BUSINESS ENTERPRISE PROGRAM of OREGONBECC SPECIAL MEETING (continuation of 11/05/2016 meeting)

Tuesday, November 15, 2016, at 3:30 PM

OREGON COMMISSION FOR THE BLIND535 SE 12th Avenue (Portland office)

Conference line: 404-443-6397Participant code: 943611#

AGENDA

Any of the agenda items below, may become an action item.

1. CALL TO ORDER - Chair Mirandaa. Roll call

2. PUBLIC COMMENTS - 3 minutes per person, 1 time per person

3. OLD BUSINESSa. Elected committee advocacy on complaintsb. Access to program-relevant informationc. Sub-contracting/teaming partner issued. Award of vending machine procurement

4. OTHER5. DIRECTOR’S COMMENTS6. NEXT MEETING7. ADJOURNMENT

VERBATIM

[Started at 00:03:03]

Miranda: Okay, you guys, it’s 3:30 pm so we’ll call the meeting to order. And any of the agenda items below, may become an action item. Okay, we’ll start with roll call, with the Elected Committee. Harold Young?

Young: Here.

Miranda: Tessa Brown. [Silence] Tessa Brown. [Silence] Steve Gordon.

Gordon: Here.

Miranda: Jerry Bird. [Silence] Jerry Bird? [Silence] Derrick Stevenson.

StevensonD: Here.

Miranda: Uh, Tessa or Jerry? [Silence] Okay, and Lewanda’s here, so we have a quorum. And we’ll go to the membership. Art Stevenson.

StevensonA: Here.

Miranda: And Cathy Dominique?

Colley-Dominique: Here.

Miranda: Char Mckinzie.

Hawkins: Here.

Miranda: Carole Kinney.

Kinney: Here.

Miranda: Gordon Smith. [Silence] Gordon Smith? [Silence] Harold Young… oh, I already did you, Harold. I gotta get used to this new way of doing this, you guys. Lin Jaynes?

Jaynes: Present.

Miranda: Randy Hauth?

Hauth: Here.

Miranda: Steve Jackson.

Jackson: Steve Jackson’s here.

Miranda: Salvador Barraza. [Silence] Okay, and, um, from the agency?

Morris: Eric’s here.

Miranda: Visitors?

Edwards: James Edwards.

Miranda: Hi, James. Any other…

StevensonD: Did you get Cathy Dominique?

Miranda: …visitors? Who’s that?

StevensonD: Did you say Cathy Dominique? Because I didn’t hear her.

Miranda: I believe I did. Cathy Dominique?

Colley-Dominique: Yeah, I’m here.

Miranda: Okay.

StevensonD: There she is!

Bird: Jerry Bird’s here.

Miranda: Okay, good, Jerry. Any other visitors? [Silence] Okay, hearing none…

Haseman: Linda Haseman.

Miranda: Okay, Linda. Any other visitors? [Silence] Okay, hearing none, we’ll move on. Who just joined us?

Smith: Gordo.

Miranda: Oh, hi, Gordo. Okay. 2. Public Comments: three minutes per person, one per time. Do we have any, um, public comments?

Gordon: Yes, I do, speaker… Miranda.

Miranda: Okay, Steve.

Gordon: You know, for a long time we used to have the meetings for open public towards the end of the meeting after we’ve already gone through most of the different agenda. It’s really hard to remember three months back, or whenever our last BECC meeting was, except when we bring up old business and new business and it’s hard to recollect. And I think… and I actually would motion to the Board to change that back how we used to have it, backwards… towards the end where public comments can be publicly spoken at a better time and have their three or five minutes. And so…

Miranda: Okay. All right.

Gordon: Would [Inaudible] like to put that up for a proposal? As an amendment? On the Board?

Miranda: Uh, yeah, can we do that under “other?”

Gordon: We sure can.

Miranda: Okay. All right. We’ll do that.

Gordon: [Inaudible] you.

Miranda: Any other public comments?

Hauth: Yeah, Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Randy?

Hauth: Yeah, hi everybody. You know, I have a couple of suggestions, comments and also a question wrapped in there. The suggestion is, you know, as far as the In-service trainings, I think we’ve had Terry Smith here the last three years or four years and, really, I think his presentations are kind of dated and kind of, actually, worn out. We can get… and even though the information he provides is very important, we can get that information from the blitz, right? So, I… I just want to suggest that maybe we start looking at bringing in some new, fresh presenters and speakers. And also, let’s look again at having our In-services at places that are more pleasant to be around. Not that the Commission isn’t pleasant, but let’s just consider that. I don’t really understand the thought of having the In-services always at the Commission, or most always at the Commission. If it’s saving money… I don’t think that really saves a lot of money. The other thing is, I sent a couple of emails out about, you know, the Portland State Office Building and the serving line being down for months and months and I’ve sent two requests for answers from Eric and I have not received a response yet. So, if Eric could share with us what’s going on with that serving line and the hours change on the espresso and the café. Because, as most of you

know, I… I’ve managed that location for six years and the serving line’s extremely important. So, how Carole’s getting by right now, I don’t know. But… last but not least, I do want to share that I was really offended that Dacia Johnson during our last meeting would call our Elected Committee, um, “courageous,” who… those who volunteered. I believe it was, at least in my opinion, a very manipulative and belittling…. Obviously, everybody has stated we were not in support of ending subcontracting. I don’t know how the BECC ended up volunteering, but I just was really taken back that she would kind of, um… throw that out… out there and it just didn’t… didn’t sit very well with me and I just wanted to share that. Thank you very much.

Miranda: Okay, Randy. And the PSOB… we’ll do that under “other,” okay? So we can stick with the agenda. We can have Eric comment on that then.

Hauth: Sure. You bet.

Miranda: Okay. Any other public comments?

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Art?

StevensonA: Okay, first thing I want to say today is I’m hearing some positive things from people I know across the country and they’re excited about some new Board members and the possibilities of some good things happening. And then, Chair Miranda, I want to thank you for trying very hard to work with the SLA, with Eric and Dacia, in trying to handle this subcontracting fiasco. You have been placed in an unfortunate situation by Eric Morris and Dacia Johnson that has been very difficult. You attempted to have good-faith negotiations with the agency and they refused to have good-faith negotiations with you. And I am very sorry that you had to go through that and be put in a difficult situation. I think we’re going to make some real, positive changes here in the near future and I do believe that, from now on, there’s going to be good-faith negotiations, not “my way or the highway” garbage. And so I realize, Chair Miranda, you’ve tried to do the best that you could do but the agency has not cooperated with you at all and been fair and equitable. And… and therefore, I want… I wanted to publicly state that because you’ve been treated unfairly, you’ve been treated like a second-class citizen, all by the agency. And you didn’t deserve that garbage. Thank you very much.

Miranda: Okay, thank you, Art. Any other public comments?

Young: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Harold.

Young: Yes, I’d like to say that it has been a pretty tough row to hoe and, you know, I’m proud of your efforts, Lewanda. I’m excited, believe it or not, to have the new Board members on board. I look forward to working with them. I’m going to do a much better job, Art, to reach out to you and advocate more for you. The thing is, I think most everybody will agree, you’re a pretty good self-… you do a pretty good job by yourself advocating and advocating for the program. And so, anyway, I just… I look forward to it all and I do have to say that I have on more than one occasion called up Eric and voiced my concerns about working closer with the Elected Committee on some of the decisions that were being made, some of the new locations we acquired, that the Elected Committee needs to know more about that stuff. So, the communications, if we’re going to make it really work, there’s a lot of work that needs to be done there too. Thank you.

Bird: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Thank you, Harold. Yes, Jerry?

Bird: Yeah, I wasn’t gonna say anything but, jeez, you know, I’m a proud little papa right now. I gotta tell you. I’m getting cold chills… hearing you guys just say what you guys said. It um… it… I don’t know, I just feel it’s a good beginning that we all can kind of get together now and… and with a purpose, understanding that the SLA does have a place and… and we ought to all understand, you know, our do’s and don’ts. But, just… we… most of us has been in this program a long darn time and… and a lot… most of us has… has struggled through the years at different times and it’s just nice to be able to know that your fellow manager is there to back you up and to… to, you know, not give you a handout but a hand up. And I just appreciate what you guys just said. Thank you.

Miranda: Thank you, Jerry. Any other public comments? [Silence] Any other public comments? [Silence] Okay, hearing none…

Jackson: Can I say something, Chair Miranda? It’s Steve Jackson.

Miranda: Oh, sure, Steve.

Jackson: Just quickly, I’d just like to say that…

Brown: Sorry, everybody. I’m late.

Jackson: … I have nothing against…

Miranda: Okay. Hi, Tessa.

Jackson: I’d just like to say that I don’t have any grudges against anybody. I just think we all, um, just come together as a team, you know, and do the right thing. And I’m ready to help in any way I can. Thanks.

Miranda: Thank you, Steve. Any other public comments?

Brown: Sorry about that. I was having problems.

Miranda: Okay. Any other public comments? [Silence]

Bird: I’m sorry. I pushed the… disconnect button I got. So.

Miranda: Oh.

Bird: But I’m back now. Thanks.

[00:16:26]

Miranda: All right.

StevensonA: Are you blind or something?

[Laughter]

Bird: [Inaudible] motions, man.

Miranda: Okay, hearing no more public comments, we’ll move on to… wait a minute… Old Business. So this is a continuation of our November 5th meeting. And A. is Elected Committee advocacy on complaints. So, uh… let’s see. Well, we’ve had a lot of complaints about the advocacy and, as Harold just stated, that he would step up and try to be better at that and I agree that I will, too. I know that we don’t always, you know, agree on

everything but when it’s all said and done we still have to look out for the betterment of our fellow managers. And so I agree to do that, too. And so I’m opening it up for anyone else that has anything to say.

StevensonD: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Derrick?

StevensonD: Yeah, I just… I just want to kind of explain what… what I feel. Or where I feel the Board has let us down in the past and it’s not… not… I don’t want anyone to take it wrong but… Miss Johnson is a piece of work and she’ll do…

Smith: Derrick. Derrick, this is Gordon. What did you say when you first started out there?

StevensonD: Uh, which part?

Miranda: He said that he didn’t want anyone to take this wrong.

StevensonD: Yeah.

Miranda: But then he wanted to discuss Miss Johnson.

Bird: Let’s try to be respectful, please.

