.
A. West Virginia Summative Assessment is defined
on page 7, 3.61, 3.60. I had forgotten West Virginia
Department of Ed Alternative Summative Assessment;
and then there are references in the document to ACT
COMPASS, ACT EXPLORE, ACT PLAN and NAEP.
Q. And ACT COMPASS, ACT EXPLORE, ACT NAEP, those
aren't part of Summative Assessment, correct?
A. They are not.
Q. I'm talking about the -- my question was:
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What is the position of Ohio County Schools as to
what an academic examination is?
A. And we would follow the guidance provided by
the West Virginia Department of Education.
Q. Where in this Title 126 is an academic
examination defined?
A. I would have to refer you, again, to page 7
under 3.61 where it says, "WVDE General Summative
Assessment. A customized test consisting of selected
criterion-referenced response items used to measure a
student's level of achievement of the West Virginia
CSOs in mathematics, English Language Arts, social
studies and science in grades 3-11."
Q. I'm sorry. Did you say "3.61"?
A. Uh-huh. On page 7, near the bottom.
Q. On page 8 on mine. That's okay.
A. Okay.
MR. CASEY: When you're answering, use
yes or no, as opposed to --
THE WITNESS: I'm sorry.
MR. CASEY: That's okay.
THE WITNESS: Okay. Thank you.
MR. CASEY: That's all right.
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BY MR. DELK:
Q. And in 3.61, the term "academic examination"
is not used, correct?
A. It is not, sir.
Q. Is the position of Ohio County Schools that
the -- only the West Virginia General Summative
Assessment is an academic examination?
MR. CASEY: I object to the form.
You can go ahead and answer.
A. No.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. All right. What else is an exempt academic
examination, then?
A. It would be the use of the other assessments.
Q. The assessments listed in Title 126?
A. Yes. In addition to -- I'm afraid that I
cannot clearly provide an answer to that question
without reference to policies, and we may or may not
be using the term "academic assessment," sir.
Q. I haven't used the term "academic
assessment."
A. Oh, okay.
Q. Well, I've used the term "academic
examination," because that's what the statute --
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A. Okay.
Q. So when you say "we may not be using the term
academic assessment" or "academic examination," what
are you talking about?
A. We use the term, in Ohio County Schools, "a
balance of assessment data"; in that we would use
multiple measures to determine what is it that a
child knows and is able to do. So some are
formative, some are summative, some are interim, some
are benchmark assessments.
Q. Well, my question is: You know, the statute
allows me to collect public records, but it doesn't
allow me to collect an academic examination?
A. Uh-huh.
Q. I want to know what the definition of an
academic examination is in Ohio County Schools such
that I'm not permitted to, under the theory of Ohio
County Schools, to get this test?
A. Then we would call this an academic
examination.
Q. Why? Just because you call it that, doesn't
mean it is. Why?
A. As defined by Policy 2340, content of secured
test may not be shared.
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MR. CASEY: I think his question was
just simply: Why are you calling it an academic
examination?
BY MR. DELK:
Q. We're going to get the security.
A. Okay.
Q. Trust me.
A. Okay.
Q. We're going to get there.
A. Okay. Okay.
MR. CASEY: He just wants to know why
you consider this an academic examination -- why
Ohio County Schools considers it an academic
examination. That's his question. All right?
BY MR. DELK:
Q. That's my question.
MR. CASEY: That's right.
A. Because, in essence, it's one of the West
Virginia measures of academic progress.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Would I be correct in saying that Ohio County
Schools considers any assessment that measures
academic progress to be an academic examination?
A. Could you rephrase again?
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MR. DELK: What was the question?
(Whereupon, reporter read record as requested.)
A. I'm concerned about the word "any" because of
the wide variety of instruments that could be used.
So I would be hesitant to say yes to that, sir.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. So what would be the criteria or traits of an
assessment that measures academic progress that would
qualify it as an academic examination?
Since you don't like the term "any," describe
for me what traits or qualities of such an assessment
would have to have to be considered an academic
examination.
A. It would be my understanding that everything
delineated in Policy 2340 would be an academic
examination.
Items that we would use for interim
assessments would be considered academic assessments.
Even some teacher-developed academic assessments
would not be subject to review if they were developed
collaboratively.
Q. And correct me if I'm wrong -- and I just
want to make sure we're on the same page -- you refer
to this as Policy 2340?
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A. Right. Right.
Q. Just want to make sure we're talking the same
thing.
A. Uh-huh.
If you see --
Q. Right. I see it.
A. West Virginia Measures of Academic Progress.
2340 in parenthesis.
Q. So Policy 2340 was, you know, authored, put
together by the West Virginia Department of
Education; am I right about that?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Pursuant to legislative authority from the --
you know, our legislature, correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. So any test assessment mentioned, discussed
in Policy 2340, Ohio County Schools would consider
that an academic examination?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Now talk specifically, for a second, about
the West Virginia assessment provided to third
graders in Ohio County Schools. Okay?
A. Uh-huh.
Q. Is that a yes or a no?
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MR. CASEY: You have to say "yes."