StevensonD: Yeah. Miss Johnson has continually gone out of her way to stall and to do everything she can to not… not hold, um… administrative reviews in a timely manner. I mean, one complaint that we filed took over a year to get an administrative review and that kind of stuff, you know, should be addressed by… by the Committee because, you know, she’ll do the same thing if we ever have to file another complaint. And the same goes for the current complaint on… on teaming partners and… and stuff, you know. She says we can’t grieve as a group and she gives us the excuse that, you know, they want to be able to give one-on-one managers, you know… the managers one-on-one, um… I don’t even know how to explain it, but she wants it to deal one-on-one with each manager so they make sure that they address all the issues and stuff. And, of course, we know… Well, I know that’s just… that’s just… just a ploy and it’s not a… it’s not a legal reason why we can’t file a group reason, uh… group complaints; it’s a Dacia Johnson reason. And I think when things like that happen the Board needs to stand up and say, “Hey, no, you got a certain amount of time to… to respond to these… to these, um, complaints and you need to start honoring… honoring those times.” And, you know, everybody knows that if 15 people all have the same complaint and then she had to do 15 reviews that would eat up months. And then she had to do 15 hearings, that would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars and… and, you know, maybe a year or two to get through all that. So, we… we need to… to stand hard on this ground that she’s going to start treating us with respect and quit stalling our complaints. And I guess that’s all I got to say about that.

Miranda: Okay. Anybody else?

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Art?

StevensonA: Okay. You know, complaints are the only way that we can voice things that are going wrong. And I think everybody has heard me say – at least I know, members of the Elected Committee – that advocacy goes two ways. If the blind licensed manager has legal basis to file a complaint and it’s legitimate then the Elected Committee should advocate for that manager’s rights. And, on the other hand, the Elected Committee has the obligation, in my opinion, to advocate for the blind licensed manager. If they don’t have a leg to stand on or

their complaint is… is not valid then they have to advocate for that individual and… and say, “Hey, you do not have a legitimate complaint and this is the reason why.” And I think a big part of the problem has been that, you know, some of the blind licensed managers on the Elected Committee have gone on the agency’s opinion, which not necessarily is true. And so seeking out the experts across the land – and I know there’s lots of experts that will readily let our Elected Committee know if the complaint is valid and legitimate. And then, of course, they should advocate adamantly for the blind licensed manager’s rights. And I know, Chair Miranda, right now you have spoken to experts about the subcontracting thing and… and you know, because they’ve told you, that what the agency is doing is inappropriate and therefore the Elected Committee should advocate, you know, for those individuals who have filed the complaint. And I think, that way there’s going to be a lot less controversy about the Elected Committee, that they need to base their decisions where they’re going to advocate, you know, in favor of pushing the complaint because it has valid legal standing. Or, on the other hand, they should advocate for that blind licensed manager and say, “Hey, this does not have legitimate legal basis for you to, you know, proceed.” So, anyways, that’s my comment on it. And if the Elected Committee, in my opinion, bases their advocacy on those two things I don’t think we’ll ever have a problem again, as far as this goes. Thank you.

Bird: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes, Jerry?

Bird: Yeah, I got a comment on that. I didn’t really, but he’s sparked a couple ideas here. Sounds like to me it’s kind of been confusing ‘cause we’re not sure what position or what our duties as Chairperson or as Board members are when a person has a complaint and wonder if we don’t think… agree with their complaint. How’re we supposed to fight for something we don’t believe is right, you know? So, it is kind of a touchy little thing. But, hopefully, I think… let’s just do this: we just made up a form for when we make motions, which I think is going to solve a lot of our problems… It’ll… going to get, you know, and understanding of that’s how things are going to go so we can all move on. Maybe it’s time we need a form for, um… advocating for blind… for fellow managers’, you know, complaints. Which I think it should go through us first, you know? I don’t… I’m not sure, I’m just putting it out there. I don’t know if we put committees together or we have this form to where they can fill out and then we can fill out and we investigate, we research to see if they… if this is legal, if we do see it’s a violation. Or… or, if it’s not, we can simply, as we all agree, and we can show even the blind vendor that, “I’m sorry, we’ve done this research and we’ve found this and this and I’m sorry, it just… you don’t have, you know, it’s not going to do any good. You know, it’d be a waste of money, you’re never going to get anywhere. We… we need to go in a different direction. Or we need to go under the bridge.” But if we have something like that then we have a record of what we… what we cited and then the agency come back and say, “Well, you misquoted that law,” maybe. Perhaps. I mean, I’m hoping that they’ll… they’ll finally let us run our program and accept our recommendations, as long as they are within the boundaries of the law, even if they’re stretched. That’s our… that’s our… that’s our program and that’s how we want them to be. I want you to [inaudible] make sure we are within our scope of the laws but, other than that, let us run it the way we want to. It may be wrong, it may be right, but I… I think if we start doing that it will flow through and people won’t have [inaudible] because this and that. It’s all just a process that we all are following and… and it’s fair and we’ve all had a chance to discuss it and put it together. So, not sure how, but I do think there’s got to be some kind of structure. Thank you.

Miranda: I think that’s a good idea. And that form…

Smith: Yeah. Very good, Jerry.

Miranda: Yeah. And that form that you did for the motions, that was an excellent form, Jerry, and a good way for us to, you know, keep records and… and things.

Bird: Well, thank you. I did have help.

StevensonA: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes, Art.

Hauth: Yeah, I have a comment.

Miranda: Okay, Art. You were first.

StevensonA: Okay. Am I off mute?

Miranda: Uh huh.

StevensonA: I think we have a golden opportunity here also because RSA is going to be doing a monitoring report and so I would suggest that members of the Elected Committee… because that’s what RSA is for. RSA is supposed to watch over the vending program and help the State Licensing Agencies and the blind licensed managers and the Elected Committee do thing correctly. And so I would recommend, Chair Miranda, that you reach out to them also and get their input because I… I… I know they will give you some expert guidance.

Miranda: Okay. I have been trying to get ahold of Jesse and he’s really hard to get ahold of right now since Deanna. His mailbox is full and it's really hard to get ahold of him. But I will… I’ll shoot him an email.

Hauth: Yeah…

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: And that’s a good idea, Art. Okay, Randy.

[00:29:18]

Hauth: Yeah, Hi.

Miranda: Hi.

Hauth: So I would like to make a couple of comments. First of all, advocacy: you know, the Elected Committee is likened to a union and if you don’t have a union representative body representing for you as a worker, what do you have? If you’re a licensed blind vendor and you have a Committee that’s not advocating for you strongly, what do you have? So, again, it is so critically important that the Elected Committee advocate on behalf of the blind vendors and, as well, on behalf of the program. We don’t want things to happen such as what happened to Steve Jackson, right? Where he requested… he filed a complaint, he requested a special meeting. That wasn’t honored and the agency took action to remove his location from him. We don’t want things to happen like happened to Ann Wright, okay, where she was terminated without a full evidentiary hearing. And the agency was the culpable party for allowing Ann to get so far in debt under the current administration. And then, because they got pressure from the legislators, then they came and, you know, took a head. So we don’t want those type of things to happen. I know Ann also requested a special meeting from the former Committee which… which wasn’t… wasn’t honored. So we don’t want those things to continue to happen and it sounds like we’re all kind of moving in the direction, understanding that, as a Committee, the advocacy needs to be strong

and it needs to be supportive; if you like the manager, if you don’t like the manager, right? If you support the issue or don’t support the issue it still calls within the regulations and the rules that the Committee will receive, transmit and serve as advocates. I’ll tell you, um… I think it even goes a little bit further than that. Derrick reached out to me a couple of days ago; first time in a long time that a Board member has reached out and said, you know, “What… what do you want me to bring to the table? What are your concerns? What…?” We should all be doing that. I mean, Harold admitted that he hadn’t been doing his job, you know, and he’s going to do better. So that’s great. Those are the type of things we should all be doing. So, just wanted to go on the record for saying that we can’t allow things that happened before, like the subcontracting thing, where we were all asking for the Committee to advocate for our rights and our position and, next thing we know, we’re… we’re being told by the Director that, you know, everybody’s volunteering. So, just words of encouragement. Let’s continue to go forward and make sure that we’re strong advocates for each other.

Miranda: I agree. Okay. B is Access to Program-Relevant Information. So, who would like to start here?

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Art.

StevensonA: Okay. Knowledge is power and everybody knows that. And if we don’t have access to what’s going on in our program, we cannot – and especially the Elected Committee cannot – actively participate in major administrative and program development decision-making because you don’t have the information that is vital for you guys to do your job. And, also, in the federal code, in our current rules it is required. And I think at the last meeting you all heard me talk about having the information about the AG’s expenses and how important it was for us to know exactly how the money’s being spent so that we could make… we, being, managers can make suggestions to their elected officials and those elected officials can… can take that information and… and, you know, we’re… we’re working… we’re all working together as a team. The problem with our SLA is they don’t want us to know… know what’s going on. They don’t want us to have the knowledge so that we could make good decisions for our program because they want to make all the decisions, which is a violation of the law. The… our Elected Committee is obligated to actively participate and work with the agency in making good decisions so our program grows, our program prospers, we have less complaints because we don’t continuously have those complaints because we have all the tools and the program’s growing and prospering and the managers are all happy and the Elected Committee’s all happy. So the access to the program-relevant information has been a major contributing factor to the prog… problems of our program. And the State Agency wants basically complete control; they don’t want us to be involved in making the decisions and… and that’s why they’ve been keeping that relevant information from us so that they get to make all the decisions. And we can’t make decisions when we don’t know what’s going on. So, Chair Miranda, members of the Elected Committee, it is vital if we’re ever going to have a successful program is that we know what’s going on in the program. We know that the agency has been informed about the possibility of the establishment of a new vending facility and our knowledge and expertise, because we’ve been around for a long time, is what’s going to work, what’s not going to work and if that facility’s going to be a vital facility. And so, I urge you guys… and I know you guys really want the information. You’ve just been stonewalled by the agency and they haven’t fulfilled their real obligation under the law and they also pull out the, “Oh, that’s confidential information.” Well, there’s a lot of information out there that isn’t confidential that… that is vital for us to know what’s going on. So, anyways, Chair Miranda, thanks for recognizing the… thank you all for listening to me. But if we’re definitely going to start moving forward in a positive way we’ve got to have all the relevant information so we can make good, solid decisions. Thank you.

Miranda: Thank you.

Bird: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes, Jerry.

Bird: Okay, that explained it pretty good and I… I pretty well agree with that. I think the key word is “relevant.”

Miranda: Mm hm.

Bird: And I think the key issue is who believes that they have the decision-making power to decide what’s irrelevant; the one that you’re asking it from. That’s not fair. So if he feels he don’t want something you to have, he just says, “I believe it’s not relevant and so you just take what I say and deal with it.” Kind of seems like how it is. So, I would think… I don’t know if we have to clear up some definitions. You know, all of us figure “relevant” is… to me, quite a broad under the scope per se thing… relevant.

Miranda: Well, I think it’s anything that impacts the program.

Bird: Yeah! Or impacts me or anything that has to deal with… with anything that affects me or the program! I mean, that’s a lot of information! We can just say, “Because… because…” I mean… But they try to… they try… I agree with Art and I hate to say it. I mean, it sounds like we’re bashing the SLA, but… it’s got to come out. They seem to be… It’s like a funnel: we got this big opening that allows us to have all this. Just like we have on filing… on filing complaints. They… if you don’t… if you don’t agree with the Director’s response you get to move on to a fair… to a administrative review. Well, now, the administrative review person decides that she’s gonna narrow that down, that she don’t believe that that’s in the scope. It says nothing about it, so they’re… they’re funneling us down to get to where they want. Why? I’ve never been able to understand why they want to keep fighting us and… and try to, like, we’re games and, “Oh, this must mean this and we’re going to keep this from you.” And I think it’s kind of like, why don’t they want us to be educated, to understand this program? I believe their purpose, the way I’ve read it through 30 years, is their place and purpose as an SLA, and as a Director, to make sure the rules are being followed. I believe they’re like a referee. They can’t change the rule book during the game. They’re to follow the rule book. But, for some reason, if they don’t like the rule book it seems like, “You guys got too much control.” Well, that’s… that’s the program, we’re supposed to. So when they want to control everything we do and how we say it and use these different little words and that, it’s disgraceful. I mean, we’re intelligent people and that just, like, you know, bothers me ‘cause they’re acting like I’m, you know, will agree with it. And… and it’s just right. That’s why we need to understand it. Like Art said, information is power. You can’t make an informed decision without information and if you do it’s usually the wrong decision. But for some reason we’ve always been ambushed like [inaudible] going to happen. “Here you guys, we’re going to do this. Oh, too bad, it’s over!” And I thought active participation was before it takes place, not after. I mean, give us a break. We are not kids. We are supposed to be running this program and we’re smart adults, business people. Let us get together and use our business minds ‘cause we’re the blind people. We’re the one this program’s for, we’re the one that’s got to go home every day and stumble around and raise our family. You know, that… that… that’s just the way it is and we accept that. But, by damn, we’re not… we want what we’re supposed to have as this program and grow it. Let’s get another 30 people in here, you know? Anyway, I’m not sure how we do it other than we can’t let them narrow down our… the… what that word means. So, I don’t know if we need to look in the dictionary or… I just hate that they have to fight it instead of saying, “Sure, why do I care what information you’ve got? I want you educated. I’m your teacher, counselor.” They like to be our counselor. Well,

if they don’t give you any information you shouldn’t even have a class because you just sit there looking at the blackboard and there’s nothing on it. Anyway, that’s my opinion. Thanks.

Miranda: Director Morris? Director Morris?

Morris: Yeah, Lewanda?

Miranda: What do you… what do you think program-relevant information is?

Morris: Well, I think… I think… just to back up for a second, I think it’s been a good discussion because I think that’s the important thing, that the Elected Committee weighs in on this as a Committee to make a recommendation to the agency. From my perspective, um, the… relevant information is easily accessible, it’s not going back building massive reports that aren’t already in place type of thing, that doesn’t take hours and hours of staff work and time. So I’d like to hear some kind of formal recommendation from the… from the Committee to… and I think Derrick and Art and Jerry all make good comments about what people feel is relevant. And I know that, you know, that this has been an ongoing debate for a while. And, to Jerry’s point, you know, I… I’m not going to sit here and tell people what “relevant” means ‘cause I don’t want to have… I was literally… was getting on the web trying to look it up as we were sitting here talking, but I think that… that’s part of the job of the Committee is to weigh in on that and recommend it to the SLA.

Hauth: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: I… I would entertain a… a… a motion and then use our form, Jerry, that we used on the no-cause clause.

Hauth: Chair Miranda, I do have a comment still.

Miranda: Oh. Go ahead, Randy.

[00:43:58]

Hauth: Yeah. You know, Director Morris is glad… I’m glad that you brought Director Morris into the conversation because how is that decision made? And who makes it? What’s it based on? And Director Morris just said he’s not going to stand here and tell somebody what “relevant” is or what it isn’t. But what I can share with you is, over the past several years, more often than not any request for program or financial information has been met with my requirement to submit a public records request. So, recently, I requested information and detail behind the unassigned vending. I would believe that’s program-relevant, other than just the major number, right? What it made in a quarter. And Director Morris forced me to a public records request. So, I believe that he has played games; I believe that he has stood behind the so-called transparency this agency has. They’re… they’re very much less than transparent. We as blind vendors have a fundamental right to be provided financial information and program information. And I can tell you, I have spent over a thousand dollars in the last couple years on program-relevant information. So, I believe to identify it, you know, if that’s what it’s going to take to make this agency provide what they should be providing, you know, anyway, if that will help, great. I would also like to ask, while we’re on this subject, what is going on with the audit? All the information that we were required to provide, haven’t heard a word about it. What’s going on with that? So maybe later in the program Director Morris can provide that. So thank you very much.

Bird: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes… yes, Jerry.

Bird: Yeah, before we go on, that struck a comment from me. I… It seems to come down to all of a sudden with… sorry, Director Morris, but you made the comment that relevant information to you don’t mean that… you don’t want to have to spend money and dig for stuff. Now, that should have nothing to do with us getting our information, that you have to do some work and some money must be spent. You look at the AG’s, uh… we paid hundreds of thousands of dollars! I paid! And now you want to say you got six people [correction: the BE team is five people] and you don’t want to have to dig down and find our information we’re asking for. That just troubles me, because a lot of this information is maybe for complaints because they need evidence and stuff like that to show what’s going on in this program. And for you to actually make that comment, I… I just got to say, that just… that, um… that money should never have been… you never… you shouldn’t make a decision on how much time or what it’s going to cost you to… to gather that information. And then you want us to pay for public information because you’ve determined it’s not good. So we’re paying our money and you don’t seem to care a dean about if we have to pay for it. Thank you.

StevensonD: This is Derrick.

Miranda: Yes, Derrick.

StevensonD: Yeah, I just want to touch a little bit on it. I mean, Eric’s… Eric has said, you know, many times that we fall under the umbrella of the AG but yet, when we want information, for… for instance, when we were working on the handbook and the suggestions from… from the A.G.’s office came in. It was our contention that we had a right to see that information because the A.G. was working on behalf of us as well as… as OCB. And that kind of, you know… that, to me, is relevant information that we had a right to see. So, either the A.G.’s representing us and we fall under that umbrella and we’re… we’re supposed to be getting the information from them. It’s… it’s just wrong. The picking and choosing what… what we can have and what we can do. And I’d just like to say… I mean, unless… unless the A.G. is commenting on a complaint against… against OCB, then we have a right to see any information that pertains to the A.G.’s… A.G.’s opinions or their suggestions. Or if… if… if the Commission is going to go to the A.G. for any reason, we should be able to have input before they go to the A.G.’s, if it’s not, you know, concerning a complaint filed against them because, like you said, we all fall under their umbrella. So…

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Art?

StevensonA: Okay. I would like to suggest, before you guys make any motions or anything… again, I’m coming back to the monitoring of RSA and I’ve actually had conversations with Mr. Hartle about this topic. I would suggest that… and… and one thing I know, Chair Miranda, that they plan to talk to the Elected Committee and I… I do believe and I would recommend that you and the rest of the Elected Committee start putting together a list of things that you would like to discuss with them because that is what they’re there for. They’re there to oversee the program and support the Elected Committee and… and I believe you haven’t kind of given that information, Chair Miranda, that… that they have – because you’ve done some leadership training lately – that they’re a resource for you and the Elected Committee. So I would recommend that you put this on the list because I do know that you’re going to be interviewed concerning the monitoring report. And that way, before you guys make a motion or any of that kind of stuff you have their expertise and knowledge helping you make this decision.

Miranda: Okay.

Smith: Art, this is Gordon.

Miranda: Go ahead, Gordo.

Smith: Randolph-Sheppard thing… how did this get started and who started it?

StevensonA: Well, RSA's been around for a long time, Gordo, and… and they oversee the Randolph-Sheppard vending program and… and so, it’s their responsibility to watch over the agency and make sure that they’re administering the program in accordance with the laws and rules and regulations, which is the Randolph-Sheppard Act. So, they’ve been around a long, long time and… and that’s their job and… and we need to… we, the blind licensed managers and the Elected Committee, need to use them as a resource and they are quite willing to help us because they would much rather see… spend the time helping us do things right than having to arbitrate complaints because we weren’t doing it right or the agency wasn’t doing right. So, we need to use what is at our fingertips so that we… again, knowledge is power and it’ll make us make good decisions.

Smith: Art, is this because of the… the contracting situation, with the vending and that?

StevensonA: Well, my friend, yes. That… that is part of… of the problem and I believe the Elected Committee is really going to be stepping up to the plate and addressing all these issues. So, quite frankly, Gordo, I… I’m loving what I’m hearing. And… and I believe that we’re doing what I’ve been chiming in on my emails, we are uniting and we’re going to have a lot of successes from now on.

Hauth: Chair Miranda, can I… can I add something?

Miranda: Yeah. Go ahead, Randy.

Hauth: Yeah, hey Gordo, just so you know… and I’ve had conversations with Deanna Jones and Jesse Hartle, Deanna’s no longer there, but a lot of these concerns, the way it looks, Gordo, is because of the rules, the way the rules were crafted, there’s a lot of questions and concerns with that. That’s why they haven’t been adopted. The subcontracting thing also tied onto that, the way that Ann Wright was handled, the way that Steve Jackson’s situation was handled, denial of due process and complaints. So, there’s a… there’s a lot that they’re going to be looking at. But, you know, that’s just how it is. They do have, like Art said, they are the oversight body for our program on the federal level and they have a right to make sure that everything’s being done to the best of its capabilities here. So.