A. Yes, sir. I'm sorry.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. That's all right. That's all right.
MR. CASEY: Vickie is taking it down
word-for-word, and she has trouble interpreting the
uh-huhs and the huh-uhs.
A. Okay.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Is it a fair statement that the teachers in
Ohio County Schools, the third grade teachers, had no
idea what the test questions were on the assessment
provided to third graders?
A. Yes, sir, that would be fair.
Q. And fair to say the third grade teachers in
Ohio County Schools were not involved with creating
or designing the assessment?
A. Yes, sir, they were not involved in creating
the assessment.
Q. Is it fair to say that the assessment
provided to third graders was 100 percent designed by
a outside, third-party testing company?
A. I would have to say that I would be
speculating in answering that question because I do
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know that there were curriculum experts from various
states who collaborated with the vendor. So I would
be unable to answer that. It would be speculation.
Q. Okay. Well, to the extent that there was a
West Virginia curriculum expert collaborating with
the vendor, the testing company still was the one
that prepared and created the test?
A. Yes, sir. With collaboration from the
various, at least my understanding is, from the
department of educations in the states in the
consortium.
Q. Okay. Do you know what states are in the
consortium that West Virginia is a part of?
A. I do not, sir.
Q. And the consortium that West Virginia is part
of is the Smarter Balanced Assessment Consortium; is
that correct?
A. Yes, it is, sir.
Q. When I use the term "Smarter Balanced," you
know what I'm referring to?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. It's true that there would be subjects or
topics on the tests provided to third graders -- the
assessment provided to third graders that were not
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covered by teachers in Ohio County Schools?
A. By way of clarification, each state has its
standards and objectives. And it is true that the
content the teacher may select to deliver, that
content standard or objective, may be different than
what's on the assessment; however, it's still tied to
the knowledge and skills, what kids need to know and
be able to do.
Q. I appreciate that. But the content on the
test may not correlate with the content that the
third grade teachers provided to the students in its
entirety.
There may be some gaps between the test and
what happened in the classroom; is that fair?
A. Yes, that would be fair to say.
(Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit No. 3
marked for purposes of identification.)
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Handing you what's been marked as Exhibit 3,
which is just a sample of a student's test scores.
MR. CASEY: Do you want any of this
redacted?
MR. DELK: No.
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BY MR. DELK:
Q. The first page is the English language arts
literacy for third graders, correct?
A. Yes, sir, it is.
Q. Does this report tell me what specific test
questions were asked of this student?
A. No, sir, it does not.
Q. Does this report indicate how many or what
questions were missed by the student?
A. No, sir, it does not.
Q. Does the report provide any indication that
this student had trouble with any specific area
tested?
A. No, sir, it does not.
Q. Is there any way for a parent to find out
what specific areas of the test that the student may
have had trouble with on the assessment?
A. No, sir, it does not indicate that.
Q. I'm asking you: Beyond what's on that page,
is there any way for a parent to find out what
specific subject matter or area that was tested that
the student may have had trouble with?
A. No, sir.
This report shows that this child was above
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standard -- using the "Legend: Claims Performance
Levels" here at the top, in reading, listening and
speaking, writing and research and inquiry.
Q. I understand that.
A. Uh-huh.
Q. But is there any way for a parent to find out
what subject matters a child may have had an issue
with on a -- not this one in particular, but say a
student got a one or a two on there.
Is there any way for a parent to find out
what specific subject matters that their child may
have had an issue with on this particular test?
A. Specifically, no.
Q. Yes. Thank you.
Does this report here indicate in any way
what reading level the child was tested on, as far as
reading passages provided on the test?
A. The report shows Level 4 performance here;
that the student has exceeded the achievement
standard and demonstrates advanced progress toward
mastery of knowledge and skills in English language
arts and literacy.
Q. I understand that.
A. Uh-huh.
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Q. But it was a computer-adaptive test, correct?
A. It was, sir.
Q. And tell me if I'm wrong, but I assume that
means if a child is answering questions correctly,
those questions are going to get progressively more
difficult?
A. Yes. That is the basic design of
computer-adaptive tests.
Q. If the child is missing a question or misses
questions, that it -- the way it adapts, it changes
to make the test, I guess, less rigorous, or less
hard, for lack of a better term; is that correct?
A. In general, that describes the
computer-adaptive nature of the test.
Q. Do you know, for example, in the English
language arts test that if a child is performing well
on -- for reading comprehension, do the reading
passages get progressively harder?
A. I'm unable to answer that question.
Q. You don't know?
A. I do not know. I have not been involved in
the selection of passages.
Q. Is there any way for a parent to know what
the grade level reading questions were, what -- as
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far as a specific reading comprehension or reading
passage, what grade level that the kid was ultimately
reading on the test?
A. The answer to that would be no, sir.
Q. Okay. Now, on this report, does it indicate
what subject matters in English language arts were
actually tested?
A. The areas of the four claims here of reading,
listening and speaking, writing, research and inquiry
were the claims that were combined for the overall
score.
Q. And do we have any idea, for example, what
specific kind of grammar questions were on the test,
if any?
A. No, sir, we do not.
Q. How would we find that out? If a parent
wanted to know, like, what grammar was tested on this
assessment, how would a parent find that out?