Smith: Great. Thank you.

Miranda: Harold? [Silence.] Harold, are you there?

Young: Yeah, I’m here.

Miranda: Okay, you have an appointment with Jesse Hartle tomorrow, right?

Young: Yeah, at 9:30.

Miranda: Could you ask him about this program-relevant information?

Young: Sure. [Inaudible.]

Miranda: [Inaudible.] Okay. And then get back?

Young: Sure. Yep.

Miranda: Okay…

Bird: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes, Jerry?

[00:54:50]

Bird: I’ll hurry ‘cause I know we’re getting later here. I… I still want to kind of hear… I… I understand what Art’s saying and maybe wait. I don’t think we need to wait. I think Eric’s trying to tell us, “We want you guys to write us something, to fill that form out and send it to us.” I think [inaudible] tell us. Go ahead and tell us. We want you to tell us. And… I’m not sure if they’ll accept it or how they’ll react but it’s kind of come down to me that that’s the process. So, until we do, it’s not official. So, I believe… I’m not sure how we do it. I do believe we got some other business and that, but somehow… ‘cause we got, God, we’ve got a lot of stuff here, to be able to… to do without maybe having a roundtable or something, a special meeting or… I’m just not sure. Because… you know what I’m saying? It… We do, I think, need to… If I may ask, what was your… wish to make a motion and… and what was it?

Miranda: To make a motion to write a letter, using that new form, to the agency asking, uh… well, let me see. Asking that we start receiving program-relevant information and I guess in there we’ll describe what we believe it is: anything that impacts our program.

Bird: Okay, let’s… you want to put that out for a motion?

Miranda: Mm hm.

Bird: Okay, then I second, if that was your motion. I…

Miranda: Okay, I’ll… I’ll… let me sum it up, for the… the note keeping. Okay, so I make a motion that we use the form that’s been created to write a recommendation letter to the agency that we start using… start receiving program-relevant information and we’ll also include in there our description of what we believe that is.

Bird: Okay, yeah, our definition. Now we got to try to…

Miranda: Yep.

Bird: Okay.

StevensonD: Well, I just have one quick question. I’m not sure whether the Chair’s allowed to do motions or not. Does anybody have that clarification?

Miranda: Well, how about you do it then, Jerry?

StevensonD: Well, that’s what I want to say…

Bird: Done.

StevensonD: If not, I’ll do that motion.

Miranda: Okay, go ahead.

StevensonD: I just did.

Miranda: [Laughs.] Okay. So, do we have a second?

Jackson: I second it.

Miranda: Okay. Any further discussion?

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Art.

StevensonA: Could I suggest that the Elected Committee obviously, you know, send their recommendations around, you know, and... on what they think should be on the list. But also, you know, I think the managers, if they have any thoughts, that they should contact their rep and let them know what their thoughts are on… on program-relevant information and that… that way we’re all working together as a team and… and, of course, I… I think it would be fantastic if, you know, those emails get copied to all the managers so they know… Well, number one, they would know if somebody else has already suggested something so they wouldn’t do it. But that way we’re all working as a team, which is the way it should be.

Bird: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes, Jerry?

Bird: I respectfully understand what Art’s saying. However, I disagree. I believe we’re in a discussion right now so why don’t we all discuss what relevant information should be. We need to come up with a good word or a sentence that… for our benefit, it has a large trunk. Or whatever you want to say. It has, you know… it gives us a wide range. So [garbled] suggestions?

StevensonD: This is Derrick.

Miranda: Go ahead, Derrick.

StevensonD: Well, I think if Harold’s going to be talking to Jesse and getting more of a kind of an explanation of what… what is and what isn’t, that we wait till after that meeting and kind of get a feel from Harold just how to best frame that letter. And then, actually, we’re talking about forms and we’re talking about things that the Elected Committee should be doing and stuff, it brings to mind that I… I strongly believe that we need to start having a bylaw committee so that we can start adding these things to our bylaws and give all our managers the right to agree or disagree on whether we’re going to fill out forms or whether we’re going to do stuff like that. So… so that nobody feels, you know, left out. And these things do need, I believe do need to be part of our bylaws.

Miranda: So we can put that…

StevensonD: I…

Miranda: … we can put that letter together and then send it out for… for review of all the membership.

StevensonD: Yeah.

Miranda: Okay. Okay, so we’ll do that. And bylaws committee, does anybody want to talk about that? Since it’s been brought up?

Bird: Chair Miranda, if you might, don’t we have to… ‘cause you made a motion and it was seconded, wasn’t it? Or didn’t we get the second?

Miranda: Oh, yeah. So we’re going to do a roll call vote, on writing this letter. So, Jerry? Just a yes or no.

Bird: Yes.

Miranda: Derrick?

StevensonD: Yes.

Miranda: Steve Gordon?

Gordon: Yes.

Miranda: Harold.

Young: Yes.

Miranda: Tessa?

Brown: Yes.

Miranda: And I’m a yes. So, okay, we’ll do that. And since bylaws was brought up, does anybody want to talk about a bylaws committee? Because our bylaws do need some work.

StevensonD: Yeah, I make a motion that we start a committee to start working on our bylaws, getting them in order.

Bird: I make a motion that Derrick be the Chairperson and he…

StevensonA: Wait, wait, wait.

Bird: Oh. First you got to do that. Sorry.

StevensonA: Point of order.

Miranda: Okay, so we’re going to put a bylaws subcommittee together. Who’d be interested in chairing that committee? [Silence.]

StevensonA: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes, Art?

StevensonA: I’d just like to say that I believe that it shouldn’t just be a bylaws committee. I think it should be a rules committee and the bylaws should follow… fall under the umbrella of the rules committee because bylaws and rules are what are going to. So I would urge the Committee to establish a rules committee which would have the umbrella of the bylaws within it.

StevensonD: Well, I… I agree with that. But, you know, I think, you know, it’s important to not get too many things going at one time because then we don’t give the ones that we’re working on our best attention. So I think we should tackle things one at a time.

StevensonA: Well…

Miranda: I think… I think that we should just focus on the bylaws committee and just make sure, you know, the Chair, make sure that it is in accordance with our rules.

Bird: I…here. Jerry here. I agree because I think these are our rules and regulations, if I’m not mistaken, so… because of the rules and regulations are supposed to be administrative rule. So, if we don’t put any regulations in there, just our rules, our laws, it’s incomplete. So we need to have even our bylaws, I agree, and I think you need to… to get a committee to get started on it. And I agree that, you know, this is going to… it’s something that they can get started on. I think we need to get things going so they can gain information that’s going to have to come back to a meeting. We’re going to have to talk about it and it’s going to have to be voted on and all that, you know, after they bring back their information and stuff. So, that’s my opinion anyway.

Miranda: And it’s going to take a two-thirds vote from the membership and I think when you have those meetings that it should be open to everyone.

StevensonA: Madame Chair.

Bird: Okay.

Miranda: Art.

StevensonA: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Yes?

StevensonA: Okay. I’ll make one more statement here and then I’ll be quiet. You guys, the Elected Committee, have oversight over your committees. If you establish a rules committee you can right now say, “We’re establishing a rules committee and your agenda right now is the bylaws.” And… and… and that’s what the committee has to focus on. So, you know, I would encourage you guys to establish a rules committee and specifically state right now to whoever you put as Chair that we’re not focusing on anything but the bylaws now until we have that issue resolved. And then you have this… the rules committee already established and the Elected Committee then… if an issue comes up, you just… you just tell the committee what you want them to do because you guys have that power and authority. So, I’ve said enough on this, given you my opinion. Thank you very much.

StevensonD: Yeah, I’ll just… you know, I agree with Lewanda that all the membership has to… has to… should be able to take part if they want to. And I think because… because it is the bylaws committee we, you know, we are all allowed to attend without any kind of restraints from open meeting law. So, I might be wrong, but I don’t think that open meeting laws would be violated. I… I’m already the Chair of vending development, but I… I… I’d be willing to get the ball rolling by sending out emails and having people read the bylaws and… and share with… with me what… what they like and what they don’t like and what they need to be… what they think needs to be added and stuff and I’ll try and get it all together and then maybe set up some kind of a meeting for everybody to meet.

Bird: Madame Chair?

Miranda: Ah, yes, Jerry?

Bird: So… I’m having trouble… is Derrick saying we don’t… we should have a committee? And I… I agree we all to meet ‘cause these bylaws and our laws concerns us all. My only thought was gathering information and then

they bring it to us and then we all discuss it. But if… if… I would chair that committee, if Derrick kind of don’t want to do that. I… I’d be glad to chair that if… if…

StevensonD: That’s fine. Fine.

Miranda: Okay, so bylaws committee, Jerry’s going to chair it and then you can, you know, choose a couple of people to work with you and then...

Bird: I will.

Miranda: Yeah, we’ll have to, you know, as far as, you know, voting on it takes two-thirds vote, so we’ll have to do that in a public meeting. But you can work on it.

Bird: Well, aren’t we at a public meeting?

Miranda: Mm hm. But I mean… I mean when we vote on it, you know, we’ll have to have a public meeting to vote on it.

Bird: I see. To find the vote. Sure. Absolute. You know, if this is just gathering information, that’s what committees are for, to go out and do the heavy work, go find the information and put it on the table and we all get to pick through the trick or treat bag, you know?

Miranda: [Laughs.]

Bird: And then we pick what we all… as we discussed, what we believe is… would benefit us all and then we all can agree on. I mean, there’s goods and bads, there’s not the way I want, there’s… you know. That’s why I’m trying to do here is put a transparency to where we all… I don’t even like… I think everyone should get the email. I think… you know. There’s so many… there’re not very many of us so, why can’t… I mean, why don’t we just put us all as reps?

[Laughter.]

Miranda: There you go. Okay, Jerry, thanks. I know that you’ll do a good job.

Bird: Thank you.

Miranda: Mm hm. Okay, C. is… subcontracting and teaming partner issue.

StevensonD: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Derrick?

StevensonD: Yeah, I’m… as the Chair of the Vending Development Committee I just want to discuss a little bit. There’s been a lot of emails firing back and forth about people wanting to get their existing equipment replaced without actually having to do all their locations at… at one time. And to me that… that would make the only sense at this point in time since there’s a complaint filed and we really don’t know what’s going to happen from that… from that complaint. I think it would be reckless for OCB to purchase a bunch of machines and force people into getting rid of their… their teaming partners or third-party vendors. I think the first thing that should happen is that we replace all the old, outdated machines that aren’t working right, causing… causing a pain. And, with that said, I’d like to make a motion that the Elected Committee send a letter to OCB stating that, you know, we should be working on replacing the old, outdated machines and bring them up to date. And then, at such a

time after the complaint is settled, we can either finish implementing it if that’s what… what they say we have to do, or not. But it’s important to get… get the new [sic] outdated machines fixed.

Miranda: Okay, so we have a motion…

Bird: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Uh huh?

Bird: Oh, was that a motion? Okay, sorry. I was just going to… I can discuss it after we make the motion. Sorry.

Miranda: Okay, so we have a motion that the subcontracting and implementation begin with replacing our old, outdated, existing machines; that we write a letter to that effect. Do we have a second?

Gordon: I second it.

Miranda: Steve Gordon seconds. Open for discussion.

Bird: Jerry.

Miranda: Jerry.

Bird: Um, yeah, you know, I got to say that… that is the smartest because, you know, we got to start looking at our images. If we’ve got a junk machine out there, none of that looks good for us when they’re broke down, you know. And I am grateful for getting these machines. I mean, I am. I mean, it’s a big deal. I mean, we’ve hardly got anything. This is a great, great thing. But we got to do it properly. It can’t be dictated and it can’t just run through and we’re going to march down I-5, you know, and just… just like Germany or something. But anyway, so… so the idea is, we do need to get our people that’s been sitting here without no equipment, paying high set-aside and they don’t… they don’t… they’re not even going to get these old machines replaced until they decided they’ll… they’ll… they’ll tap out and say, I’ll… we’ll do every one of my machines. You know, that… that’s just kind of stupid. You know, I understand we need to do that and they got it, but jeez, isn’t that the smartest. Also, it shouldn’t just be the vending machines. I mean, I think we also need to make a motion here when we come up the… you know, we need to get Carole King [correction: Kinney]. Why can’t we make a motion saying, “We want you to get her her equipment in the next 30 days. 15 days. You find the money!” We’re just tired of being looked at like, “You guys can’t do the work ‘cause you got shitty machines.” It… it looks bad. They think all blind does the same. And we say, “Well, it’s not my fault; the agency won’t provide it.” Well, it’s our duty as Chair… as members of this Board to make sure they’re doing it and make sure we’re not left out, looking like, you know, second-class citizens that just use these stupid machines, you know? So… and I also think that it should be, even… however implemented, it should do with the blind manager you’re doing it with. You know, you sit down, and find out which one would be best to take over or all of them or what you’re going to do in a… in a democrat way. Thank you.

Gordon: Chair Miranda?

[01:13:40]

Miranda: Yes, Randy?

Gordon: Steve Gordon.

Miranda: Oh, I’m sorry. Yes, Steve?

Gordon: That’s all right. Basically, what we really need to do is… I have a suggestion… is that, we’re going to basically, all of us, if we’re going to have to meet with VR or… or the agency, however that’s going to work, towards the funding of the equipment and things, we need to all have a plan and we need to be able to sit down with our counselor, VR, however that’s all going to work out, and we’re all going to have to submit a plan. I’ve been kind of working on a plan already on just… just the needs that I have for my route. And it’s not going to be inexpensive. So… but, basically, we’re going to have to have a plan laid out with complete costs and breakdowns of everything that we’re going to need. That’s all I have to say.

Hauth: Chair Miranda? Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Randy?

Hauth: Yeah, I would just suggest… there’s a long way to go with this ending subcontracting, so I would just make a suggestion that any letter be crafted very carefully. What I can tell you is, the Governor’s Office believes that the Elected Committee is supportive of this because you guys previously did not take a position against it. So, I don’t… I don’t think, you know, just let’s be very careful how we craft the letter. I really believe the Committee should take a position against the ending of subcontracting because the Committee has not done that. Obviously, the money should be utilized to replace existing machines, but I don’t think it should be… I don’t think it should be like, to begin with. And, you know, we just have to really craft it carefully. So… maybe, you know, maybe the Committee should go on record of, you know, taking a position against the ending of subcontracting. I’m not sure, but I just wanted to share that. Thank you.

StevensonD: Yep, this is Derrick.

Miranda: Yes, Derrick?

StevensonD: Yeah, I do… I do agree with Randy, that… that part of the letter should say that we don’t agree with the fact that they’re saying we can’t use third-party vendors. And, yeah, I think the letter has to be crafted in that manner. And I’d also just like to… like to add, you know, if a manager… if we’re going to replace machines for managers, then, you know, they’re not getting… going into debt for, you know, thousands of dollars buying product and stuff that… that eventually they may not, you know, want to keep using. And to me… to me that’s a big thing because you’re asking a manager to pay back, you know, thousands and thousands of dollars and, you know, that’s… that’s a scary thing, to me anyway. I don’t how it is to anybody else, but I kind of like the fact that I’m not in debt right now.

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Art.

StevensonA: Okay. I liked what I heard from Derrick. I’ve liked what I heard from Randy. And there’s been a motion that’s made… been made and seconded, correct?

Miranda: Yes.

StevensonD: Yes.

StevensonA: Okay. So, what… what you need to do, Derrick, is make a friendly amendment to the motion. And the person who made the motion and the person who accepted it would then say, “Yeah, I accept that friendly amendment.” And then… and then it would become officially, in accordance with Robert’s Rules of Order and stuff, then it would officially become a part of the original motion.

Miranda: Derrick made the motion.

StevensonA: Okay. So… so that’s… he accepted the friendly amendment. Does the person who seconded it accept that?

Gordon: Steve Gordon.

StevensonA: So now… now it’s all official to, you know, do that.

Bird: And, if I must say, I think now… yeah, we need to take our vote now. But I think, like you’re saying, it’s very important how this stuff is crafted. So maybe, I don’t know if we have to describe how we’re going to craft it right now or not, but hopefully we can maybe late… and try to pick some people that are, you know, some better crafters than others. So.

Miranda: Mm hm.

Bird: Thank you.

Smith: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Gordo?

Smith: I do like the conversation that’s going on about the third contractors. I think it’s quite important that they stay involved with this group somehow.

StevensonA: Mm hm. Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Thank you. Yes, Art?

StevensonA: You do have a Vending Facility Development Committee and that committee… this would definitely fall under the scope of them, you know, working on that and so if the Elected Committee, you know, wanted to put that on them to… to address right away, that would appropriate.

Bird: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Jerry?

Bird: I’m just trying to help ‘cause I see number D is going to be Award of Vending Machine Procurement.

Miranda: Yeah.

Bird: I think we’re talking the same thing, kind of here, I think.

Miranda: Yeah.

Bird: So could we craft a letter that does both of those, so we just, you know, don’t have… You know what I’m saying? Or do we need to do them separately? I just… they’re almost the same thing. It’s just a… a…

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yeah, we can include that in the letter. Yeah? Art?

StevensonA: That is… that is part of the motion, is the procurement and stuff. So it actually has all been taken care of I think. And so, actually, that agenda item might not even be necessary.

Miranda: Okay. So, I’m going to call for the vote. Steve Gordon?

Gordon: Yes.

Miranda: Jerry Bird.

Bird: Yes.

Miranda: Derrick Stevenson.

StevensonD: Yes.

Miranda: Harold Young.

Young: Yes.

Miranda: Tessa Brown.

Brown: Yes.

Miranda: And I’m a yes, so it passes. Okay, so…

StevensonA: Yeah!

Miranda: Award of Vending Machine Procurement, were we done, then, with that one? Can we pass that one?

[Silence.]

Say something.

Bird: I [inaudible], as long as it’s included that both are issues… that both issues will be in the letter we just discussed.

Miranda: Yeah. Okay. 4. Is “Other.” So, um…

Gordon: Bringing up my suggestion, Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes?

Gordon: Included in “Other” and I suggested to the Committee earlier that we re-adjust our open comments later on during our meetings so that public people that are hearing it for the first time can actually get a handle on what people are saying, what everything’s about. They don’t have any… any awareness or knowledge of what’s going on until after the fact and it… they don’t have a chance to comment. And sometimes…

Miranda: You want to make a motion?

Gordon: I would like to, yes.

Miranda: Okay. So, Steve has made a motion that we… on the future agendas that we place the comments at the end of our meeting rather than at the beginning of the meeting. Do I have a second?

StevensonD: I’ll second it.

Miranda: Derrick seconds it. Open for discussion.

Bird: Jerry Bird.

Miranda: Jerry.

Bird: That’s fine, but that’s public comment and we’re not actually the public, I don’t feel. But we used to have, and I believe that’s true, they should be able to talk after they hear the discussion. I mean, so… But, as far as the rest of us, we… it used to be open… what was the word? Open discussion?

Miranda: Mm hm.

Bird: You know. And… and that’s what our program’s about. I mean, the only place you get the right to do – instead of back and forth [inaudible] emails and, you know, all that kind of stuff – is in an official meeting, to bring whatever you want brought out. That’s what these meetings are for: you have an issue, bring it up, let’s deal with it, let’s take care of it so we don’t get animosity and all that stuff and we’ll get a move on.

Miranda: So, here where I have “Other” I’ll just change it to “Open Discussion” because it’s basically the same thing, I think.

Gordon: Yeah, and I really… really, Chair Miranda, honestly, and I’d agree with Jerry, it should be able to be throughout our meetings. I mean, you know, goodness sakes, we’re… we’re not some big high-falutin’ place that, you know, [inaudible].

Hauth: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Well, we do have that with our… in our bylaws, that everyone’s allowed to speak on each agenda item uninterrupted.

Hauth: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Randy?

Hauth: Yeah, I would just like to add in, you know, hey, kudos to people for talking about this because three minutes at the beginning of a meeting is not adequate, you know. I think many of us would agree with that. But, I do believe, and I just want to throw that out there, so comments should be open somehow, like Steve has just said, for each… each item that’s addressed, you know. Because maybe the Board members want to hear from the public, maybe they want to hear from a Linda Haseman or a James Edwards or another public member who weighs in. And maybe that would help, you know, make your decisions. So, we don’t have that many managers in our program and we don’t have that many public that want to voice their opinion but I don’t believe it would hurt to allow for that to happen. I don’t know exactly the right process, but anyway…

Miranda: So, should we do that here or should we work on that with our bylaws?