A. The student report is all that is provided to
the parents.
Q. So the answer would be: The parent can't
find that out?
A. Exactly, sir.
Q. Are there ever -- are the schools provided
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with any kind of report data showing how the child
answered on specific questions?
A. They are not, sir.
Q. They are not.
And if I am correct, on the WESTEST, the
report was provided showing how a student did on test
questions, whether they got it right or got it wrong?
A. Yes, that is true. There was an item
analysis provided for each item in the old WESTEST.
Q. And my understanding is, on these English
language art assessment, and even in third grade,
there was a writing assessment; is that correct?
A. It was embedded into the process as part of
the performance task.
Q. And who sees that writing assessment?
A. Would you clarify?
Q. Sure.
The student keyboards in the --
A. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
Q. -- whatever they're writing?
A. Uh-huh.
Q. Yes?
A. Yes, they do.
Q. And who actually sees that?
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A. Would you clarify?
Q. Sure.
Does anyone in Ohio County Schools get to see
what the student wrote?
A. No one in Ohio County Schools would see that.
Q. Anybody at the West Virginia Department of
Education get to see that?
A. No one at the West Virginia Department of
Education would see that.
Q. That goes off to whoever grades the test?
A. The vendor, it is my understanding, has
trained scores, so they would be the only folks, to
my knowledge, that would see that.
Q. And who is the vendor for this test?
A. American Institutes for Research, AIR.
Q. And do you have an understanding how those
people who read the assessments are trained?
A. I do not, sir.
Q. Do you have any idea what their background
is?
A. I do not, sir.
Q. Do you have any idea what their level of
education is?
A. I do not, sir.
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Q. Do you know whether it's a part-time or
temporary job?
A. I have no idea, sir.
Q. Do you have any idea what the job pays?
A. I have no idea, sir.
Q. Does Ohio County Schools have any indication
or knowledge what level of performance is required to
hit the various cut levels on the assessment?
A. Ohio County Schools has no knowledge of that.
Q. Does the West Virginia Department of
Education have that information, to your knowledge?
A. I would say they probably do not.
This report uses a scale score, and the scale
scores would be a conversion of the student's raw
score to a common scale. So they may or may not
know, and I would be reluctant to answer on behalf of
the department of ed.
Q. Ohio County Schools doesn't know the raw
score?
A. We do not.
Q. The parents are not provided the raw score?
A. No.
Q. I mean, it's fair to say whatever scale score
the student receives on this test, we have no idea to
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know whether that means they answered 25 percent
right or 99 percent right?
A. You're right, sir.
Q. Thank you.
Turn to the next page of Exhibit 3.
This is the math portion, correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Again, this report doesn't tell a parent what
specific test questions were asked of the student,
correct?
A. It does not, sir.
Q. And it in no way indicates how many -- how
many or what questions were missed by the student,
correct?
A. No indication, sir.
Q. Is there any indication provided as to
whether a student had trouble with a particular
mathematical concept?
A. Not according to this report.
Q. Are Ohio County Schools provided with any
additional information about the student's test
result other than this report?
A. We are not, sir.
Q. Ohio County Schools is not provided with any
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indication of how many questions a student got right
or missed?
A. We have no knowledge of that.
Q. All right. So if a teacher has told me that
they're waiting for additional information about test
responses, that teacher was just incorrect?
A. I would say that that teacher was incorrect
and perhaps thinking about what we've had for several
years with WESTEST, in that we did have specifically
question by question, concept by concept.
Q. Okay. That's what I'm --
A. Uh-huh.
Q. -- getting at.
A. Uh-huh.
Q. So on this West Virginia Summative
Assessment, a parent will not know concept by concept
what was tested and how their child did on the test?
A. No, sir.
Q. Is there any way for Ohio County Schools to
know what portion, percentage of the test, for
example, was addition, subtraction, multiplication,
division, anything like that?
A. No, sir.
Q. We don't know if the child had one question
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on multiplication or 50 questions; is that correct?
A. We have no way of knowing, sir.
Q. Do you we know, for example, with the third
grade test, what specific mathematical concepts were
tested?
A. We have no way of knowing what was on the
test.
Q. And the same for the report on the English
language arts, is there any way to know -- does Ohio
County Schools know, in any way, what performance by
the student is necessary to reach Level 1, 2, 3 or 4?
A. No, sir.
Q. And a raw score, again, is converted to the
scale score, correct?
A. Exactly.
Q. And we don't know what the raw score is for
the students?
A. We have no idea.
Q. Now, of the scale -- these scale scores and
the cut lines for this report, is that the same for
each state that is a part of the consortium, or does
that change from state to state?
A. I would be unable to answer for all of the
states. It's my understanding that West Virginia is
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using the cut scores provided by Smarter Balance. So
I wouldn't even begin to answer for the other states.
Q. I appreciate that.
A. Uh-huh.
Q. But to your knowledge -- your knowledge is
that the West Virginia Department of Education is not
setting the cut line; that's coming from Smarter
Balance?
A. That would be my understanding.
Q. Okay. In general, what is Ohio County
Schools going to do with the results of the
assessment? How does Ohio County Schools use the
results?