StevensonD: Well, I think it should… we… we should put something in our bylaws. But, you know, to our Chair’s credit, I mean, if James Edwards or a Commissioner or someone of that capacity asked to speak she’s allowed them to speak and, really, didn’t ever put any time limit on it. At the end of the day, you know, the Chair… the Chair decides, you know, that stuff for theirself. So, I… I… I think that we’ve… we’ve come a long way and… and everything… everything’s pretty open. I, you know, I trust… trust Lewanda to carry out that… her positions on whether someone can speak or not, by herself.

Miranda: Or maybe I could just write it on the… on the… maybe I could just write it on the agenda.

StevensonD: Right.

Miranda: Up above, before we start the meeting…

StevensonD: Right. But I do believe…

Miranda: … so people are aware.

StevensonD: Yeah, I do believe, you know, that before you adjourn the meetings you should always ask if there’s any more discussion that needs to be… to be heard. And, hearing none, then you can adjourn the meeting.

Miranda: So… Steve’s motion was to add open discussion to the end of our agenda. Does somebody want to make a friendly amendment that… that goes throughout our agenda and is not just for managers only, but for the public, as well?

[Silence.]

Bird: I second it.

Miranda: Do you want to make the friendly amendment and then Steve can accept it?

Bird: You did.

Gordon: And I accepted.

[Laughter.]

Miranda: Okay, so let’s do a membership vote. Steve?

Gordon: Yes.

Miranda: Jerry?

Bird: Yes.

Miranda: Derrick?

StevensonD: Yeah, I’m a little confused, but I’ll say yes. We’ll work it out.

Miranda: Okay. Harold?

Young: Yes.

Miranda: Tessa?

Brown: Yes.

Miranda: And I’m a yes, so it passes. Okay, Randy, you had something under “Other.” What was that? Early on…

Hauth: Oh, yeah, I was on… I was on mute. I had a question about the last couple of emails to Eric, asking about the situation at the Portland State Office Building. The serving line has been down for months and now I understand that the espresso is closing earlier and I’m just trying to get an update on that because I hear still from people that work at that building… that I worked there for six… So, just wondering what’s going on, how we can help Carole.

Bird: I would suggest let… Carole, would you like to tell us what you think you should… how you’d like us to help you get what you need and what you need?

Kinney: Well, I’d be most happy to! Let me first say… let me first say that I have been there almost seven months and, yes, there is a lot of equipment that is not working. Now, I will have to say that some of the equipment repair people that came out to do some of this work: one, they bought the wrong thing, then they disappeared off the face of the earth, so the Commission did have to get someone else to do some of these. Okay, but with that being said, I would also like to say this is the worst unit I have ever in my life walked into. And I have been in BE, not only here but in Tennessee. Everything in there was tore up. Everything. And, as far as the serving line: no, it is not fixed and I have been serving a lunch at the grill which some of the people are not happy with. But I am doing everything I can and I am working with the building manager and the times that I close is fine with him. The thing about it is, after being there for seven months and making very little money, I don’t see a way that I’m going to really pull it up. If anybody has any ideas I’m open to listen to them.

Bird: I’d like to say, you know, it almost sounds to me… which, you know, has been a problem throughout our program, the darn near 30 years that I’ve been in it, is… is when we do get put out in these places they don’t quite understand how we’re being looked at and…

Kinney: Right.

Bird: … we’re being judged. And… and that just… that hurts us all and, you know, we’re struggling as it is. But, however, it almost like they done many times, which I thought they… they kind of set people up to fail and that’s a sad thing. You know, you’re struggling as it is and then for you to be thrown in a place that isn’t set up for you… They’re supposed to be ready for you to turn that key and start doing business. That’s how we’re designed to do our managers. And that’s just respect. So, I… once again, I’m not sure if we want to… how the rest of the Board would like to deal with it. I’ll let some other people discuss it and then I… I think we need to deal with it in somehow. I just don’t know. Thanks.

Hauth: Can we hear from… can we hear from Eric, please, on that?

[01:31:05]

Miranda: Director Morris, would you like to speak on this?

Morris: I think Carole covered it pretty well.

Hauth: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Randy?

Hauth: Yeah, Eric, why… why has the serving line… You know, I ran that location for six years and it was very successful at the time I ran it and I know that Donny, previously, had run it very successfully and they utilized that serving line. So I can understand why Carole may not be making it. I know that serving line was a big part of the profitability there. So, why hasn’t the agency provided support and made sure that that serving line is up and going?

[Noise from phone interference.]

Morris: There’s a lot of cross-chatter. Something’s going on. I can’t quite… tell what’s going on. Somebody needs to mute their phone or something. But, um… Carole talked about it. We have been trying to get it repaired and

our repair company ordered the wrong part then vanished off the face of the earth, which is… unique. So we’ve got another company set up, the parts are on order and we’re doing the best we can to get it replaced.

Hauth: For seven months, that’s… that’s…. Well, I appreciate your answer, but for seven months that’s inexcusable.

Morris: [Inaudible.]

Bird: And if I might say, not to break in on Randy, and then they want us to have faith in them to force all these vending machines on us and they’ll know how to do it. I mean, jeez, they… they can’t even keep our birth certificates on file.

[Chuckling.]

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Art?

StevensonA: Okay, are… wait, are… are we done with this issue, or…?

Miranda: Yeah. Yeah, does anybody else have anything else under “Other?”

Colley-Dominique: I…

StevensonA: Okay, now…

StevensonD: I just want to… would like to say that this… this is the type of stuff that should’ve been brought before the legislature to try and get money for… to buy new equipment for our… for our work, wore out stuff. And it should’ve been a top priority of OCB but, obviously, it wasn’t. If… if it… if all this would’ve been discussed in a… in a meeting prior to doing any of this stuff with the legislature, I… I am almost positive that I would’ve chimed in and say, “Hey, we need… we need to get some new equipment in our… in our cafeterias and stuff.” And I… and I just want to add that, um… are we even sure that this repair is worth… is worth making? And maybe we should decide that we need to purchase a new one.

Morris: That’s what we’re doing, Derrick.

Miranda: Is this a… is this a repair or a replacement for that serving line?

Morris: It’s a replacement.

[Silence.]

Miranda: Well, that answers that.

StevensonD: Okay. I don’t understand how they… they got the wrong parts, they… they brought the wrong serving line? Or… or, when you say parts…

Kinney: They brought the wrong insertion, to go in it.

StevensonD: Oh, okay.

Kinney: Yeah, it didn’t have… it didn’t have any way for you to put water in it or, you know… And there’s a matter of rust and some wires and things like that that’s got to be fixed also.

StevensonD: Well, I thought… if you’re going to replace it, then you replace all the wires and everything with brand new…

Kinney: Right.

StevensonD: …equipment. So.

Kinney: Right.

StevensonD: Okay.

Miranda: Anything else under “Other?”

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Art.

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes?

StevensonA: Okay. I want to bring up [badly garbled] … out to bid and…

Miranda: We can’t hear you, Art. It’s…

Kinney: We can’t hear you, Art.

Miranda: Yeah. It sounds like maybe you’re under some lights.

StevensonA: Is that better?

Miranda: Yes.

StevensonA: Okay, hold on a second. There. Okay, now you should be able to hear me.

Miranda: Yeah, you sound good.

StevensonA: Okay. If you started on cordless phones sometimes if you get out of the… the thing, it messes up. Anyways. RSA is definitely going to be coming out to do a monitoring visit and definitely the rules are one of the reasons that they’re coming out here. And, again, in my opinion, we do… the current rules that are sitting at RSA are not complete and also there are some definite problems. So, I again… and I’ll volunteer to be the Chair if the, uh… if the Committee so desires. But we’re going to be… a lot of steps ahead if we establish a rules committee and… and we start addressing those issues in consultation with RSA… because most of you have seen the letter from Jesse Hartle… is, there’s not going to be complete rules, uh… there’s not going to be any passed rules from them until the issues are addressed. And the only way they can be addressed is by having a rules committee. Thank you.

Bird: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Jerry?

Bird: I gotta agree, ‘cause I’m real disappointed in how these rules work. I know Art was on, and Derrick was on the committee of doing it prior and it did get voted around and then it went… and, to my understanding, was changed by the AG and perhaps the SLA without coming back to us four our blessing on their changes. That’s

improper. That… that’s not giving us our right of speech. Therefore… and before I say this, I know it can be done because the Commissioners [inaudible] the Committee and I understand we have the same rights as they do under the committee open meeting laws. Okay? So they brought… we had a… we had a really nice rule on active participation that we spent time, went to meetings, done it professionally, done it properly and wrote up a really good one that gave us some say. The Commissioners passed it, agreed with us. Well, I can’t remember how long… two, three, four months, they’re like, “Oh my god, we give them too much power!” or something. And so they, at a meeting, just said, “Okay. Hey, we bring this back and we end it. Bam! It’s gone; null and void.” So, for them to say… try to say that we can’t bring these back, I just want to bring that issue in. But, I make a motion… No, not a motion. But I would be willing… I want to be the chair of a subcommittee to work… to bring them handbook back because I was… I was on a handbook committee that we wrote ourself, with Lewanda, and tried to, uh… work it out to where we all can bring them out, discuss them in a way proper. Thank you.

[01:38:51]

Miranda: So, Jerry made a motion that we bring back a subcommittee that he will chair, to go over the rules? Is that right, Jerry?

Bird: To go over the existing rules that were submitted, that we believe are not… are now… we have changed their mind on all there… there’s new people on the Board… that they are not complete rules and we would like to bring them back, make them complete, get this dirty job done with and move on.

Miranda: Okay, so Jerry’s made a motion that we bring back the rules, uh… the rules committee…

StevensonA: [Garbled.] Chair Miranda?

StevensonD: I… I would like to second that I’d ask that there not be a whole lot of discussion because I think the motion was pretty well explanatory and we have other business to attend to. But I do second it.

Miranda: Okay. So is everybody okay on passing the discussion? [Dog barking.] …just vote?

[Garbled response.]

Miranda: Okay. Steve Gordon?

Gordon: Yes.

Smith: Wait, who’s the new manager?

Miranda: So, Steve Gordon’s yes. Derrick Stevenson?

StevensonD: Yes.

Miranda: Jerry Bird?

Bird: Yes.

Miranda: Harold Young? [Silence.] Harold Young?

Young: Yes.

Miranda: Tessa Brown.

Brown: [Inaudible.] Sorry. Yes.

Miranda: Okay, and that’s a yes, so it passes. Okay, so anything else under “Other?”