A. I made reference before about using a balance
of assessment data, so this would be one piece of
assessment data.
We would also use data from Pearson
SuccessNet math. We would use data from the DIBELS
assessment. We would use information from aimsweb.
We would use information from classroom teacher
assessment data so -- and probably others that I've
forgotten about at this moment, to try to get a true
handle on where a child is in his or her learning.
So we use a multitude of data sources.
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Q. So a portion of what -- Ohio County Schools
uses this test, to some level of degree, to determine
how a child is doing in their grade level; is that
fair, summarizing what you just said?
If not, do a better job for me.
A. I think what it does is presents Ohio County
Schools with a picture of where the child is in
relationship to the standards at that particular
grade level, but bear in mind, it's only one piece of
the entire picture of a child's learning.
We know, after years in education, that not
every child performs well on an assessment like the
West Virginia General Summative Assessment, so we
like to look at other data sources --
Q. Sure.
A. -- as well.
Q. How does Ohio County Schools use that
information it receives from the testing company or
the Department of Education for an individual
student?
A. Again, it gives us a piece of the picture of
the child's entire learning.
Q. And is that the same response for how a
teacher would use the test result?
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A. Absolutely.
Q. It's just a piece of a bigger puzzle?
A. Absolutely.
Q. Does the West Virginia Summative Assessment,
the report that's provided -- just for clarification,
the only information you have on an individual
student about the assessment results are provided on
those two pages?
A. Absolutely.
Q. That's it?
A. That's it.
Q. That's the full range of -- everything we
know is on those two pages?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Thank you.
Does those two pages provide any specific
instruction for what a student needs to improve on in
either math or English language arts?
A. The results provided here do not clearly
indicate any specific content standards and
objectives, as I look at this report.
However, as a classroom teacher, it would
tell me when I have a student who's fairly high
functioning. I would then use other data sources to
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see if I could identify specific content areas which
this child might need.
Q. Okay. I mean, is it fair to say, then, that
the individual student report, as far as the
summative assessment goes, really just provides a big
picture of whether the student is meeting standards,
above standard, below standard?
A. That's very fair to say.
Q. Okay. I know you have Policy 2340 in front
you. We don't need to make this an exhibit, but I
want to give you my copy just so we're talking about
the same page --
A. Okay.
Q. -- if that's fine?
A. That's perfectly fine.
Q. I didn't tell you this when we started, but
if, at any time, you need to take a break, just let
me know.
A. Thank you.
Q. All right. If you could turn to page 24 of
the document I provided to you, and it's Appendix B.
Appendix B is the District Test Coordinator's
Secure Materials and Test Procedures Agreement.
Do you see that?
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A. I do, sir.
Q. In Ohio County Schools, who is the district
test coordinator?
A. I am, sir.
Q. You. Okay.
And did you have to sign this document or a
document like this?
A. I actually sign this document and submit it
to the West Virginia Department of Education at the
beginning of each school year. Then prior to
implementing any assessment in the West Virginia
measures of academic progress, I am required to
attend training in Charleston, and then I re-sign
that I have had specific training for each of those
assessments.
So I sign this document multiple times during
the school year.
Q. This exact same document?
A. This exact same document.
Q. And a signed copy exists of this document?
A. It would be with -- be held at the West
Virginia Department of Education.
Q. Okay. Is there a copy -- a signed copy in
Ohio County Schools anywhere?
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A. I am required, at the conclusion of my
training, to give them my copy.
Q. So you don't have a copy?
A. I do not have a copy of this. I submit it to
the West Virginia Department of Education.
Q. If you could turn to page 26.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. That is Appendix C. Do you see that?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. It says, "District Technology Coordinator
Secure Materials Test Procedures Agreement."
A. Uh-huh.
Q. In Ohio County Schools, who is the district
technology coordinator?
A. The district technology coordinator is
Mr. Patrick Riddle.
Q. It says "or a technology vendor."
Is that a different person in Ohio County
Schools?
A. We do not have a technology vendor.
Q. Okay. Mr. Riddle would have had to sign this
document?
A. Yes, he does.
Q. And does Ohio County Schools have a copy of
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that signed document, or is that provided to the
state as well?
A. I do have a copy of his signed document.
Q. That's on file?
A. It is on file.
Q. All right. And unless I'm wrong, that was
not produced in response to the FOIA request, do you
know?
A. To the best of my knowledge, because of our
number of documents, I would say that it was not.
Q. If we could turn to page 28.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. This says, Principal's -- it's Appendix D.
"Principal's Secure Materials and Testing Procedures
Agreement," correct?
A. Correct.
Q. And every principal in Ohio County Schools
would have signed this document?
A. Absolutely.
Q. And do you have a copy of the signed
documents for each of the principals?
A. I have copies.
Q. Unless I'm missing something, that was not
produced pursuant to the FOIA request?
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A. It was not.
Q. Is there a reason why it was not produced?
A. Other than the fact that I have it on file
and locked away, no.
Q. Okay. Turn to page 30. Appendix E, Building
Level Coordinator's Secure Materials and Testing
Procedures Agreement.
Do you see that?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Okay. Who at Ohio County Schools -- or who
are the building level coordinators?
A. Principals select key staff within their
building to serve in this capacity. So it varies by
school.
Q. Gotcha.
And do you have a copy of the signed
agreements for the building level coordinators?
A. I do, sir.
Q. And is it one per school or would it be more?
A. It's one per school.
Q. And again, was there a reason why the signed
copies of this agreement weren't provided?
A. No. I just -- I had them locked away.
Q. Page 32, Appendix F.
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MR. CASEY: I'm going to object. By
asking why they weren't produced, I'm not conceding
that they were encompassed, but she can tell you why
she didn't do it.
MR. DELK: That's fine.
MR. CASEY: Okay. Go ahead.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Page 32, Examiner's/Scribe's Secure Materials
Agreement.
Do you see that?
A. I do, sir.
Q. Who are the examiners or scribes in Ohio
County Schools?
A. Those are the teachers who would be in the
examination -- in the testing centers with the
students.
These are signed and kept on file in each
school.
Q. In each school?
A. In each school.
Q. Would it be fair to say in the elementary
schools every third, fourth and fifth grade teacher
would have signed this agreement?
A. Yes, sir, I think that would be fair to say.
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Q. And would it be fair to say in middle schools
all the English and math teachers would have signed
the agreement?
A. The principals determined which teachers in
the building would serve as examiners.
Q. Okay.
A. But in general, most of them use the English
teachers and the math teachers.
Q. Same for the high school?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Okay. And I know some grades had to take a
science test.
A. Uh-huh.
Q. Would the science teacher have signed that?
A. Yes.
Q. I don't think -- last year, there was no
social studies test, or was there?
A. No social studies testing last year.
Q. Again, I think you just answered this.
Going back to page 32, the
examiner's/scribe's agreement, those would be
exclusively teachers who would have signed this one?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Again, Ohio County Schools did not provide a
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copy of the signed agreements by the teachers
pursuant to the FOIA request, correct?
A. No. They are in the individual schools, sir.
Q. Okay. Are you familiar with the contents of
each of these agreements that we just talked about?
A. Yes, I am.
Q. And I let -- unless I read it wrong, I think
the first paragraph -- numbered paragraph in each
was, "I will not keep, copy, reproduce, paraphrase,
distribute or review/discuss secure test materials
and/or test items"?
A. Yes.
Q. And I think that applied to every single one
of the agreements?
A. Absolutely.
Q. And specifically, as this applied to
teachers, teachers were not allowed to look at the
test questions, correct?
A. No, they are not, sir.
Q. Teachers were not allowed to review the test
in any way before or after the test, correct?
A. No, sir.
Q. Teachers were not allowed to discuss the test
with other teachers or educators, correct?
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A. They were not, sir.
Q. Is it fair to say that there was no peer
review at all conducted by any Ohio County educator
with respect to these assessments?
MR. CASEY: I object to the form.
You can go ahead and answer. If you know
what's meant by the word "peer review," go ahead and
answer.
A. Our teachers did not review the materials.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Okay. And just by way of example, if -- you
know, on any of -- let's say the third grade
assessment.
Let's say that, you know, there was a portion
of the assessment that had -- I'm just going to make
up something -- had Roman Numerals on it, and for
whatever reason, the third grade -- that last year,
Roman Numerals didn't get covered, and the kids
obviously probably wouldn't have done very well.
There's no way for the teachers to be able to
tell parents, Well, you know, part of the test was a
subject matter we did not cover?
A. There would be no way for teachers to know
that.
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Q. And if the reading passages at any grade
level, if a teacher considered it, you know, two or
three grade levels above what they were doing
throughout the year, there would be no way for a
teacher to know that?
A. Teachers would not know that.
Q. Do you know if the testing company was the
entity that required this agreement to be signed as
part of the contract?
A. This was the West Virginia Department of
Education, and we've had these similar agreements in
effect for years.
Q. For years?
A. For years.
Q. Do you know if the testing company requires
this sort of agreement?
A. I have no knowledge about what the testing
require -- the testing vendor would require.
Q. You just know that the department of
education requires these agreements to be signed?
A. Yes.
Q. What is the penalty on an employee or teacher
if they breach this agreement?
A. If I may --
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Q. Sure.
A. -- let me go back to page 25, and I think
this -- the statement is similar in all of the
agreements.
Number 13 says, "I understand that if a
breach of test security or copyright infringement
occurs as a direct result of my actions, my
license/certification may be suspended or revoked, or
I may be suspended, terminated, or have other action
taken."
Q. So potentially, any effort by a teacher to
try to assist a parent as to what specifically a kid
may not have done well on the assessment could be
violation of the agreement?
MR. CASEY: I object to the form.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. To find out what was on the test could be a
violation of the agreement?
MR. CASEY: I object to the form.
You can answer, if you know.
A. This score implementation of the testing --
the teachers could use this document, if we had a
minus here or the little exclamation point, triangle,
and say "Your child" and could give some general
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information to parents, based upon this report only.
MR. CASEY: You're referring to
Exhibit 3?
A. Exhibit 3, uh-huh.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. But for example, if -- you know, if a parent
came to the teacher and said, Well, mine got one of
these --
A. Uh-huh.
Q. -- you know, below standard, the caution
sign, exclamation point.