StevensonD: This is Derrick.

Miranda: Derrick

StevensonD: Yeah, I… you know, this… this is not something I… I enjoy doing, but Mr. Steve Jackson and Lin Jaynes have voiced serious concerns concerning their rep, Tessa Brown. And I think we should give them the opportunity to, uh, in this meeting explain how they’re not being represented and, possibly, us taking some kind of action.

Miranda: Okay, so we’ll give them… we’ll give them the opportunity to speak and then Tessa to defend herself and then we’ll move on from there. So. Lin, would you like to start?

Jaynes: Actually, I’m at the hospital, trying to have this conversation and I’ve been told I have to shut my phone off. So, this is…

Miranda: Oh.

Jaynes: …my husband’s pending surgery so…

Miranda: Oh.

Jaynes: But I did want to attend the meeting. But let me make it real quick before they shut me off. I’ve had no communication whatsoever with Tessa. I’ve sent her several emails, never had an answer, no response at all since she was elected. And I’m concerned about the amount of meetings she misses. And I think I made it very plain in my letter: I think she’s got too many irons in the fire to actually be serving on the Board. And that’s all I can say ‘cause they’re rushing me out of here now.

Miranda: Okay. Good luck with Jesse.

Bird: Good luck.

StevensonD: Yeah.

Jaynes: Thank you so very much. He’s going into surgery in about half an hour.

Smith: Okay. We’ll pray for you.

Miranda: Yeah.

Jaynes: Thank you much. [Inaudible.]

Miranda: Okay, Steve, would you like to add something? [Silence.] Mister… Steve Jackson? [Silence.] Am I on the line?

StevensonD: Yeah, you’re on.

Miranda: Oh, okay. All right, I think we dropped… we lost Steve. Tessa, would you like to say something?

Brown: Uh, sorry, had to take my phone off of mute. I apologize in advance for the background noise, but I’m on the bus heading home from work. So, it… it’s the best I can do. As far as missing the last meeting, I apologize for that but I was on vacation, out of state and out of service area, and I told both the Chairperson and the Director I

would be unavailable. So, as far as, that email from Lin, I haven’t received any directly to me from her that I’m aware of and if I have and I’m not aware of it then I apologize for overlooking those. And I will make it a priority to stay in contact with both Steve and Lin on a regular basis from this point on because we’re all trying to work a little bit harder to make this program a lot better.

Jackson: Can I say something now? I was on the phone, just couldn’t… couldn’t…

Miranda: Oh, yeah. Go ahead, Steve.

Jackson: I’d just like to say that about a year ago I asked for advocacy from Tessa, my rep, and Lewanda and there was a lot of confusion. People didn’t realize that I was still managing the State Building and managing the coffee shop. I had an employee there. Since then, I’ve been kicked out with no due process and it’s completely wrong. And I’d just like to say that’s not the kind of representation that I would like and I would like… I would like Tessa to step down, if you would. Or, I would like it… that somehow things could be fixed. But, I don’t think that’s going to happen, so we have to move forward and we need better representation on the Board, please.

Miranda: Tessa, would you like to respond?

Brown: I would. I appreciate where you’re coming from, Steve, and I’m sorry for things that have happened in the past. Unfortunately, I don’t think at this point we can do anything to take back what has happened. But I respectfully decline your wanting me to step down. I believe that I can, and have in the past, done a good job representing the Board, although…

Jackson: You didn’t represent me, Tessa. You didn’t advocate for me.

Brown: I advocated for the program.

Jackson: What about me? As your… as your…

Brown: You’re part of the program. You are a part of the program and I advocated for the betterment of the program in its entirety.

Hauth: So, how did you do that?

Jackson: In order to… Yeah. I don’t see how it…

Brown: Pardon me?

Jackson: … bettered anybody. I don’t see how it bettered anybody by kicking me out and then cannibalizing my facility and giving it to someone else who used to work in that same facility and then failed. So, I don’t think that the transition of managers to facilities was very smooth and I don’t think I got any advocacy from the Board. So, that’s the reason why I think that you should…

Brown: I… I believe that you and I have a different understanding. You got advocacy but it wasn’t the kind that you wanted, Steve, is my opinion.

Jackson: Well, what did I get? Did you call me? You didn’t call me.

Brown: Did I call you? No, I spoke with you in person several times.

Jackson: But not about…

Brown: From this point on I will make sure… Yes, I did. From this point on I will make sure that every communication I have with you is in writing.

Hauth: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Randy?

[1:46:40]

Hauth: Yeah. I just wanted to say, you know, let’s… let’s go back four or five years ago, when we were facing this very same situation. I took a lot of heat as the Chairperson when we discussed this same… similar… I mean, identical situation where Tessa was missing meetings and not, you know, not representing that important responsibility. And so, I can tell you that there’s been more than one meeting… nothing personal, Tessa, but there’s been more than one meeting that you have missed. Um…

Brown: Randy, I’m so glad you brought this back up, because this…

Hauth: Hold on.

Brown: …re-opens the statute of limitations.

Hauth: Hold on. Just a second. Please. Please. I’m talking. So, anyway, you… again, nothing personal, but your position as a Board member, we heard from Lin and we heard from Steve where you haven’t communicated, you haven’t represented and the bylaws require that. The state statutes require that. And the federal requirement also requires that. And there is an attendance requirement and you have missed more than one meeting. Does anybody have a documented record of the meetings that this Board member has made… or missed? Do you have that, Lewanda?

Bird: Jerry Bird.

Hauth: Jerry. Go ahead.

Bird: I do. I have tried to do some research, ‘cause this is a… you know, it’s never a pleasant… pleasurable time and we have to recommend or we have to do something for the betterment of the program. So I took the time and I reviewed the minutes of the meetings for the last… 2016. What I found, as… re-doing the verbatim minutes, they state that, for the first three meetings of the year, Tessa was present. Last three meetings she was… there was… she was not in attendance. And she also missed a strategy meeting that the Commissioners put on specially to put out these ambassadors and she missed that meeting. So, once again, I’m sorry, but… you know, this position… it’s time that it… you gotta understand that it’s going to take some work. You gotta do stuff, you’re representing somebody. And when you miss these meetings, Tessa, or anybody else and me, they’re not being represented, so their voice is not being heard. That… that is something that this Board has… cannot… you know, we can’t put up with that. I believe you had your chances. You… four meetings, it’s not just one little thing you kind of done, you know? It’s… there’s several issues. So, I… as much as I hate to say it, unless anyone else has any discussion, I’ll make a motion.

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Well, wait a minute. I’d like to say something. When Tessa missed the first… okay, back to when Randy was Chair, I believe what Tessa was removed from the Board for was misrepresentation of the Board. And…

Brown: I believe that’s correct.

Miranda: …and also, when Tessa missed the first two meetings, I should have had conversation with her about that. I didn’t. That was my responsibility and I didn’t do it, so I take full responsibility for that. And I would ask… you know, at the last meeting, uh, November 5th, she was excused and so, I would just ask that we give her a second chance. And she has said that she did have conversations with Steve but it was in person. And so, anyway, again, I would ask for a second chance for Tessa.

Kinney: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Carole?

Kinney: I would like to say something, if I may.

Miranda: All right.

Kinney: You know, we’re… we are all human and there are sometimes many things in our lives that get in the way of what we’re trying to do. And I do think maybe, Lewanda, that you should have said something to Tessa to… so she could acknowledge. You know? But, you know, I… I think Tessa does a really pretty good job and I would hate to see her, you know, not be on the Board. Just because I think maybe if she didn’t attend the meetings any more or she, you know, she slacks, okay, she’s been warned. But I think everybody deserves a second chance. Thank you.

Brown: [Inaudible] you.

Jackson: Can I…

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Jackson: This is Tessa’s second chance. She’s been kicked off…

Miranda: Yes, Art?

StevensonA: Yeah. Did you guys hear what Steve said? This is the second chance. One other time she was removed. But, um… okay, um… The meetings are… are… are definitely… I… I mean, that’s a part of this puzzle. However, I was on the Elected Committee when the controversy with Mr. Jackson and his facility came up and I gave her information that was vital information, that Mr. Jackson had rights under the laws and rules and regulations and that she, as a member of the Elected Committee, didn’t have the right or the authority to vote to remove him from his facility. And she ignored that information. She did not advocate for him in accordance with the law. And… and, therefore… The meeting thing is one thing, but there’s one critical issue here: that a person who represents the blind licensed managers absolute responsibility under the law is to make sure that they receive their rights under the laws and rules and regulations. And Tessa was given that information from me. I was a member of the Elected Committee and she chose… chose to ignore that, not to investigate it. And Mr. Jackson has been put through hell because of her not fulfilling her obligation under the laws and rules and regulations and denying a manager that she represented his right to due process before they removed him from that facility. And… and therefore, yes, missing the meetings is absolutely wrong, but when you do the kind of damage that she did to a person, her constituent that she represented, that’s unexcusable. And we need somebody in there who is going to take the wherewithal, take the responsibilities to fulfill their obligations under the law and protect each and every manager in this program. And she failed to do it and… and that is unexcusable. Thank you.

Brown: Chair Miranda, may I speak?

Miranda: Yes, Tessa.

Brown: Um…

Miranda: Yes, Tessa.

Brown: I… I do believe it is my job to represent the people that are in my area to the best of my ability as well as represent the overall wellness of our program, in both foundation and growth. And I believe that that is what I have done in the past. And I’m sorry if my choices did not meet with everybody’s standards. That is… [Dog barks.] Pardon the background noise. But I can honestly say that all of the voice… voting and choices that I have made while representing this program, which has been… I’ve been a Board member for more than half of my membership years and I think… I think that says something, that people keep voting for me and that they put their trust in my opinions. And I’m sorry that the vote or the decisions that I have made haven’t pleased everybody but it… it is, with all due respect, not my responsibility to please everybody, but to do the betterment for the program. That’s what I have to say.

Bird: Chair Miranda.

Miranda: Yes, Jerry.

Bird: Thank you, Tessa. But, however, you kind of hit on something: you’ve been doing it to the best of your ability and I’m sure you have. The problem here is you don’t have the abilities for this position. I hate to say it. So… and... and… you just kind of made your whole thing… you’ve said you been on this Board for half of your membership. Why haven’t you got it now? Why don’t you know how to follow the bylaws? Why don’t you know the proper way to do? I mean, you kind of just said it. Half of your membership and… and you’ve got 100% of your people that you represent not happy and they are asking us to take action on their behalf. So, therefore, does anyone else have any more comments before I make a motion?