A. Uh-huh.
Q. And said, you know, What can you tell me that
they had a problem with?
A. Uh-huh.
Q. And if the teacher did anything to try to go
back and review the test or look up the test, that
would be a violation of the agreement?
A. It would be, but the teachers don't have the
ability to go look at the test items.
Q. When the test was being administered, a
teacher could have looked at the test, but it would
have been a violation of the agreement?
A. It would have been a violation.
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Q. On the paragraph you read, paragraph 13, it
says, "I understand that if a breach of test security
or copyright infringement occurs."
Who has the copyright on the assessment, do
you know?
A. I do not know that, sir.
Q. Do you know if it's the testing company or
the department of education?
A. I do not. I'm unable to answer that
question.
Q. All right. Is it fair to say that no student
in West Virginia is required to take the assessment,
the West Virginia General Summative Assessment?
A. It would be fair to say that no student is
required to take the test.
Q. A parent can opt their child out?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And there's no consequences to the student if
the test is not taken; is that correct?
A. No, sir.
Q. Am I correct?
A. You are correct.
Q. Thank you.
And for example, my third grader, she would
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move on to fourth grade --
A. Yes, she would.
Q. -- regardless of whether she took that test
or not?
A. Yes, she would.
Q. Is it fair to say nothing about the test
result would change the educational instruction
provided to my child?
MR. CASEY: I'm going to object to the
form.
You mean if she didn't take it?
MR. DELK: Right, if she didn't take it.
MR. CASEY: Okay.
A. Oh, no, sir. We would just look at the other
data that we received and go to those multiple
sources again.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. If my child takes the test, regardless of the
result of the test, how would the educational
instruction provided to my child potentially change,
or would it change?
A. In Ohio County Schools, we like to
personalize the education for each child.
So that if I were to look at the results here
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on Exhibit 3, I can tell in English language arts I
have a very high performing child within my
classroom. I would still do my core instruction for
new skills.
And then using formative assessment data, any
other data saying maybe she's ready to be enriched,
and then, depending upon the result here, maybe I
need to think, Is there an opportunity for me to
reteach?
So it's only, again, one piece of information
that we use in the teaching and learning process.
Q. I mean, is it fair to say that the result on
the assessment test for a third grader, any third
grader, would not be determinative at all on whether
they moved on to fourth grade?
A. It would be fair to say that, sir.
Q. When did Ohio County Schools receive the
individual test scores for the students?
A. They became available, and I don't know the
exact date, at about the end of July, and were
provided to my principals as soon as I could get all
of the district results printed.
Q. And they were provided, I guess, to
principals, then, before the school year began?
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A. At about the beginning of the school year.
Q. Do you know, if you know, whether the
curriculum in any individual classrooms or grades
changed as a result of the test scores?
A. The curriculum is still tied to the West
Virginia Next Generation Content Standards and
Objectives, so there would have been no revision of
the curriculum.
Q. So regardless of what the test scores were,
there would be no revision to the curriculum?
A. No. The curriculum would stand as it is.
(Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit No. 4
marked for purposes of identification.)
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Handed you what's been marked as Exhibit 4,
which is a May 1, 2015 letter from Mr. Casey to me in
response to the April 7th FOIA request.
Have you seen this letter before?
A. Have I seen this letter?
Q. Yes, ma'am.
A. No, sir.
Q. If you look at the April 7th letter from me,
you see that Number 4 is, "Provide a copy of the West
Virginia General Summative Assessment administered to
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third graders in Ohio County Schools."
Do you see that?
A. I see that.
Q. And then at Number 4 of Mr. Casey's letter,
it says, "OCS," which is Ohio County Schools, "does
not have access to this information."
Do you see that?
A. I do.
Q. You understand that a copy of the assessment
provided to third graders was asked for by me?
A. I understand that, sir.
Q. Do you know who in Ohio County Schools
provided the information to Mr. Casey that Ohio
County Schools does not have access to the tests?
MR. CASEY: I'm going to object to the
extent it invades the attorney-client privilege.
MR. DELK: Are you instructing her not
to answer?
MR. CASEY: Well, I need more detail as
to when you say "who" and --
BY MR. DELK:
Q. My question is -- this is the response of
Ohio County Schools to the FOIA request, and it
indicates that Ohio County Schools does not have
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access to the information.
And I want to know who in Ohio County Schools
would have provided this information to Dr. Vargo or
to Mr. Casey to come up with this response?
MR. CASEY: Let me -- if I can rephrase?
MR. DELK: Sure.
MR. CASEY: If you ask her, Who within
the Ohio County Schools made the determination --
MR. DELK: That's good. That's a better
question.
MR. CASEY: -- I'll go with that.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Who in Ohio County Schools made the
determination that it did not have access to the
assessment provided to third graders?
A. I provided the information to Dr. Vargo.
Q. Okay.
A. Uh-huh.
Q. Then, are you the one who made the
determination that Ohio County Schools does not have
access to the third grade assessment?
A. Yes, I would be the individual.
Q. Okay. Why did Ohio County Schools say it did
not have access to the third grade assessment?
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A. Access to the third grade assessment was
provided only to students.
Q. On a computer, correct?
A. Correct.
Q. Would you agree with me that the time period
that this request was made and Mr. Casey's response
was the time period that assessments were being
provided to students in Ohio County Schools?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And let me ask you this, if you know: For
example, now if a student, for whatever reason,
needed to take the third grade assessment, could that
student now take it?
Would there be a way to access it and allow
the student to take it?
A. No, sir.
Q. That window is closed?
A. Correct.
Q. There's nothing Ohio County Schools could do
to get on a computer and pull up the assessment and
allow a student to take it?
A. That is correct, sir.
Q. Who controls that, I guess, portal, for lack
of a better word? The testing company or the
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department of education?
A. To the best of my knowledge, the West
Virginia Department of Education works
collaboratively with AIR, and they determine the
opening date and the closing date.
Q. When was the closing date?
A. In Ohio County Schools?
Q. Yes.
A. June 5th, the last day of school.
Q. Now, it's true Ohio County Schools could have
printed a hard copy of the test third graders was
taken, correct?
A. No, we could not.
Q. You're familiar with the print-on-demand
function of the test?
A. I am, sir.
Q. And why could that not have been printed?
A. The print-on-demand function is an
accommodation provided to students with an IEP, and
in Ohio County, we had absolutely zero students who
have that accommodation.
Q. IEP stands for?
A. Individualized Educational Plan.
Q. So not a single student in Ohio County
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Schools needed an IEP -- or had an IEP?
MR. CASEY: I object to the form. I
don't think that's what she said.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Well, what did you say?
A. It's an accommodation provided in an
individualized educational plan, and we have no
students with that accommodation.
Q. Well, regardless of whether a student had
that accommodation, you had the ability to use the
print-on-demand function to print out a copy of the
test?
A. I did not, sir.
Q. Why?
A. The test is delivered by way of a secure
browser. Once the child logs in to that secure
browser, it disables all other functions, except
those needed to answer questions. So it would have
been impossible to print any piece of the test.
Q. Why is that?
A. Because of -- the secure browser disables all
the other functions of the computer.
Q. Could not take a screenshot of each screen?
A. No, sir.
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Q. You could not log in under the -- in any way
to access print on demand?
A. No, sir.
Q. How would you log in to access print on
demand for a student?
A. If a student has that accommodation, the
information is uploaded from the West Virginia
Department of Education to the vendor, which then
allows that function to occur; but again, we had no
students in Ohio County who had that accommodation.
Q. I mean, you could have created -- if you had
wanted to, you could have create a student just --
A. No, sir.
Q. -- to get in there and log in --
MR. CASEY: Wait for him to finish his
question.
A. Sorry.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. In theory, could you have created login
information for a John Doe student to access print on
demand?
A. No, sir.
Q. Why not?
A. All of our students are entered into the West
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Virginia Educational Information System, and we can
not, quote, create students.
Q. Okay.
A. I apologize for jump --
Q. That's all right.
A. I was just a little startled by that
hypothetical.
MR. CASEY: That's okay. You need a
break?
THE WITNESS: Yes, please.
(Brief Break)
BY MR. DELK:
Q. The testing procedure for students -- and
let's stick with third graders since that was my
request.
The third graders in each individual
elementary school, I guess, are in the testing room,
taking this test?
A. Yes.
Q. And the testing room, I guess, is where the
computers are in each school?
A. It varied by school.
Q. Were computers brought in for the test,
specifically, or did you just -- did Ohio County
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Schools just use what computers were at the school
already?
A. We used what computers were at the school,
yes.
Q. And would the students log in individually,
or would they be provided assistance with doing that?
A. Students logged in individually.
Q. And when a student logged in, that test was
on the terminal, computer, that they were working on,
correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. I probably need to ask this of Mr. Riddle
rather than you, but to the extent you know, was
there a server in Ohio County Schools that the test
came through and was distributed out to the schools,
or do you know how that worked?
A. I do know that. The test did not reside on
any server in Ohio County Schools. Students logged
in using their WVEIS student numbers and their first
names, and then my understanding is it -- that in
secure browser, it went directly to the vendor.
Q. Went directly to the vendor?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Not at the West Virginia Department of
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Education at all?
A. No, sir.
Q. So as far as you know, no government entity
in the state of West Virginia had access to the test?
A. That is correct, to the best of my knowledge.
(Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit No. 5
marked for purposes of identification.)
BY MR. DELK:
Q. Let me hand you Exhibit 5, which are just
documents that were part of what was produced by Ohio
County Schools pursuant to my FOIA request, that I've
highlighted some portions.
If you could turn to the next to the last
page, and then I'll ask you about -- I highlighted
the part at the bottom.
A. Are we referring to page 461 or --
Q. Yes, 461. Yes.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. And the question at the bottom says, "Will
printed versions of the WV GSA be available to
students? I have a 504 student who is unable to read
technology displays/use a computer due to an eye
disease. Could she use print on demand?"
And just so I have an understanding, if you
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know, what's a 504 student?
A. We have individualized educational plans for
students with special needs. A 504 plan generally is
comparable to an IEP plan, and generally they are
provided for students who have medical needs or some
kind of specialized need.