Miranda: No.

Bird: Ah, it’s my… not… not my happiness, but I must… I must respect the managers in Tessa’s group, that they are not happy and Tessa has had her chances to try to learn, get training, try to get up to speed so she can help us. I make the motion that we replace… that Tessa Brown be removed and replaced.

Miranda: Okay, Jerry’s made a motion that Tessa Brown be removed and replaced. Do I have a second?

StevensonD: I second.

Miranda: Okay. Derrick seconds. Roll call vote. Steve Gordon.

Gordon: Yes.

Miranda: Derrick Stevenson.

StevensonD: Yes.

Miranda: Jerry Bird. [Silence.] Jerry Bird.

Bird: Yes.

Miranda: Harold Young.

Young: Yes.

Miranda: Tessa Brown.

Brown: No.

Miranda: And I’m a no, but two-thirds of the Board voted yes. Okay, um…

Bird: Chair Miranda.

Miranda: Yes, Jerry.

Bird: If we’ve finished that business off, I would like to make a motion that… that, according to our bylaws, that it is our obligation to appoint someone to take over the term of the… of… of Tessa Brown. And I have a recommendation, so I don’t know whether we vote on that. I… I recommend Steve Jackson and I’ll say why: because Steve is one of our young guys that really want to learn and I think he’s put forth an effort that… I think we need some young blood. Even Tessa was young, I’m not saying that. But I’ve thought about it and I do think that he… he would be good for our program and our team. So, that’s my recommendation.

StevensonD: This is Derrick.

Miranda: Okay. Go ahead, Derrick.

StevensonD: Yeah, I… I’ll just second that. I guess he… he made a thing and I… I… I challenged Steve… many years, actually, I challenge him every time I get a chance to challenge him, to… to get more involved and to start learning and stuff and I think he’s made some really positive progression in that… in that manner. So I… I… I suggest that we replace Tessa with Steve.

Hauth: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Randy?

Hauth: Yeah, I’d just like to comment. You know, Steve Jackson I think has gotten baptized… baptism by fire because he was faced with losing his location, his livelihood. And it sounds like the location he was managing is now possibly slipping away from the current manager. But Steve has really learned and dug into the rules and the regulations. He’s a strong advocate. He’s right now in an administrative hearing based on his wrongful removal of that location. So I think Steve is fair. I think he’s reasonable. I think he’s sensible. And I think he will advocate for years to come, on and for this program. And, while Lin Jaynes is in that area, I know she’s way too busy, especially with some things going on with Jesse. She’d also do a great job, but I would also support Steve, even though I’m not in that area. Thank you.

Miranda: Okay, we have a motion to put Steve in the Portland-2 area and we have a second. So we’ll do a roll call vote. Steve Gordon.

Gordon: Yes.

StevensonD: Actually, by acclamation.

Miranda: Derrick.

StevensonD: Yes.

Miranda: Harold. [Silence.] Harold Young?

Young: Yes.

Miranda: Jerry Bird.

Bird: Yes.

Miranda: Okay. And Lewanda’s a yes, so there’s your two-thirds. Okay, so…

Bird: Congratulations, Steve Jackson!

Jackson: Thank you! I’m a Board member? Awesome! Thank you, guys! Honored.

Bird: Now come on and get up here. Get on the front of the table. I got a chair pulled out.

Jackson: [Laughs.] I’ve got to find it first.

Miranda: Okay. 5. Is Director’s Comments.

Morris: Madame Chair, I don’t have anything tonight but the… besides the fact that there’s another protest in downtown, so the sooner we can wrap up…

Miranda: So you want to get going?

Morris: Yeah, for public transit, which is going to be an adventure. So.

Miranda: Okay. Next meeting. Can you look at your calendar there for me, Eric?

Hauth: The operating agreement is really important, Lewanda. I don’t mean to break in, but…

Miranda: What is it?

Hauth: The operating agreement. I mean, unless you’re… unless the Board would respectfully call for another… set a meeting, there’s a… the operating agreement is very important to discuss. And there’s a couple other things, too. So.

Miranda: Oh, okay. So could you… you got time to answer a few questions, Director Morris, so we don’t have to call for another meeting?

Morris: I guess. I’m not sure what… what we’re talking about, but I got about fifteen minutes before I gotta go.

Hauth: So what…

Miranda: Okay. Go ahead, Randy.

Hauth: Yeah. What is the status of the operating agreement? I know, listening to the previous meetings… I’m summarizing this, but I believe you had indicated that, moving forward with the implementation plan of the end of subcontracting that you would be utilizing the operating agreement to disallow subcontracting. So I’m wondering, you know, what is the status of the operating agreement? Have you been having discussion with the Board about it? Have you been crafting it at your office? What’s going on?

Morris: So… so, pertaining to the operating agreement, I… I worked on the operating agreement language, gosh, it’s probably been a year ago. And, um, I haven’t done anything with it since. So the current operating

agreement is the one in the 2001 rules so I’m not quite sure… to be perfectly honest, I’m not quite sure what you’re talking about.

Hauth: So is that going to be the… the current operating agreement that we all operate under, that’s going to be the current… that’s going to be the operating agreement, going forward?

Morris: Until the rules get updated, yeah.

Hauth: And… okay.

Bird: Jerry Bird.

StevensonD: So…

Bird: Go ahead. I thought you was done.

StevensonD: Well, I just was… was going to say, you know, when… when the rules were submitted, the… the operating agreement was… was supposed to be part of the rules that were submitted, but I guess… I guess they weren’t. But, you know, they… they do need to be worked on and addressed because, currently the one that we have, and I’ve gotten opinions from a lot of people, is an illegal operating agreement. And I think that we need to… to get one written and get it submitted to RSA so… so it becomes part of the rules that they’re going to be passing or not passing. [Inaudible.]

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Randy, er, Art?

StevensonA: Okay. I… I do think this is very important and Jerry is now the Chair of the Rules Committee. Chair Miranda, I… I do believe that Mr. Bird can address those issues right away. And, as a matter of fact, if he does, it can go to RSA and I believe, because I’ve had discussions with Mr. Hartle, that he would address that issue right away. And, as a matter of fact, because I was part of the rule-making writing class put on by the State, that we could actually, if we play our cards right, have a different operating agreement in effect within the next two months, before we have to sign this… what Derrick said and I agree and, in fact, I’ve had a discussion with Mr. Hartle about it; he does believe that it is inappropriate and therefore I do believe he would address that issue. So, what I’m saying is, I believe the Elected Committee needs to address the new Rules Committee to get on that agenda item right away and we can resolve this issue fairly quickly.

Bird: Chair Miranda?

Miranda: Yes, Jerry?

Bird: Yeah, it could be possible. I agree with that. That’s been something that we’ve… as… as… actually, mine’s different than the rest of yours. Isn’t that cool? But, I… I believe, if you’d be willing to just add that as part of my duties as the handbook thing, I would appreciate it.

Miranda: Okay.

StevensonD: Well, we have to… we have to work in concert with Eric in writing these things. And, you know, I believe OCB’s the one who… who ultimately has to… has to send it to RSA. So, it’s got to go, you know… we have to… we have to write them. It’s probably going to have to go to the AG and then… before it’s even submitted. So, I might be wrong. Eric, you might have some… a different [inaudible]…

Miranda: Eric?

StevensonD: …to that.

Morris: What’s the question?

StevensonD: We need to work with you on getting these done. So, you know… ‘cause we can’t just do it ourselves and them submit them to RSA. We have to do it…

Bird: No!

StevensonD: …together.

Morris: Correct. The SLA has to send it to RSA.

Bird: I know. But that’s what I’m saying. We need to… we need to do research. We need to look into why don’t we even put together the… the operating agreement that we like? And I agree, they have to approve it. But, why… why not go in there with something that we’ve prepared. We know it’s legal and we can start with that as a basis. It might not… it’ll be a draft. And so that gives us a start. And I agree with you, Derrick. I mean, we can’t just arbitrarily say, “Okay, we pass this.” Because it’s an operating agreement with I’m not even sure how much, you know… I’m sure we ought to… we got to… we got at least to be participating in the decision on how that will be written. So, once again, I think if we… the idea of sub… special committees is to gather information, bring them to the Board and the membership, to bring up for discussion. Then we can make the decisions. But it’s a way of saving everybody some time, when you just get a few to draft it. And then, you know, of course… first it’s got to be approved by our Board, before it goes anywhere. And the membership…

StevensonA: Chair Miranda?

Bird: Thanks.

Miranda: Yes, Art?

StevensonA: Okay. I… I can say and, Jerry, I’d be glad to work with you on this. But, here’s the thing: I believe there’s a commission board meeting on December 3rd, 4th or 5th. I also believe that we can put together a draft. We can bring it to the committee. We can get it passed, make a recommendation for the OCB Board that… that they put forth the operating agreement to the AG’s office and it, in all actuality, Chair Miranda, can go to both the AG and RSA simultaneously. So, if we do this appropriately, we could get it done. So that would be my recommendation. And… and, Jerry, I would be glad to help you work with that since I was part of the rule-making process and all that other good stuff.

Hauth: Yeah, Chair Miranda, I know Eric is running for the bus, but I’d like to get an answer. So, Eric, will you be sending the operating agreement to all managers in December like you have each year?

Morris: Yeah.

Hauth: Okay. Thanks.

Miranda: Okay.

Morris: So…

StevensonD: I move that we adjourn.

Miranda: Next meeting. Are we looking at January?

StevensonD: I would… nah, I would probably prefer, based on everything that’s going on that we… I’d like to make a motion that we have monthly meetings for… for a while.

Miranda: Okay, what’s the last Thursday of December?

Morris: I think it’s the twenty…

Miranda: ‘Cause the holidays.

Morris: I think it’s the 22nd.

Miranda: Are you sure it’s not the 29th?

Morris: 29th is… yeah, the 29th is also a Thurs... yeah, it’s the last Thursday.

Miranda: Do you guys want to keep it the last Thursday of the month? Do them each month?

StevensonD: That’s fine with me.

Miranda: Okay.

Young: So then we just…

Miranda: The next meeting is December 29th at 3:30 and this meeting’s now adjourned. Thanks guys.

StevensonD: Thank you, everyone.

Bird: Thank you, everyone.

[02:12:40]

Transcription: Mark Riesmeyer