So again, just like an IEP, it's a legally
enforceable document.
Q. Okay.
A. So that's what a 504 is.
Q. If you could turn to the next page, 462. And
at the top left, it says, "Print on demand is an
option if the student has P40 as an identified
accommodation. Additionally, a LP book may be
ordered for the student."
What's a P40, if you know?
A. It would be an accommodation.
Q. Is it a specific kind of accommodation?
A. Yes, it would be.
Q. What -- I mean --
A. Off the top my head --
Q. Okay.
A. -- I can't speak to that.
Q. What's an LP book? A large-print book?
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A. It would be a large-print book.
Q. Did Ohio County Schools order or have any
large-print books?
A. Ohio County Schools had no large-print books.
We have no students with that need.
Q. Okay. Is it your testimony that if a student
had any issue in the testing room during the test
that there was no way to print out any of the test
questions during the test?
A. That is absolutely correct. We had -- we did
not have the capacity to print anything from the
test.
Q. Is it your testimony all other functions on
that individual computer were basically disabled
during the test?
A. Yes, sir. Except for the ones needed to --
the mouse clicks and so forth -- to perform the task
necessary to answer the question.
Q. Okay. I want to go through with you the
documents that were produced pursuant to the FOIA
request. I'm going to hand you this copy.
MR. CASEY: Are you making this an
exhibit?
MR. DELK: No.
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BY MR. DELK:
Q. If could you turn to page 4, and I've
numbered these on the bottom right, for the most
part.
This document indicates there is one
attachment to it on page 4 towards the top.
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What's the attachment, do you know?
A. The department of ed did -- and that would
have been the online link for it, their webinar, so
that, literally, I could have clicked, looked at
their PowerPoint presentation as they talked and
listened to it on the telephone.
Q. Okay. That's something that could have been
printed out?
A. I would be hesitant to say that it would be
readily available.
Q. That's what I'm asking.
A. Yeah.
Q. Okay. Turn to page 6.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. Is that the same type of --
A. It's a similar --
Q. -- document?
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A. It's similar.
MR. CASEY: Let him finish.
A. Okay. Thank you.
MR. CASEY: Go ahead.
BY MR. DELK:
Q. That's the same sort of PowerPoint that you'd
be hesitant to say whether you could print that out?
A. Exactly.
Q. Okay. Turn to page 19.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. Same question. Is that a PowerPoint
presentation that you're referring to?
A. Same thing.
Q. If you could turn to page 45.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. The attachment on this e-mail indicates it's
a PDF; is that correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And that could have been printed out if it
wasn't --
A. It could have been. It's publicly available
at the department of ed.
Q. But it was part of this e-mail, or document,
as well, correct?
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A. Yes.
Q. Any reason why it wasn't produced?
A. No, sir.
Q. Turn to page 50.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. What is this document? Is it an e-mail or
something you receive from the department of
education? If so, how do you receive it?
A. This was information about -- from the West
Virginia assessment portal.
Q. Uh-huh.
A. That is available for anybody who clicked in
to look at it.
Q. People who have access to it?
A. Yes.
Q. Not any member of the public, but someone in
the school systems, I take it; is that correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And this has a PDF attachment to it, Test
Delivery System User Guide?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. That would be a public record?
A. To the best of my knowledge, it would be.
Q. Next page.
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A. (Witness complies.)
Q. PDF, TIDE User Guide?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What is that?
A. It's another component of the West Virginia
assessment portal.
Q. And this PDF was attached to this document or
communication you received?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. That would be a public record as well?
A. To the best of my knowledge, yes.
Q. Next page, page 52.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. PDF, Teacher Hand Scoring System User Guide.
Do you see that?
A. Yes.
Q. That would be a public record as well?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Next page, page 53.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. It doesn't say here. This Online Reporting
System User Guide, was that a PDF or --
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Would that be a public record?
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A. To the best of my knowledge, yes.
Q. Page 54.
A. (Witness complies.)
Q. System Requirements, that's a PDF as well,
correct?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Do you know what that document was?
A. It had the technical specifications, which
Mr. Riddle would have used to install the secure
browser, was my understanding.
Q. That would provide information about what the
secure browser is?
A. The installation process, yes.
Q. Potentially information about the
print-on-demand function?
A. I would be reluctant to say if that
information was considered in there.
Q. But it's part of the technological
information that Mr. Riddle would have been provided
about the secure browser?
A. Yes. Yes, sir.
Q. Potentially talking about what you can and
cannot access?
A. Uh-huh.
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Q. Is that -- and if you don't know, just tell
me you don't know.
A. I seriously -- I don't know. I believe it
was the installation of the secure browser.
Q. And that's a public document?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Page 55, User Role PDF.
What is that document?
A. That document specifies the role of the
district test coordinator, the school coordinator,
the test examiners.
Q. Public document?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Page 56, Technical Specification Manual.
Was that a PDF?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What was that document?
A. Again, it related to Mr. Riddle's work in the
installation of the secure browser.
Q. That would have specific technical
information about the browser and how the test is
provided from the company, potentially?
A. Potentially about the installation, right.
Q. And that's a public document?
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